The Great Wall 2016

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When a mercenary warrior (Matt Damon) is imprisoned within the Great Wall, he discovers the mystery behind one of the greatest wonders of the world. As wave after wave of marauding beasts besiege the massive structure, his quest for fortune turns into a journey toward heroism as he joins a huge army of elite warriors to confront the unimaginable and seemingly unstoppable force. Written by Watch_Movies

Plot Summary | Plot Synopsis

Taglines: One of mankind's greatest wonders. 1700 years to build. 5500 miles long. What were they trying to keep out?

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Details

Release Date: 12 January 2017 (Germany) See more »

Also Known As: The Great Wall See more »

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Box Office

Budget: $150,000,000 (estimated)

Opening Weekend USA: $18,469,620, 19 February 2017, Wide Release

Gross USA: $45,540,830

Cumulative Worldwide Gross: $334,933,831

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Technical Specs

Runtime: 103 min

Aspect Ratio: 2.39 : The Great Wall 2016 1

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Trivia This was the second film Matt Damon and Pedro Pascal starred in together, the first being The Adjustment Bureau (2011). See more »

Goofs It is shown that all the Tao Tei froze when the queen died. But if they were all connected to her for the whole time she would not have to send orders to them explicitly. The queen is depicted more like a general sending orders to her army (and then the army obeys - seemingly independent from her) than a brain to an organism like it would be concluded from their freezing when she died. See more »

Quotes Commander Lin Mae: [about William] Men like him have many things they can teach us.
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Crazy Credits The Universal logo appears quicker than usual, and after appearing it zooms into China, going all the way to a section of the Great Wall and through a crack in the section. During the zoom the Legendary Pictures logo appears (in reverse). See more »

Alternate Versions This film will be released in the Mandarin language separately in English-speaking countries --- that is, at least Australia. Both English and Mandarin versions have been classified. See more »

Connections Featured in Tamara Just Saw: Tamara Just Saw The Great Wall (2017) See more »

Soundtracks At the Border
Vocal by Zhao Mu-Yang
Lyrics by Wang Changling
Melody by Leehom Wang
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[The Great Wall 2016]

نویسنده و منبع | تاریخ انتشار: Fri, 04 Jan 2019 21:03:00 +0000

The Great Wall 2016

Great Wall of China - Wikipedia

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"Great Wall" redirects here. The Great Wall 2016 For other uses, see Great Wall (disambiguation).

Great Wall of China

萬里長城

The Great Wall of China at Jinshanling

Map of all the wall constructions

General informationTypeFortificationCountryChinaCoordinates40°41′N 117°14′E / 40.68°N 117.23°ECoordinates: 40°41′N 117°14′E / 40.68°N 117.23°ETechnical detailsSize21,196 km (13,171 mi)[1]

UNESCO World Heritage Site

Official nameThe Great WallTypeCulturalCriteriai, ii, iii, iv, viDesignated1987 (11th session)Reference no.438State PartyChinaRegionAsia-PacificGreat Wall of ChinaSimplified Chinese长城Traditional Chinese長城Literal meaning"The Long Wall"TranscriptionsStandard MandarinHanyu PinyinChángchéngWade–GilesCh'ang2-ch'eng2IPA[ʈʂʰǎŋ.ʈʂʰə̌ŋ]WuRomanizationzan平 zen平Yue: CantoneseYale RomanizationCheung4 sing4IPA[tsʰœ̏ːŋ.sȅŋ]JyutpingCoeng4sing4Southern MinHokkien POJTn̂g-siâⁿTâi-lôTn̂g-siânnAlternative Chinese nameSimplified Chinese万里长城Traditional Chinese萬里長城Literal meaning"The 10,000-li Long Wall"TranscriptionsWuRomanizationVae去-li上 zan平-zen平Yue: CantoneseYale RomanizationMaan6lei5 Cheung4sing4IPA[màːn.le̬i tsʰœ̏ːŋ.sȅŋ]JyutpingMaan6-lei5 coeng4-sing4Southern MinTâi-lôBān-lí tn̂g-siânn

The Great Wall of China is a series of fortifications made of stone, brick, tamped earth, wood, and other materials, generally built along an east-to-west line across the historical northern borders of China to protect the Chinese states and empires against the raids and invasions of the various nomadic groups of the Eurasian Steppe with an eye to expansion. The Great Wall 2016 Several walls were being built as early as the 7th century BC;[2] these, later joined together and made bigger and stronger, are collectively referred to as the Great Wall.[3] Especially famous is the wall built in 220–206 BC by Qin Shi Huang, the first Emperor of China. Little of that wall remains. The Great Wall has been rebuilt, maintained, and enhanced over various dynasties; the majority of the existing wall is from the Ming Dynasty (1368–1644).

Apart from defense, other purposes of the Great Wall have included border controls, allowing the imposition of duties on goods transported along the Silk Road, regulation or encouragement of trade and the control of immigration and emigration. Furthermore, the defensive characteristics of the Great Wall were enhanced by the construction of watch towers, troop barracks, garrison stations, signaling capabilities through the means of smoke or fire, and the fact that the path of the Great Wall also served as a transportation corridor.

The frontier walls built by different dynasties have multiple courses. Collectively, they stretch from Dandong in the east to Lop Lake in the west, from present-day Sino-Russian border in the north to Qinghai in the south; along an arc that roughly delineates the edge of Mongolian steppe. A comprehensive archaeological survey, using advanced technologies, has concluded that the walls built by the Ming dynasty measure 8,850 km (5,500 mi).[4] This is made up of 6,259 km (3,889 mi) sections of actual wall, 359 km (223 mi) of trenches and 2,232 km (1,387 mi) of natural defensive barriers such as hills and rivers.[4] Another archaeological survey found that the entire wall with all of its branches measures out to be 21,196 km (13,171 mi).[5] Today, the Great Wall is generally recognized as one of the most impressive architectural feats in history.[6]

Names

The collection of fortifications known as the Great Wall of China has historically had a number of different names in both Chinese and English.

In Chinese histories, the term "Long Wall(s)" (長城, changcheng) appears in Sima Qian's Records of the Grand Historian, where it referred both to the separate great walls built between and north of the Warring States and to the more unified construction of the First Emperor.[7] The Chinese character 城 is a phono-semantic compound of the "place" or "earth" radical 土 and 成, whose Old Chinese pronunciation has been reconstructed as *deŋ.[8] It originally referred to the rampart which surrounded traditional Chinese cities and was used by extension for these walls around their respective states; today, however, it is much more often the Chinese word for "city".[9]

The longer Chinese name "Ten-Thousand Mile Long Wall" (萬里長城, Wanli Changcheng) came from Sima Qian's description of it in the Records, though he did not name the walls as such. The AD 493 Book of Song quotes the frontier general Tan Daoji referring to "the long wall of 10,000 miles", closer to the modern name, but the name rarely features in pre-modern times otherwise.[10] The traditional Chinese mile (里, lǐ) was an often irregular distance that was intended to show the length of a standard village and varied with terrain but was usually standardized at distances around a third of an English mile (540 m).[11] Since China's metrication in 1930, it has been exactly equivalent to 500 metres or 1,600 feet,[12] which would make the wall's name describe a distance of 5,000 km (3,100 mi). However, this use of "ten-thousand" (wàn) is figurative in a similar manner to the Greek and English myriad and simply means "innumerable" or "immeasurable".[13]

Because of the wall's association with the First Emperor's supposed tyranny, the Chinese dynasties after Qin usually avoided referring to their own additions to the wall by the name "Long Wall".[14] Instead, various terms were used in medieval records, including "frontier(s)" (塞, sāi),[15] "rampart(s)" (垣, yuán),[15] "barrier(s)" (障, zhàng),[15] "the outer fortresses" (外堡, wàibǎo),[16] and "the border wall(s)" (t 邊牆, s 边墙, biānqiáng).[14] Poetic and informal names for the wall included "the Purple Frontier" (紫塞, Zǐsāi)[17] and "the Earth Dragon" (t 土龍, s 土龙, Tǔlóng).[18] Only during the Qing period did "Long Wall" become the catch-all term to refer to the many border walls regardless of their location or dynastic origin, equivalent to the English "Great Wall".[19]

The current English name evolved from accounts of "the Chinese wall" from early modern European travelers.[19] By the 19th century,[19] "The Great Wall of China" had become standard in English, French, and German, although other European languages continue to refer to it as "the Chinese wall."[13]

History

Main article: History of the Great Wall of China

Early walls

The Great Wall of the Qin

The Great Wall of the Han

Further information: Great Wall of Qi

The Chinese were already familiar with the techniques of wall-building by the time of the Spring and Autumn period between the 8th and 5th centuries BC.[20] During this time and the subsequent Warring States period, the states of Qin, Wei, Zhao, Qi, Yan, and Zhongshan[21][22] all constructed extensive fortifications to defend their own borders. Built to withstand the attack of small arms such as swords and spears, these walls were made mostly by stamping earth and gravel between board frames.

King Zheng of Qin conquered the last of his opponents and unified China as the First Emperor of the Qin dynasty ("Qin Shi Huang") in 221 BC. Intending to impose centralized rule and prevent the resurgence of feudal lords, he ordered the destruction of the sections of the walls that divided his empire among the former states. To position the empire against the Xiongnu people from the north, however, he ordered the building of new walls to connect the remaining fortifications along the empire's northern frontier. "Build and move on" was a central guiding principle in constructing the wall, implying that the Chinese were not erecting a permanently fixed border.[23] Transporting the large quantity of materials required for construction was difficult, so builders always tried to use local resources. Stones from the mountains were used over mountain ranges, while rammed earth was used for construction in the plains. There are no surviving historical records indicating the exact length and course of the Qin walls. Most of the ancient walls have eroded away over the centuries, and very few sections remain today. The human cost of the construction is unknown, but it has been estimated by some authors that hundreds of thousands,[24] if not up to a million, workers died building the Qin wall.[25][26] Later, the Han,[27] the Sui, and the Northern dynasties all repaired, rebuilt, or expanded sections of the Great Wall at great cost to defend themselves against northern invaders.[28] The Tang and Song dynasties did not undertake any significant effort in the region.[28] The Liao, Jin, and Yuan dynasties, who ruled Northern China throughout most of the 10th–13th centuries, constructed defensive walls in the 12th century but those were located much to the north of the Great Wall as we know it, within China's province of Inner Mongolia and in Mongolia itself.[29]

Ming era

The extent of the Ming Empire and its walls

Main article: Ming Great Wall

The Great Wall concept was revived again under the Ming in the 14th century,[30] and following the Ming army's defeat by the Oirats in the Battle of Tumu. The Ming had failed to gain a clear upper hand over the Mongolian tribes after successive battles, and the long-drawn conflict was taking a toll on the empire. The Ming adopted a new strategy to keep the nomadic tribes out by constructing walls along the northern border of China. Acknowledging the Mongol control established in the Ordos Desert, the wall followed the desert's southern edge instead of incorporating the bend of the Yellow River.

Unlike the earlier fortifications, the Ming construction was stronger and more elaborate due to the use of bricks and stone instead of rammed earth. Up to 25,000 watchtowers are estimated to have been constructed on the wall.[31] As Mongol raids continued periodically over the years, the Ming devoted considerable resources to repair and reinforce the walls. Sections near the Ming capital of Beijing were especially strong.[32]Qi Jiguang between 1567 and 1570 also repaired and reinforced the wall, faced sections of the ram-earth wall with bricks and constructed 1,200 watchtowers from Shanhaiguan Pass to Changping to warn of approaching Mongol raiders.[33] During the 1440s–1460s, the Ming also built a so-called "Liaodong Wall". Similar in function to the Great Wall (whose extension, in a sense, it was), but more basic in construction, the Liaodong Wall enclosed the agricultural heartland of the Liaodong province, protecting it against potential incursions by Jurched-Mongol Oriyanghan from the northwest and the Jianzhou Jurchens from the north. While stones and tiles were used in some parts of the Liaodong Wall, most of it was in fact simply an earth dike with moats on both sides.[34]

Towards the end of the Ming, the Great Wall helped defend the empire against the Manchu invasions that began around 1600. Even after the loss of all of Liaodong, the Ming army held the heavily fortified Shanhai Pass, preventing the Manchus from conquering the Chinese heartland. The Manchus were finally able to cross the Great Wall in 1644, after Beijing had already fallen to Li Zicheng's rebels. Before this time, the Manchus had crossed the Great Wall multiple times to raid, but this time it was for conquest. The gates at Shanhai Pass were opened on May 25 by the commanding Ming general, Wu Sangui, who formed an alliance with the Manchus, hoping to use the Manchus to expel the rebels from Beijing.[35] The Manchus quickly seized Beijing, and eventually defeated both the rebel-founded Shun dynasty and the remaining Ming resistance, establishing the Qing dynasty rule over all of China.[36]

Under Qing rule, China's borders extended beyond the walls and Mongolia was annexed into the empire, so constructions on the Great Wall were discontinued. On the other hand, the so-called Willow Palisade, following a line similar to that of the Ming Liaodong Wall, was constructed by the Qing rulers in Manchuria. Its purpose, however, was not defense but rather to prevent Han Chinese migration into Manchuria.[37]

Foreign accounts

Part of the Great Wall of China (April 1853, X, p. 41)[38]

The Great Wall in 1907

None of the Europeans who visited Yuan China or Mongolia, such as Marco Polo, Giovanni da Pian del Carpine, William of Rubruck, Giovanni de' Marignolli and Odoric of Pordenone, mentioned the Great Wall.[39][40]

The North African traveler Ibn Battuta, who also visited China during the Yuan dynasty ca. 1346, had heard about China's Great Wall, possibly before he had arrived in China.[41] He wrote that the wall is "sixty days' travel" from Zeitun (modern Quanzhou) in his travelogue Gift to Those Who Contemplate the Wonders of Cities and the Marvels of Travelling. He associated it with the legend of the wall mentioned in the Qur'an,[42] which Dhul-Qarnayn (commonly associated with Alexander the Great) was said to have erected to protect people near the land of the rising sun from the savages of Gog and Magog. However, Ibn Battuta could find no one who had either seen it or knew of anyone who had seen it, suggesting that although there were remnants of the wall at that time, they weren't significant.[43]

Soon after Europeans reached Ming China by ship in the early 16th century, accounts of the Great Wall started to circulate in Europe, even though no European was to see it for another century. Possibly one of the earliest European descriptions of the wall and of its significance for the defense of the country against the "Tartars" (i.e. Mongols), may be the one contained in João de Barros's 1563 Asia.[44] Other early accounts in Western sources include those of Gaspar da Cruz, Bento de Goes, Matteo Ricci, and Bishop Juan González de Mendoza.[45] In 1559, in his work "A Treatise of China and the Adjoyning Regions," Gaspar da Cruz offers an early discussion of the Great Wall.[45] Perhaps the first recorded instance of a European actually entering China via the Great Wall came in 1605, when the Portuguese Jesuit brother Bento de Góis reached the northwestern Jiayu Pass from India.[46] Early European accounts were mostly modest and empirical, closely mirroring contemporary Chinese understanding of the Wall,[47] although later they slid into hyperbole,[48] including the erroneous but ubiquitous claim that the Ming Walls were the same ones that were built by the First Emperor in the 3rd century BC.[48]

When China opened its borders to foreign merchants and visitors after its defeat in the First and Second Opium Wars, the Great Wall became a main attraction for tourists. The travelogues of the later 19th century further enhanced the reputation and the mythology of the Great Wall,[49] such that in the 20th century, a persistent misconception exists about the Great Wall of China being visible from the Moon or even Mars.[50]

Course

The main sections of the Great Wall that are still standing today

An area of the sections of the Great Wall at Jinshanling

Although a formal definition of what constitutes a "Great Wall" has not been agreed upon, making the full course of the Great Wall difficult to describe in its entirety,[51] the course of the main Great Wall line following Ming constructions can be charted.

The Jiayu Pass, located in Gansu province, is the western terminus of the Ming Great Wall. Although Han fortifications such as Yumen Pass and the Yang Pass exist further west, the extant walls leading to those passes are difficult to trace. From Jiayu Pass the wall travels discontinuously down the Hexi Corridor and into the deserts of Ningxia, where it enters the western edge of the Yellow River loop at Yinchuan. Here the first major walls erected during the Ming dynasty cuts through the Ordos Desert to the eastern edge of the Yellow River loop. There at Piantou Pass (t 偏頭關, s 偏头关, Piāntóuguān) in Xinzhou, Shanxi province, the Great Wall splits in two with the "Outer Great Wall" (t 外長城, s 外长城, Wài Chǎngchéng) extending along the Inner Mongolia border with Shanxi into Hebei province, and the "inner Great Wall" (t 內長城, s 內长城, Nèi Chǎngchéng) running southeast from Piantou Pass for some 400 km (250 mi), passing through important passes like the Pingxing Pass and Yanmen Pass before joining the Outer Great Wall at Sihaiye (四海冶, Sìhǎiyě), in Beijing's Yanqing County.

The sections of the Great Wall around Beijing municipality are especially famous: they were frequently renovated and are regularly visited by tourists today. The Badaling Great Wall near Zhangjiakou is the most famous stretch of the Wall, for this is the first section to be opened to the public in the People's Republic of China, as well as the showpiece stretch for foreign dignitaries.[52] South of Badaling is the Juyong Pass; when used by the Chinese to protect their land, this section of the wall had many guards to defend China's capital Beijing. Made of stone and bricks from the hills, this portion of the Great Wall is 7.8 m (25 ft 7 in) high and 5 m (16 ft 5 in) wide.

One of the most striking sections of the Ming Great Wall is where it climbs extremely steep slopes in Jinshanling. There it runs 11 km (7 mi) long, ranges from 5 to 8 m (16 ft 5 in to 26 ft 3 in) in height, and 6 m (19 ft 8 in) across the bottom, narrowing up to 5 m (16 ft 5 in) across the top. Wangjinglou (t 望京樓, s 望京楼, Wàngjīng Lóu) is one of Jinshanling's 67 watchtowers, 980 m (3,220 ft) above sea level. Southeast of Jinshanling is the Mutianyu Great Wall which winds along lofty, cragged mountains from the southeast to the northwest for 2.25 km (1.40 mi). It is connected with Juyongguan Pass to the west and Gubeikou to the east. This section was one of the first to be renovated following the turmoil of the Cultural Revolution.[53]

At the edge of the Bohai Gulf is Shanhai Pass, considered the traditional end of the Great Wall and the "First Pass Under Heaven". The part of the wall inside Shanhai Pass that meets the sea is named the "Old Dragon Head". 3 km (2 mi) north of Shanhai Pass is Jiaoshan Great Wall (焦山長城), the site of the first mountain of the Great Wall.[54] 15 km (9 mi) northeast from Shanhaiguan is Jiumenkou (t 九門口, s 九门口, Jiǔménkǒu), which is the only portion of the wall that was built as a bridge. Beyond Jiumenkou, an offshoot known as the Liaodong Wall continues through Liaoning province and terminates at the Hushan Great Wall, in the city of Dandong near the North Korean border.[55]

In 2009, 180 km of previously unknown sections of the wall concealed by hills, trenches and rivers were discovered with the help of infrared range finders and GPS devices.[56] In March and April 2015 nine sections with a total length of more than 10 km (6 mi), believed to be part of the Great Wall, were discovered along the border of Ningxia autonomous region and Gansu province.[57]

Characteristics

The Great Wall at Mutianyu, near Beijing

Great Wall of China in tourist season

Before the use of bricks, the Great Wall was mainly built from rammed earth, stones, and wood. During the Ming, however, bricks were heavily used in many areas of the wall, as were materials such as tiles, lime, and stone. The size and weight of the bricks made them easier to work with than earth and stone, so construction quickened. Additionally, bricks could bear more weight and endure better than rammed earth. Stone can hold under its own weight better than brick, but is more difficult to use. Consequently, stones cut in rectangular shapes were used for the foundation, inner and outer brims, and gateways of the wall. Battlements line the uppermost portion of the vast majority of the wall, with defensive gaps a little over 30 cm (12 in) tall, and about 23 cm (9.1 in) wide. From the parapets, guards could survey the surrounding land.[58] Communication between the army units along the length of the Great Wall, including the ability to call reinforcements and warn garrisons of enemy movements, was of high importance. Signal towers were built upon hill tops or other high points along the wall for their visibility. Wooden gates could be used as a trap against those going through. Barracks, stables, and armories were built near the wall's inner surface.[58]

Condition

A more rural portion of the Great Wall that stretches throughout the mountains, here seen in slight disrepair

The Great Wall of China at Badaling

While portions north of Beijing and near tourist centers have been preserved and even extensively renovated, in many other locations the Wall is in disrepair. Those parts might serve as a village playground or a source of stones to rebuild houses and roads.[59] Sections of the Wall are also prone to graffiti and vandalism, while inscribed bricks were pilfered and sold on the market for up to 50 renminbi.[60] Parts have been destroyed because the Wall is in the way of construction.[61] A 2012 report by the State Administration of Cultural Heritage states that 22% of the Ming Great Wall has disappeared, while 1,961 km (1,219 mi) of wall have vanished.[60] More than 60 km (37 mi) of the wall in Gansu province may disappear in the next 20 years, due to erosion from sandstorms. In some places, the height of the wall has been reduced from more than 5 m (16 ft 5 in) to less than 2 m (6 ft 7 in). Various square lookout towers that characterize the most famous images of the wall have disappeared. Many western sections of the wall are constructed from mud, rather than brick and stone, and thus are more susceptible to erosion.[62] In 2014 a portion of the wall near the border of Liaoning and Hebei province was repaired with concrete. The work has been much criticized.[63]

Visibility from space misconception

From the Moon

One of the earliest known references to the myth that the Great Wall can be seen from the moon appears in a letter written in 1754 by the English antiquary William Stukeley. Stukeley wrote that, "This mighty wall [Hadrian's wall] of four score miles [130 km] in length is only exceeded by the Chinese Wall, which makes a considerable figure upon the terrestrial globe, and may be discerned at the Moon."[64] The claim was also mentioned by Henry Norman in 1895 where he states "besides its age it enjoys the reputation of being the only work of human hands on the globe visible from the Moon."[65] The issue of "canals" on Mars was prominent in the late 19th century and may have led to the belief that long, thin objects were visible from space. The claim that the Great Wall is visible from the moon also appears in 1932's Ripley's Believe It or Not! strip[66] and in Richard Halliburton's 1938 book Second Book of Marvels.

The claim that the Great Wall is visible from the moon has been debunked many times,[67] but is still ingrained in popular culture.[68] The wall is a maximum 9.1 m (29 ft 10 in) wide, and is about the same color as the soil surrounding it. Based on the optics of resolving power (distance versus the width of the iris: a few millimeters for the human eye, meters for large telescopes) only an object of reasonable contrast to its surroundings which is 110 km (70 mi) or more in diameter (1 arc-minute) would be visible to the unaided eye from the Moon, whose average distance from Earth is 384,393 km (238,851 mi). The apparent width of the Great Wall from the Moon is the same as that of a human hair viewed from 3 km (2 mi) away. To see the wall from the Moon would require spatial resolution 17,000 times better than normal (20/20) vision.[69] Unsurprisingly, no lunar astronaut has ever claimed to have seen the Great Wall from the Moon.

From low Earth orbit

A satellite image of a section of the Great Wall in northern Shanxi, running diagonally from lower left to upper right and not to be confused with the more prominent river running from upper left to lower right. The region pictured is 12 km × 12 km (7 mi × 7 mi).

A more controversial question is whether the Wall is visible from low Earth orbit (an altitude of as little as 160 km (100 mi)). NASA claims that it is barely visible, and only under nearly perfect conditions; it is no more conspicuous than many other man-made objects.[70] Other authors have argued that due to limitations of the optics of the eye and the spacing of photoreceptors on the retina, it is impossible to see the wall with the naked eye, even from low orbit, and would require visual acuity of 20/3 (7.7 times better than normal).[69]

Astronaut William Pogue thought he had seen it from Skylab but discovered he was actually looking at the Grand Canal of China near Beijing. He spotted the Great Wall with binoculars, but said that "it wasn't visible to the unaided eye." U.S. Senator Jake Garn claimed to be able to see the Great Wall with the naked eye from a space shuttle orbit in the early 1980s, but his claim has been disputed by several U.S. astronauts. Veteran U.S. astronaut Gene Cernan has stated: "At Earth orbit of 100 to 200 miles [160 to 320 km] high, the Great Wall of China is, indeed, visible to the naked eye." Ed Lu, Expedition 7 Science Officer aboard the International Space Station, adds that, "it's less visible than a lot of other objects. And you have to know where to look."

In 2001, Neil Armstrong stated about the view from Apollo 11: "I do not believe that, at least with my eyes, there would be any man-made object that I could see. I have not yet found somebody who has told me they've seen the Wall of China from Earth orbit. ... I've asked various people, particularly Shuttle guys, that have been many orbits around China in the daytime, and the ones I've talked to didn't see it."[71]

In October 2003, Chinese astronaut Yang Liwei stated that he had not been able to see the Great Wall of China. In response, the European Space Agency (ESA) issued a press release reporting that from an orbit between 160 and 320 km (100 and 200 mi), the Great Wall is visible to the naked eye. In an attempt to further clarify things, the ESA published a picture of a part of the "Great Wall" photographed from low orbit. However, in a press release a week later, they acknowledged that the "Great Wall" in the picture was actually a river.[69]

Leroy Chiao, a Chinese-American astronaut, took a photograph from the International Space Station that shows the wall. It was so indistinct that the photographer was not certain he had actually captured it. Based on the photograph, the China Daily later reported that the Great Wall can be seen from 'space' with the naked eye, under favorable viewing conditions, if one knows exactly where to look.[72] However, the resolution of a camera can be much higher than the human visual system, and the optics much better, rendering photographic evidence irrelevant to the issue of whether it is visible to the naked eye.[69]

Gallery

"The First Mound" – at Jiayuguan, the western terminus
The Great Wall of China at Badaling
The Juyongguan area of the Great Wall accepts numerous tourists each day
A portion of the Great Wall of China at Simatai, overlooking the gorge
Mutianyu Great Wall, China. This is atop the wall on a section that has not been restored
The Old Dragon Head, the Great Wall where it meets the sea in the vicinity of Shanhaiguan

Notes

^ "China's Great Wall Found To Measure More Than 20,000 Kilometers". Bloomberg. June 5, 2012. Retrieved June 6, 2012.

^ The New York Times with introduction by Sam Tanenhaus (2011). The New York Times Guide to Essential Knowledge: A Desk Reference for the Curious Mind. St. Martin's Press of Macmillan Publishers. p. 1131. ISBN 978-0-312-64302-7. Beginning as separate sections of fortification around the 7th century B.C.E and unified during the Qin Dynasty in the 3rd century B.C.E, this wall, built of earth and rubble with a facing of brick or stone, runs from east to west across China for over 4,000 miles.

^ "Great Wall of China". Encyclopædia Britannica. Large parts of the fortification system date from the 7th through the 4th century BC. In the 3rd century BC Shihuangdi (Qin Shi Huang), the first emperor of a united China (under the Qin dynasty), connected a number of existing defensive walls into a single system. Traditionally, the eastern terminus of the wall was considered to be Shanhai Pass (Shanhaiguan) in eastern Hebei province along the coast of the Bo Hai (Gulf of Chihli), and the wall's length—without its branches and other secondary sections—was thought to extend for some 6,690 km (4,160 mi).

^ a b "Great Wall of China 'even longer'". BBC. April 20, 2009. Retrieved April 20, 2009.

^ "Great Wall of China even longer than previously thought". Canadian Broadcasting Corporation. June 6, 2012. Retrieved June 6, 2012.

^ "Great Wall of China". History. April 20, 2009.

^ Waldron 1983, p. 650.

^ Baxter, William H. & al. (September 20, 2014). "Baxter–Sagart Old Chinese Reconstruction, Version 1.1" (PDF). Ann Arbor: University of Michigan. Retrieved January 22, 2015.

^ See Lovell 2006, p. 25

^ Waldron 1990, p. 202. Tan Daoji's exact quote: "So you would destroy your Great Wall of Ten Thousand Li!" (乃復壞汝萬里之長城) Note the use of the particle 之 zhi that differentiates the quote from the modern name.

^ Byron R. Winborn (1994). Wen Bon: a Naval Air Intelligence Officer behind Japanese lines in China. University of North Texas Press. p. 63. ISBN 978-0-929398-77-8.

^ "The Weights and Measures Act (1929)". The Legislative Yuan of the Republic of China. Archived from the original on April 25, 2014.

^ a b Lindesay, William (2007). The Great Wall Revisited: From the Jade Gate to Old Dragon's Head. Beijing: Wuzhou Publishing. p. 21. ISBN 978-7-5085-1032-3.

^ a b Waldron 1983, p. 651.

^ a b c Lovell 2006, p. 15.

^ Waldron 1990, p. 49.

^ Waldron 1990, p. 21.

^ Waldron 1988, p. 69.

^ a b c Hessler 2007, p. 59.

^ 歷代王朝修長城 (in Chinese). Chiculture.net. Retrieved October 24, 2010.

^ 古代长城 – 战争与和平的纽带 (in Chinese). Newsmth.net. Retrieved October 24, 2010.

^ 万里长城 (in Chinese). Newsmth.net. Retrieved October 24, 2010.

^ Burbank, Jane; Cooper, Frederick (2010). Empires in World History: Power and the Politics of Difference. Princeton, New Jersey: Princeton University Press. p. 45.

^ Slavicek, Mitchell & Matray 2005, p. 35.

^ Evans 2006, p. 3.

^ "Defense and Cost of The Great Wall – page 3". Paul and Bernice Noll's Window on the World. Retrieved July 26, 2011.

^ Coonan, Clifford (February 27, 2012). "British researcher discovers piece of Great Wall 'marooned outside China'". The Irish Times. Retrieved February 28, 2012.

^ a b Waldron 1983, p. 653.

^ Waldron 1983, p. 654; Haw 2006, pp. 52–54.

^ Karnow 2008, p. 192.

^ Szabó, Dávid & Loczy 2010, p. 220.

^ Evans 2006, p. 177.

^ "Great Wall at Mutianyu". Great Wall of China. Archived from the original on March 9, 2013.

^ Edmonds 1985, pp. 38–40.

^ Lovell 2006, p. 254.

^ Elliott 2001, pp. 1–2.

^ Elliott, Mark C. "The Limits of Tartary: Manchuria in Imperial and National Geographies." Journal of Asian Studies 59, no. 3 (2000): 603-46.

^ "Part of the Great Wall of China". The Wesleyan Juvenile Offering: A Miscellany of Missionary Information for Young Persons. X: 41. April 1853. Retrieved February 29, 2016.

^ Ruysbroek, Willem van (1900) [1255]. The Journey of William of Rubruck to the Eastern Parts of the World, 1253–55, as Narrated by Himself, with Two Accounts of the Earlier Journey of John of Pian de Carpine. Translated from the Latin by William Woodville Rockhill. London: The Hakluyt Society.

^ Haw 2006, pp. 53–54.

^ Haw 2006, pp. 54–55.

^ Qur'an, XVIII: "The Cave". English translations hosted at Wikisource include Maulana Muhammad Ali's, E.H. Palmer's, and the Progressive Muslims Organization's.

^ Haw 2006, pp. 53–55.

^ Barros, João de (1777) [1563]. Ásia de João de Barros: Dos feitos que os portugueses fizeram no descobrimento dos mares e terras do Oriente. V. Lisbon: Lisboa. 3a Década, pp. 186–204 (originally Vol. II, Ch. vii).

^ a b Waldron 1990, pp. 204–05.

^ Yule 1866, p. 579This section is the report of Góis's travel, as reported by Matteo Ricci in De Christiana expeditione apud Sinas (published 1615), annotated by Henry Yule).

^ Waldron 1990, pp. 2–4.

^ a b Waldron 1990, p. 206.

^ Waldron 1990, p. 209.

^ Waldron 1990, p. 214.

^ Hessler 2007, p. 60.

^ Rojas 2010, p. 140.

^ Lindesay 2008, p. 212.

^ "Jiaoshan Great Wall". TravelChinaGuide.com. Retrieved September 15, 2010. Jiaoshan Great Wall is located about 3 km (2 mi) from Shanhaiguan ancient city. It is named after Jiaoshan Mountain, which is the highest peak to the north of Shanhai Pass and also the first mountain the Great Wall climbs up after Shanhai Pass. Therefore Jiaoshan Mountain is noted as "The first mountain of the Great Wall".

^ "The Great Wall: Liaoning Province". Global Times. October 14, 2014. Retrieved December 4, 2014.

^ "Great Wall of China longer than believed as 180 missing miles found". The Guardian. Associated Press. April 20, 2009. Retrieved April 18, 2015.

^ "Newly-discovered remains redraw path of Great Wall". China Daily. April 15, 2015. Retrieved April 18, 2015.

^ a b Turnbull 2007, p. 29.

^ Ford, Peter (November 30, 2006). New law to keep China's Wall looking great. Christian Science Monitor, Asia Pacific section. Retrieved March 17, 2007.

^ a b Wong, Edward (June 29, 2015). "China Fears Loss of Great Wall, Brick by Brick". The New York Times. Retrieved July 1, 2015.

^ Bruce G. Doar: The Great Wall of China: Tangible, Intangible and Destructible. China Heritage Newsletter, China Heritage Project, Australian National University

^ "China's Wall becoming less and less Great". Reuters. August 29, 2007. Retrieved August 30, 2007.

^ CNN, Ben Westcott and Serenitie Wang (2016-09-21). "China's Great Wall covered in cement".

^ The Family Memoirs of the Rev. William Stukeley (1887) Vol. 3, p. 142. (1754).

^ Norman, Henry, The Peoples and Politics of the Far East, p. 215. (1895).

^ "The Great Wall of China, Ripley's Believe It or Not, 1932.

^ Urban Legends.com website. Accessed May 12, 2010.
"Can you see the Great Wall of China from the moon or outer space?", Answers.com. Accessed May 12, 2010.
Cecil Adams, "Is the Great wall of China the only manmade object byou can see from space?", The Straight Dope. Accessed May 12, 2010.
Snopes, "Great wall from space", last updated July 21, 2007. Accessed May 12, 2010.
"Is China's Great Wall Visible from Space?", Scientific American, February 21, 2008. "... the wall is only visible from low orbit under a specific set of weather and lighting conditions. And many other structures that are less spectacular from an earthly vantage point—desert roads, for example—appear more prominent from an orbital perspective."

^ "Metro Tescos", The Times (London), April 26, 2010. Found at The Times website. Accessed May 12, 2010.

^ a b c d López-Gil 2008, pp. 3–4.

^ "NASA – Great Wall of China". Nasa.gov. Retrieved July 31, 2010.

^ Dr. Stephen E. Ambrose; Dr. Douglas Brinkley (September 19, 2001). "Johnson Space Center Oral History Project Oral History Transcript – Neil Armstrong" (PDF). NASA. Retrieved July 31, 2010.

^ Markus, Francis. (April 19, 2005). Great Wall visible in space photo. BBC News, Asia-Pacific section. Retrieved March 17, 2007.

References

Edmonds, Richard Louis (1985). Northern Frontiers of Qing China and Tokugawa Japan: A Comparative Study of Frontier Policy. University of Chicago, Department of Geography; Research Paper No. 213. ISBN 978-0-89065-118-6.
Elliott, Mark C. (2001). The Manchu Way: The Eight Banners and Ethnic Identity in Late Imperial China. Stanford University Press. ISBN 978-0-8047-4684-7.
Evans, Thammy (2006). Great Wall of China: Beijing & Northern China. Bradt Travel Guide. Bradt Travel Guides. p. 3. ISBN 978-1-84162-158-6.
Haw, Stephen G. (2006). Marco Polo's China: a Venetian in the realm of Khubilai Khan. Volume 3 of Routledge studies in the early history of Asia. Psychology Press. ISBN 978-0-415-34850-8.
Hessler, Peter (2007). "Letter from China: Walking the Wall". The New Yorker (May 21, 2007): 58–67.
Karnow, Mooney, Paul and Catherine (2008). National Geographic Traveler: Beijing. National Geographic Books. p. 192. ISBN 978-1-4262-0231-5.
Lindesay, William (2008). The Great Wall Revisited: From the Jade Gate to Old Dragon's Head. Harvard University Press. ISBN 978-0-674-03149-4.
López-Gil, Norberto (2008). "Is it Really Possible to See the Great Wall of China from Space with a Naked Eye?" (PDF). Journal of Optometry. 1 (1): 3–4. doi:10.3921/joptom.2008.3. PMC 3972694. Archived from the original (PDF) on September 10, 2008.
Lovell, Julia (2006). The Great Wall : China against the world 1000 BC – AD 2000. Sydney: Picador Pan Macmillan. ISBN 978-0-330-42241-3.
Rojas, Carlos (2010). The Great Wall : a cultural history. Cambridge, Massachusetts: Harvard University Press. ISBN 978-0-674-04787-7.
Slavicek, Louise Chipley; Mitchell, George J.; Matray, James I. (2005). The Great Wall of China. Infobase Publishing. p. 35. ISBN 978-0-7910-8019-1.
Szabó, József; Dávid, Lóránt; Loczy, Denes, eds. (2010). Anthropogenic Geomorphology: A Guide to Man-made Landforms. Springer. ISBN 978-90-481-3057-3.
Turnbull, Stephen R (January 2007). The Great Wall of China 221 BC–AD 1644. Osprey Publishing. ISBN 978-1-84603-004-8.
Waldron, Arthur (1983). "The Problem of The Great Wall of China". Harvard Journal of Asiatic Studies. 43 (2): 643–63. JSTOR 2719110.
Waldron, Arthur (1988). "The Great Wall Myth: Its Origins and Role in Modern China". The Yale Journal of Criticism. 2 (1): 67–104.
Waldron, Arthur (1990). The Great Wall of China : from history to myth. Cambridge England New York: Cambridge University Press. ISBN 978-0-521-42707-4.
Yule, Sir Henry, ed. (1866). Cathay and the way thither: being a collection of medieval notices of China. Issues 36–37 of Works issued by the Hakluyt Society. Printed for the Hakluyt society.

External links

International Friends of the Great Wall – organization focused on conservation
UNESCO World Heritage Centre profile
Enthusiast/scholar website (in Chinese)
Great Wall of China on In Our Time at the BBC
Photoset of lesser visited areas of the Great Wall
Geographic data related to Great Wall of China at OpenStreetMap

The Great Wall 2016

Great Depression - Wikipedia

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This article is about the severe worldwide economic downturn in the 1930s. The Great Wall 2016 For other uses, see The Great Depression (disambiguation) and The Great Slump (disambiguation).

Dorothea Lange's Migrant Mother depicts destitute pea pickers in California, centering on Florence Owens Thompson, age 32, a mother of seven children, in Nipomo, California, March 1936.

USA annual real GDP from 1910 to 1960, with the years of the Great Depression (1929–1939) highlighted

The unemployment rate in the U.S. The Great Wall 2016 during 1910–60, with the years of the Great Depression (1929–39) highlighted

The Great Depression was a severe worldwide economic depression that took place mostly during the 1930s, beginning in the United States. The timing of the Great Depression varied across nations; in most countries it started in 1929 and lasted until the late-1930s.[1] It was the longest, deepest, and most widespread depression of the 20th century.[2] In the 21st century, the Great Depression is commonly used as an example of how intensely the world's economy can decline.[3]

The Great Depression started in the United States after a major fall in stock prices that began around September 4, 1929, and became worldwide news with the stock market crash of October 29, 1929 (known as Black Tuesday). Between 1929 and 1932, worldwide gross domestic product (GDP) fell by an estimated 15%. By comparison, worldwide GDP fell by less than 1% from 2008 to 2009 during the Great Recession.[4] Some economies started to recover by the mid-1930s. However, in many countries the negative effects of the Great Depression lasted until the beginning of World War II.[5]

The Great Depression had devastating effects in countries both rich and poor. Personal income, tax revenue, profits and prices dropped, while international trade plunged by more than 50%. Unemployment in the U.S. rose to 25% and in some countries rose as high as 33%.[6]

Cities around the world were hit hard, especially those dependent on heavy industry. Construction was virtually halted in many countries. Farming communities and rural areas suffered as crop prices fell by about 60%.[7][8][9] Facing plummeting demand with few alternative sources of jobs, areas dependent on primary sector industries such as mining and logging suffered the most.[10]

Start

See also: The Great Wall 2016 Timeline of the Great Depression

The Dow Jones Industrial, 1928–30

Economic historians usually attribute the start of the Great Depression to the sudden devastating collapse of U.S. stock market prices on October 29, 1929, known as Black Tuesday. However,[11] some dispute this conclusion and see the stock crash as a symptom, rather than a cause, of the Great Depression.[6][12]

Even after the Wall Street Crash of 1929 optimism persisted for some time. John D. Rockefeller said "These are days when many are discouraged. In the 93 years of my life, depressions have come and gone. Prosperity has always returned and will again."[13] The stock market turned upward in early 1930, returning to early 1929 levels by April. This was still almost 30% below the peak of September 1929.[14]

Together, government and business spent more in the first half of 1930 than in the corresponding period of the previous year. On the other hand, consumers, many of whom had suffered severe losses in the stock market the previous year, cut back their expenditures by 10%. In addition, beginning in the mid-1930s, a severe drought ravaged the agricultural heartland of the U.S.[15]

By mid-1930, interest rates had dropped to low levels, but expected deflation and the continuing reluctance of people to borrow meant that consumer spending and investment were depressed.[16] By May 1930, automobile sales had declined to below the levels of 1928. Prices in general began to decline, although wages held steady in 1930. Then a deflationary spiral started in 1931. Farmers faced a worse outlook; declining crop prices and a Great Plains drought crippled their economic outlook. At its peak, the Great Depression saw nearly 10% of all Great Plains farms change hands despite federal assistance.[17]

The decline in the U.S. economy was the factor that pulled down most other countries at first; then, internal weaknesses or strengths in each country made conditions worse or better. Frantic attempts to shore up the economies of individual nations through protectionist policies, such as the 1930 U.S. Smoot–Hawley Tariff Act and retaliatory tariffs in other countries, exacerbated the collapse in global trade.[18] By 1933, the economic decline had pushed world trade to one-third of its level just four years earlier.[19]

Economic indicators

Change in economic indicators 1929–32[20]

United States United Kingdom France Germany Industrial production −46% −23% −24% −41% Wholesale prices −32% −33% −34% −29% Foreign trade −70% −60% −54% −61% Unemployment +607% +129% +214% +232%

Causes

Main article: Causes of the Great Depression

Money supply decreased considerably between Black Tuesday and the Bank Holiday in March 1933 when there were massive bank runs across the United States.

Crowd gathering at the intersection of Wall Street and Broad Street after the 1929 crash

U.S. industrial production (1928–39)

The two classical competing theories of the Great Depression are the Keynesian (demand-driven) and the monetarist explanation. There are also various heterodox theories that downplay or reject the explanations of the Keynesians and monetarists. The consensus among demand-driven theories is that a large-scale loss of confidence led to a sudden reduction in consumption and investment spending. Once panic and deflation set in, many people believed they could avoid further losses by keeping clear of the markets. Holding money became profitable as prices dropped lower and a given amount of money bought ever more goods, exacerbating the drop in demand. Monetarists believe that the Great Depression started as an ordinary recession, but the shrinking of the money supply greatly exacerbated the economic situation, causing a recession to descend into the Great Depression.

Economists and economic historians are almost evenly split as to whether the traditional monetary explanation that monetary forces were the primary cause of the Great Depression is right, or the traditional Keynesian explanation that a fall in autonomous spending, particularly investment, is the primary explanation for the onset of the Great Depression.[21] Today the controversy is of lesser importance since there is mainstream support for the debt deflation theory and the expectations hypothesis that building on the monetary explanation of Milton Friedman and Anna Schwartz add non-monetary explanations.

There is consensus that the Federal Reserve System should have cut short the process of monetary deflation and banking collapse. If they had done this, the economic downturn would have been far less severe and much shorter.[22]

Mainstream explanations

Keynesian

British economist John Maynard Keynes argued in The General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money that lower aggregate expenditures in the economy contributed to a massive decline in income and to employment that was well below the average. In such a situation, the economy reached equilibrium at low levels of economic activity and high unemployment.

Keynes' basic idea was simple: to keep people fully employed, governments have to run deficits when the economy is slowing, as the private sector would not invest enough to keep production at the normal level and bring the economy out of recession. Keynesian economists called on governments during times of economic crisis to pick up the slack by increasing government spending and/or cutting taxes.

As the Depression wore on, Franklin D. Roosevelt tried public works, farm subsidies, and other devices to restart the U.S. economy, but never completely gave up trying to balance the budget. According to the Keynesians, this improved the economy, but Roosevelt never spent enough to bring the economy out of recession until the start of World War II.[23]

Monetarist

The Great Depression in the U.S. from a monetary view. Real gross domestic product in 1996-Dollar (blue), price index (red), money supply M2 (green) and number of banks (grey). All data adjusted to 1929 = 100%.

Crowd at New York's American Union Bank during a bank run early in the Great Depression

Monetarists follow the explanation given by Milton Friedman and Anna J. Schwartz. They argued that the Great Depression was caused by the banking crisis that caused one-third of all banks to vanish, a reduction of bank shareholder wealth and more importantly monetary contraction of 35%, which they called "The Great Contraction." This caused a price drop of 33% (deflation).[24] By not lowering interest rates, by not increasing the monetary base and by not injecting liquidity into the banking system to prevent it from crumbling, the Federal Reserve passively watched the transformation of a normal recession into the Great Depression. Friedman and Schwartz argued that the downward turn in the economy, starting with the stock market crash, would merely have been an ordinary recession if the Federal Reserve had taken aggressive action.[25][26] This view was endorsed by Fed Governor Ben Bernanke in a speech honoring Friedman and Schwartz with this statement:

Let me end my talk by abusing slightly my status as an official representative of the Federal Reserve. I would like to say to Milton and Anna: Regarding the Great Depression, you're right. We did it. We're very sorry. But thanks to you, we won't do it again.[27][28]
— Ben S. Bernanke

The Federal Reserve allowed some large public bank failures – particularly that of the New York Bank of United States – which produced panic and widespread runs on local banks, and the Federal Reserve sat idly by while banks collapsed. Friedman and Schwartz argued that, if the Fed had provided emergency lending to these key banks, or simply bought government bonds on the open market to provide liquidity and increase the quantity of money after the key banks fell, all the rest of the banks would not have fallen after the large ones did, and the money supply would not have fallen as far and as fast as it did.[29]

With significantly less money to go around, businesses could not get new loans and could not even get their old loans renewed, forcing many to stop investing. This interpretation blames the Federal Reserve for inaction, especially the New York branch.[30]

One reason why the Federal Reserve did not act to limit the decline of the money supply was the gold standard. At that time, the amount of credit the Federal Reserve could issue was limited by the Federal Reserve Act, which required 40% gold backing of Federal Reserve Notes issued. By the late 1920s, the Federal Reserve had almost hit the limit of allowable credit that could be backed by the gold in its possession. This credit was in the form of Federal Reserve demand notes.[31] A "promise of gold" is not as good as "gold in the hand", particularly when they only had enough gold to cover 40% of the Federal Reserve Notes outstanding. During the bank panics a portion of those demand notes were redeemed for Federal Reserve gold. Since the Federal Reserve had hit its limit on allowable credit, any reduction in gold in its vaults had to be accompanied by a greater reduction in credit. On April 5, 1933, President Roosevelt signed Executive Order 6102 making the private ownership of gold certificates, coins and bullion illegal, reducing the pressure on Federal Reserve gold.[31]

Common position

From the point of view of today's mainstream schools of economic thought, government should strive to keep the interconnected macroeconomic aggregates money supply and/or aggregate demand on a stable growth path. When threatened by the forecast of a depression central banks should pour liquidity into the banking system and the government should cut taxes and accelerate spending in order to keep the nominal money stock and total nominal demand from collapsing.[32] At the beginning of the Great Depression most economists believed in Say's law and the self-equilibrating powers of the market and failed to explain the severity of the Depression. Outright leave-it-alone liquidationism was a position mainly held by the Austrian School.[33] The liquidationist position was that a depression is good medicine. The idea was the benefit of a depression was to liquidate failed investments and businesses that have been made obsolete by technological development in order to release factors of production (capital and labor) from unproductive uses so that these could be redeployed in other sectors of the technologically dynamic economy. They argued that even if self-adjustment of the economy took mass bankruptcies, then so be it.[33] An increasingly common view among economic historians is that the adherence of some Federal Reserve policymakers to the liquidationist thesis led to disastrous consequences.[34] Regarding the policies of President Hoover, economists like Barry Eichengreen and J. Bradford DeLong point out that President Hoover tried to keep the federal budget balanced until 1932, when he lost confidence in his Secretary of the Treasury Andrew Mellon and replaced him.[33][34][35] Despite liquidationist expectations, a large proportion of the capital stock was not redeployed but vanished during the first years of the Great Depression. According to a study by Olivier Blanchard and Lawrence Summers, the recession caused a drop of net capital accumulation to pre-1924 levels by 1933.[36] Milton Friedman called the leave-it-alone liquidationism "dangerous nonsense".[32] He wrote:

I think the Austrian business-cycle theory has done the world a great deal of harm. If you go back to the 1930s, which is a key point, here you had the Austrians sitting in London, Hayek and Lionel Robbins, and saying you just have to let the bottom drop out of the world. You've just got to let it cure itself. You can't do anything about it. You will only make it worse. ... I think by encouraging that kind of do-nothing policy both in Britain and in the United States, they did harm.[34]

Modern non-monetary explanations

The monetary explanation has two weaknesses. First it is not able to explain why the demand for money was falling more rapidly than the supply during the initial downturn in 1930–31.[21] Second it is not able to explain why in March 1933 a recovery took place although short term interest rates remained close to zero and the Money supply was still falling. These questions are addressed by modern explanations that build on the monetary explanation of Milton Friedman and Anna Schwartz but add non-monetary explanations.

Debt deflation

Crowds outside the Bank of United States in New York after its failure in 1931

Irving Fisher argued that the predominant factor leading to the Great Depression was a vicious circle of deflation and growing over-indebtedness.[37] He outlined nine factors interacting with one another under conditions of debt and deflation to create the mechanics of boom to bust. The chain of events proceeded as follows:

Debt liquidation and distress selling

Contraction of the money supply as bank loans are paid off

A fall in the level of asset prices

A still greater fall in the net worth of businesses, precipitating bankruptcies

A fall in profits

A reduction in output, in trade and in employment

Pessimism and loss of confidence

Hoarding of money

A fall in nominal interest rates and a rise in deflation adjusted interest rates[37]

During the Crash of 1929 preceding the Great Depression, margin requirements were only 10%.[38] Brokerage firms, in other words, would lend $9 for every $1 an investor had deposited. When the market fell, brokers called in these loans, which could not be paid back.[39] Banks began to fail as debtors defaulted on debt and depositors attempted to withdraw their deposits en masse, triggering multiple bank runs. Government guarantees and Federal Reserve banking regulations to prevent such panics were ineffective or not used. Bank failures led to the loss of billions of dollars in assets.[39]

Outstanding debts became heavier, because prices and incomes fell by 20–50% but the debts remained at the same dollar amount. After the panic of 1929, and during the first 10 months of 1930, 744 U.S. banks failed. (In all, 9,000 banks failed during the 1930s). By April 1933, around $7 billion in deposits had been frozen in failed banks or those left unlicensed after the March Bank Holiday.[40] Bank failures snowballed as desperate bankers called in loans which the borrowers did not have time or money to repay. With future profits looking poor, capital investment and construction slowed or completely ceased. In the face of bad loans and worsening future prospects, the surviving banks became even more conservative in their lending.[39] Banks built up their capital reserves and made fewer loans, which intensified deflationary pressures. A vicious cycle developed and the downward spiral accelerated.

The liquidation of debt could not keep up with the fall of prices which it caused. The mass effect of the stampede to liquidate increased the value of each dollar owed, relative to the value of declining asset holdings. The very effort of individuals to lessen their burden of debt effectively increased it. Paradoxically, the more the debtors paid, the more they owed.[37] This self-aggravating process turned a 1930 recession into a 1933 great depression.

Fisher's debt-deflation theory initially lacked mainstream influence because of the counter-argument that debt-deflation represented no more than a redistribution from one group (debtors) to another (creditors). Pure re-distributions should have no significant macroeconomic effects.

Building on both the monetary hypothesis of Milton Friedman and Anna Schwartz as well as the debt deflation hypothesis of Irving Fisher, Ben Bernanke developed an alternative way in which the financial crisis affected output. He builds on Fisher's argument that dramatic declines in the price level and nominal incomes lead to increasing real debt burdens which in turn leads to debtor insolvency and consequently leads to lowered aggregate demand, a further decline in the price level then results in a debt deflationary spiral. According to Bernanke, a small decline in the price level simply reallocates wealth from debtors to creditors without doing damage to the economy. But when the deflation is severe falling asset prices along with debtor bankruptcies lead to a decline in the nominal value of assets on bank balance sheets. Banks will react by tightening their credit conditions, that in turn leads to a credit crunch which does serious harm to the economy. A credit crunch lowers investment and consumption and results in declining aggregate demand which additionally contributes to the deflationary spiral.[41][42][43]

Expectations hypothesis

Since economic mainstream turned to the new neoclassical synthesis, expectations are a central element of macroeconomic models. According to Peter Temin, Barry Wigmore, Gauti B. Eggertsson and Christina Romer, the key to recovery and to ending the Great Depression was brought about by a successful management of public expectations. The thesis is based on the observation that after years of deflation and a very severe recession important economic indicators turned positive in March 1933 when Franklin D. Roosevelt took office. Consumer prices turned from deflation to a mild inflation, industrial production bottomed out in March 1933, and investment doubled in 1933 with a turnaround in March 1933. There were no monetary forces to explain that turn around. Money supply was still falling and short term interest rates remained close to zero. Before March 1933 people expected further deflation and a recession so that even interest rates at zero did not stimulate investment. But when Roosevelt announced major regime changes people began to expect inflation and an economic expansion. With these positive expectations, interest rates at zero began to stimulate investment just as they were expected to do. Roosevelt's fiscal and monetary policy regime change helped to make his policy objectives credible. The expectation of higher future income and higher future inflation stimulated demand and investments. The analysis suggests that the elimination of the policy dogmas of the gold standard, a balanced budget in times of crises and small government led endogenously to a large shift in expectation that accounts for about 70–80 percent of the recovery of output and prices from 1933 to 1937. If the regime change had not happened and the Hoover policy had continued, the economy would have continued its free fall in 1933, and output would have been 30% lower in 1937 than in 1933.[44][45][46]

The recession of 1937–38, which slowed down economic recovery from the Great Depression, is explained by fears of the population that the moderate tightening of the monetary and fiscal policy in 1937 would be first steps to a restoration of the pre-March 1933 policy regime.[47]

Heterodox theories

Austrian School

Two prominent theorists in the Austrian School on the Great Depression include Austrian economist Friedrich Hayek and American economist Murray Rothbard, who wrote America's Great Depression (1963). In their view, much like the monetarists, the Federal Reserve (of which was created in 1913) shoulders much of the blame; however unlike the Monetarists, they argue that the key cause of the Depression was the expansion of the money supply in the 1920s, of which led to an unsustainable credit-driven boom.[48]

In the Austrian view it was this inflation of the money supply that led to an unsustainable boom in both asset prices (stocks and bonds) and capital goods. Therefore, by the time the Federal Reserve tightened in 1928 it was far too late to prevent an economic contraction.[48] In February 1929 Hayek published a paper predicting the Federal Reserve's actions would lead to a crisis starting in the stock and credit markets.[49]

According to Rothbard, the government support for failed enterprises and efforts to keep wages above their market values actually prolonged the Depression.[50] Unlike Rothbard, after 1970 Hayek believed that the Federal Reserve had further contributed to the problems of the Depression by permitting the money supply to shrink during the earliest years of the Depression.[51] However, during the Depression (in 1932[52] and in 1934)[52] Hayek had criticized both the Federal Reserve and the Bank of England for not taking a more contractionary stance.[52]

Hans Sennholz, another prominent Austrian economist, argued that most boom and busts that plagued the American economy, such as those in 1819–20, 1839–43, 1857–60, 1873–78, 1893–97, and 1920–21, were generated by government creating a boom through easy money and credit, which was soon followed by the inevitable bust. The spectacular crash of 1929 followed five years of reckless credit expansion by the Federal Reserve System under the Coolidge Administration. The passing of the Sixteenth Amendment, the passage of The Federal Reserve Act, rising government deficits, the passage of the Hawley-Smoot Tariff Act, and the Revenue Act of 1932, exacerbated and prolonged the crisis.[53]

Ludwig von Mises wrote in the 1930s: "Credit expansion cannot increase the supply of real goods. It merely brings about a rearrangement. It diverts capital investment away from the course prescribed by the state of economic wealth and market conditions. It causes production to pursue paths which it would not follow unless the economy were to acquire an increase in material goods. As a result, the upswing lacks a solid base. It is not a real prosperity. It is illusory prosperity. It did not develop from an increase in economic wealth, i.e. the accumulation of savings made available for productive investment. Rather, it arose because the credit expansion created the illusion of such an increase. Sooner or later, it must become apparent that this economic situation is built on sand."[54][55]

Inequality

Power farming displaces tenants from the land in the western dry cotton area. Childress County, Texas, 1938

Two economists of the 1920s, Waddill Catchings and William Trufant Foster, popularized a theory that influenced many policy makers, including Herbert Hoover, Henry A. Wallace, Paul Douglas, and Marriner Eccles. It held the economy produced more than it consumed, because the consumers did not have enough income. Thus the unequal distribution of wealth throughout the 1920s caused the Great Depression.[56][57]

According to this view, the root cause of the Great Depression was a global over-investment in heavy industry capacity compared to wages and earnings from independent businesses, such as farms. The proposed solution was for the government to pump money into the consumers' pockets. That is, it must redistribute purchasing power, maintaining the industrial base, and re-inflating prices and wages to force as much of the inflationary increase in purchasing power into consumer spending. The economy was overbuilt, and new factories were not needed. Foster and Catchings recommended[58] federal and state governments to start large construction projects, a program followed by Hoover and Roosevelt.

Productivity shock

It cannot be emphasized too strongly that the [productivity, output and employment] trends we are describing are long-time trends and were thoroughly evident prior to 1929. These trends are in nowise the result of the present depression, nor are they the result of the World War. On the contrary, the present depression is a collapse resulting from these long-term trends.[59]

— M. King Hubbert

The first three decades of the 20th century saw economic output surge with electrification, mass production and motorized farm machinery, and because of the rapid growth in productivity there was a lot of excess production capacity and the work week was being reduced.

The dramatic rise in productivity of major industries in the U.S. and the effects of productivity on output, wages and the work week are discussed by Spurgeon Bell in his book Productivity, Wages, and National Income (1940).[60]

Worsening of global depression

The gold standard was the primary transmission mechanism of the Great Depression. Even countries that did not face bank failures and a monetary contraction first hand were forced to join the deflationary policy since higher interest rates in countries that performed a deflationary policy led to a gold outflow in countries with lower interest rates. Under the gold standard's price–specie flow mechanism, countries that lost gold but nevertheless wanted to maintain the gold standard had to permit their money supply to decrease and the domestic price level to decline (deflation).[61][62]

There is also consensus that protectionist policies such as the Smoot–Hawley Tariff Act helped to worsen the depression.[63]

Gold standard

The Depression in international perspective[64]

Some economic studies have indicated that just as the downturn was spread worldwide by the rigidities of the Gold Standard, it was suspending gold convertibility (or devaluing the currency in gold terms) that did the most to make recovery possible.[65]

Every major currency left the gold standard during the Great Depression. The UK was the first to do so. Facing speculative attacks on the pound and depleting gold reserves, in September 1931 the Bank of England ceased exchanging pound notes for gold and the pound was floated on foreign exchange markets.

The UK, Japan, and the Scandinavian countries left the gold standard in 1931. Other countries, such as Italy and the US, remained on the gold standard into 1932 or 1933, while a few countries in the so-called "gold bloc", led by France and including Poland, Belgium and Switzerland, stayed on the standard until 1935–36.

According to later analysis, the earliness with which a country left the gold standard reliably predicted its economic recovery. For example, The UK and Scandinavia, which left the gold standard in 1931, recovered much earlier than France and Belgium, which remained on gold much longer. Countries such as China, which had a silver standard, almost avoided the depression entirely. The connection between leaving the gold standard as a strong predictor of that country's severity of its depression and the length of time of its recovery has been shown to be consistent for dozens of countries, including developing countries. This partly explains why the experience and length of the depression differed between national economies.[66]

Breakdown of international trade

Many economists have argued that the sharp decline in international trade after 1930 helped to worsen the depression, especially for countries significantly dependent on foreign trade. In a 1995 survey of American economic historians, two-thirds agreed that the Smoot–Hawley Tariff Act at least worsened the Great Depression.[67] Most historians and economists partly blame the American Smoot–Hawley Tariff Act (enacted June 17, 1930) for worsening the depression by seriously reducing international trade and causing retaliatory tariffs in other countries. While foreign trade was a small part of overall economic activity in the U.S. and was concentrated in a few businesses like farming, it was a much larger factor in many other countries.[68] The average ad valorem rate of duties on dutiable imports for 1921–25 was 25.9% but under the new tariff it jumped to 50% during 1931–35. In dollar terms, American exports declined over the next four (4) years from about $5.2 billion in 1929 to $1.7 billion in 1933; so, not only did the physical volume of exports fall, but also the prices fell by about 1/3 as written. Hardest hit were farm commodities such as wheat, cotton, tobacco, and lumber.

Governments around the world took various steps into spending less money on foreign goods such as: "imposing tariffs, import quotas, and exchange controls". These restrictions formed a lot of tension between trade nations, causing a major deduction during the depression. Not all countries enforced the same measures of protectionism. Some countries raised tariffs drastically and enforced severe restrictions on foreign exchange transactions, while other countries condensed "trade and exchange restrictions only marginally":[69]

"Countries that remained on the gold standard, keeping currencies fixed, were more likely to restrict foreign trade." These countries "resorted to protectionist policies to strengthen the balance of payments and limit gold losses." They hoped that these restrictions and depletions would hold the economic decline.[69]
Countries that abandoned the gold standard, allowed their currencies to depreciate which caused their balance of payments to strengthen. It also freed up monetary policy so that central banks could lower interest rates and act as lenders of last resort. They possessed the best policy instruments to fight the Depression and did not need protectionism.[69]
"The length and depth of a country’s economic downturn and the timing and vigor of its recovery is related to how long it remained on the gold standard. Countries abandoning the gold standard relatively early experienced relatively mild recessions and early recoveries. In contrast, countries remaining on the gold standard experienced prolonged slumps."[69]

Effect of tariffs

German banking crisis of 1931 and British crisis

The financial crisis escalated out of control in mid-1931, starting with the collapse of the Credit Anstalt in Vienna in May.[73][74] This put heavy pressure on Germany, which was already in political turmoil. With the rise in violence of Nazi and communist movements, as well as investor nervousness at harsh government financial policies.[75] Investors withdrew their short-term money from Germany, as confidence spiraled downward. The Reichsbank lost 150 million marks in the first week of June, 540 million in the second, and 150 million in two days, June 19–20. Collapse was at hand. U.S. President Herbert Hoover called for a moratorium on Payment of war reparations. This angered Paris, which depended on a steady flow of German payments, but it slowed the crisis down and the moratorium, was agreed to in July 1931. An International conference in London later in July produced no agreements but on August 19 a standstill agreement froze Germany's foreign liabilities for six months. Germany received emergency funding from private banks in New York as well as the Bank of International Settlements and the Bank of England. The funding only slowed the process. Industrial failures began in Germany, a major bank closed in July and a two-day holiday for all German banks was declared. Business failures were more frequent in July, and spread to Romania and Hungary. The crisis continued to get worse in Germany, bringing political upheaval that finally led to the coming to power of Hitler's Nazi regime in January 1933.[76]

The world financial crisis now began to overwhelm Britain; investors across the world started withdrawing their gold from London at the rate of £2.5 million per day.[77] Credits of £25 millions each from the Bank of France and the Federal Reserve Bank of New York and an issue of £15 millions fiduciary note slowed, but did not reverse the British crisis. The financial crisis now caused a major political crisis in Britain in August 1931. With deficits mounting, the bankers demanded a balanced budget; the divided cabinet of Prime Minister Ramsay MacDonald's Labour government agreed; it proposed to raise taxes, cut spending and most controversially, to cut unemployment benefits 20%. The attack on welfare was totally unacceptable to the Labour movement. MacDonald wanted to resign, but King George V insisted he remain and form an all-party coalition "National government." The Conservative and Liberals parties signed on, along with a small cadre of Labour, but the vast majority of Labour leaders denounced MacDonald as a traitor for leading the new government. Britain went off the gold standard, and suffered relatively less than other major countries in the Great Depression. In the 1931 British election the Labour Party was virtually destroyed, leaving MacDonald as Prime Minister for a largely Conservative coalition.[78][79]

Turning point and recovery

The overall course of the Depression in the United States, as reflected in per-capita GDP (average income per person) shown in constant year 2000 dollars, plus some of the key events of the period. Dotted red line = long term trend 1920–1970.[80]

In most countries of the world, recovery from the Great Depression began in 1933.[11] In the US, recovery began in early 1933,[11] but the U.S. did not return to 1929 GNP for over a decade and still had an unemployment rate of about 15% in 1940, albeit down from the high of 25% in 1933.

There is no consensus among economists regarding the motive force for the U.S. economic expansion that continued through most of the Roosevelt years (and the 1937 recession that interrupted it). The common view among most economists is that Roosevelt's New Deal policies either caused or accelerated the recovery, although his policies were never aggressive enough to bring the economy completely out of recession. Some economists have also called attention to the positive effects from expectations of reflation and rising nominal interest rates that Roosevelt's words and actions portended.[81][82] It was the rollback of those same reflationary policies that led to the interruption of a recession beginning in late 1937.[83][84] One contributing policy that reversed reflation was the Banking Act of 1935, which effectively raised reserve requirements, causing a monetary contraction that helped to thwart the recovery.[85] GDP returned to its upward trend in 1938.[80]

According to Christina Romer, the money supply growth caused by huge international gold inflows was a crucial source of the recovery of the United States economy, and that the economy showed little sign of self-correction. The gold inflows were partly due to devaluation of the U.S. dollar and partly due to deterioration of the political situation in Europe.[86] In their book, A Monetary History of the United States, Milton Friedman and Anna J. Schwartz also attributed the recovery to monetary factors, and contended that it was much slowed by poor management of money by the Federal Reserve System. Former Chairman of the Federal Reserve Ben Bernanke agreed that monetary factors played important roles both in the worldwide economic decline and eventual recovery.[87] Bernanke also saw a strong role for institutional factors, particularly the rebuilding and restructuring of the financial system,[88] and pointed out that the Depression should be examined in an international perspective.[89]

Role of women and household economics

Women's primary role were as housewives; without a steady flow of family income, their work became much harder in dealing with food and clothing and medical care. Birthrates fell everywhere, as children were postponed until families could financially support them. The average birthrate for 14 major countries fell 12% from 19.3 births per thousand population in 1930, to 17.0 in 1935.[90] In Canada, half of Roman Catholic women defied Church teachings and used contraception to postpone births.[91]

Among the few women in the labor force, layoffs were less common in the white-collar jobs and they were typically found in light manufacturing work. However, there was a widespread demand to limit families to one paid job, so that wives might lose employment if their husband was employed.[92][93][94] Across Britain, there was a tendency for married women to join the labor force, competing for part-time jobs especially.[95]

In rural and small-town areas, women expanded their operation of vegetable gardens to include as much food production as possible. In the United States, agricultural organizations sponsored programs to teach housewives how to optimize their gardens and to raise poultry for meat and eggs.[96] In American cities, African American women quiltmakers enlarged their activities, promoted collaboration, and trained neophytes. Quilts were created for practical use from various inexpensive materials and increased social interaction for women and promoted camaraderie and personal fulfillment.[97]

Oral history provides evidence for how housewives in a modern industrial city handled shortages of money and resources. Often they updated strategies their mothers used when they were growing up in poor families. Cheap foods were used, such as soups, beans and noodles. They purchased the cheapest cuts of meat—sometimes even horse meat—and recycled the Sunday roast into sandwiches and soups. They sewed and patched clothing, traded with their neighbors for outgrown items, and made do with colder homes. New furniture and appliances were postponed until better days. Many women also worked outside the home, or took boarders, did laundry for trade or cash, and did sewing for neighbors in exchange for something they could offer. Extended families used mutual aid—extra food, spare rooms, repair-work, cash loans—to help cousins and in-laws.[98]

In Japan, official government policy was deflationary and the opposite of Keynesian spending. Consequently, the government launched a nationwide campaign to induce households to reduce their consumption, focusing attention on spending by housewives.[99]

In Germany, the government tried to reshape private household consumption under the Four-Year Plan of 1936 to achieve German economic self-sufficiency. The Nazi women's organizations, other propaganda agencies and the authorities all attempted to shape such consumption as economic self-sufficiency was needed to prepare for and to sustain the coming war. The organizations, propaganda agencies and authorities employed slogans that called up traditional values of thrift and healthy living. However, these efforts were only partly successful in changing the behavior of housewives.[100]

World War II and recovery

A female factory worker in 1942, Fort Worth, Texas. Women entered the workforce as men were drafted into the armed forces.

The common view among economic historians is that the Great Depression ended with the advent of World War II. Many economists believe that government spending on the war caused or at least accelerated recovery from the Great Depression, though some consider that it did not play a very large role in the recovery. It did help in reducing unemployment.[11][101][102][103]

The rearmament policies leading up to World War II helped stimulate the economies of Europe in 1937–39. By 1937, unemployment in Britain had fallen to 1.5 million. The mobilization of manpower following the outbreak of war in 1939 ended unemployment.[104]

When the United States entered into the war in 1941, it finally eliminated the last effects from the Great Depression and brought the U.S. unemployment rate down below 10%.[105] In the US, massive war spending doubled economic growth rates, either masking the effects of the Depression or essentially ending the Depression. Businessmen ignored the mounting national debt and heavy new taxes, redoubling their efforts for greater output to take advantage of generous government contracts.

Effects

An impoverished American family living in a shanty, 1936

The majority of countries set up relief programs and most underwent some sort of political upheaval, pushing them to the right. Many of the countries in Europe and Latin America that were democracies saw them overthrown by some form of dictatorship or authoritarian rule, most famously in Germany in 1933. The Dominion of Newfoundland gave up democracy voluntarily.

Australia

Main article: Great Depression in Australia

Australia's dependence on agricultural and industrial exports meant it was one of the hardest-hit developed countries.[106] Falling export demand and commodity prices placed massive downward pressures on wages. Unemployment reached a record high of 29% in 1932,[107] with incidents of civil unrest becoming common.[108] After 1932, an increase in wool and meat prices led to a gradual recovery.[109]

Canada

Main article: Great Depression in Canada

Unemployed men march in Toronto, Ontario, Canada.

Harshly affected by both the global economic downturn and the Dust Bowl, Canadian industrial production had fallen to only 58% of the 1929 level by 1932, the second lowest level in the world after the United States, and well behind nations such as Britain, which fell to only 83% of the 1929 level. Total national income fell to 56% of the 1929 level, again worse than any nation apart from the United States. Unemployment reached 27% at the depth of the Depression in 1933.[110]

Chile

Main article: Great Depression in Chile

The League of Nations labeled Chile the country hardest hit by the Great Depression because 80% of government revenue came from exports of copper and nitrates, which were in low demand. Chile initially felt the impact of the Great Depression in 1930, when GDP dropped 14%, mining income declined 27%, and export earnings fell 28%. By 1932, GDP had shrunk to less than half of what it had been in 1929, exacting a terrible toll in unemployment and business failures.

Influenced profoundly by the Great Depression, many national leaders promoted the development of local industry in an effort to insulate the economy from future external shocks. After six years of government austerity measures, which succeeded in reestablishing Chile's creditworthiness, Chileans elected to office during the 1938–58 period a succession of center and left-of-center governments interested in promoting economic growth by means of government intervention.

Prompted in part by the devastating 1939 Chillán earthquake, the Popular Front government of Pedro Aguirre Cerda created the Production Development Corporation (Corporación de Fomento de la Producción, CORFO) to encourage with subsidies and direct investments an ambitious program of import substitution industrialization. Consequently, as in other Latin American countries, protectionism became an entrenched aspect of the Chilean economy.

China

Main article: Nanjing Decade

China was largely unaffected by the Depression, mainly by having stuck to the Silver standard. However, the U.S. silver purchase act of 1934 created an intolerable demand on China's silver coins, and so in the end the silver standard was officially abandoned in 1935 in favor of the four Chinese national banks' "legal note" issues. China and the British colony of Hong Kong, which followed suit in this regard in September 1935, would be the last to abandon the silver standard. In addition, the Nationalist Government also acted energetically to modernize the legal and penal systems, stabilize prices, amortize debts, reform the banking and currency systems, build railroads and highways, improve public health facilities, legislate against traffic in narcotics and augment industrial and agricultural production. On November 3, 1935, the government instituted the fiat currency (fapi) reform, immediately stabilizing prices and also raising revenues for the government.

European African colonies

The sharp fall in commodity prices, and the steep decline in exports, hurt the economies of the European colonies in Africa and Asia.[111][112] The agricultural sector was especially hard hit. For example, sisal had recently become a major export crop in Kenya and Tanganyika. During the depression it suffered severely from low prices and marketing problems that affected all colonial commodities in Africa. Sisal producers established centralized controls for the export of their fibre.[113] There was widespread unemployment and hardship among peasants, labourers, colonial auxiliaries, and artisans.[114] The budgets of colonial governments were cut, which forced the reduction in ongoing infrastructure projects, such as the building and upgrading of roads, ports and communications.[115] The budget cuts delayed the schedule for creating systems of higher education.[116]

The depression severely hurt the export-based Belgian Congo economy because of the drop in international demand for raw materials and for agricultural products. For example, the price of peanuts fell from 125 to 25 centimes. In some areas, as in the Katanga mining region, employment declined by 70%. In the country as a whole, the wage labour force decreased by 72.000 and many men returned to their villages. In Leopoldville, the population decreased by 33%, because of this labour migration.[117]

Political protests were not common. However, there was a growing demand that the paternalistic claims be honored by colonial governments to respond vigorously. The theme was that economic reforms were more urgently needed than political reforms.[118] French West Africa launched an extensive program of educational reform centered around "rural schools" designed to modernize agriculture and stem the flow of under-employed farm workers to cites where unemployment was high. Students were trained in traditional arts, crafts, and farming techniques and were then expected to return to their own villages and towns.[119]

France

Main article: Great Depression in France

The crisis affected France a bit later than other countries, hitting hard around 1931.[120] While the 1920s grew at the very strong rate of 4.43% per year, the 1930s rate fell to only 0.63%.[121]

The depression was relatively mild: unemployment peaked under 5%, the fall in production was at most 20% below the 1929 output; there was no banking crisis.[122]

However, the depression had drastic effects on the local economy, and partly explains the February 6, 1934 riots and even more the formation of the Popular Front, led by SFIO socialist leader Léon Blum, which won the elections in 1936. Ultra-nationalist groups also saw increased popularity, although democracy prevailed into World War II.

France's relatively high degree of self-sufficiency meant the damage was considerably less than in nations like Germany.

Germany

Main article: Weimar Republic

Adolf Hitler speaking in 1935

The Great Depression hit Germany hard. The impact of the Wall Street Crash forced American banks to end the new loans that had been funding the repayments under the Dawes Plan and the Young Plan. The financial crisis escalated out of control and mid-1931, starting with the collapse of the Credit Anstalt in Vienna in May.[74] This put heavy pressure on Germany, which was already in political turmoil with the rise in violence of Nazi and communist movements, as well as with investor nervousness at harsh government financial policies.[75] Investors withdrew their short-term money from Germany, as confidence spiraled downward. The Reichsbank lost 150 million marks in the first week of June, 540 million in the second, and 150 million in two days, June 19–20. Collapse was at hand. U.S. President Herbert Hoover called for a moratorium on Payment of war reparations. This angered Paris, which depended on a steady flow of German payments, but it slowed the crisis down and the moratorium, was agreed to in July 1931. An international conference in London later in July produced no agreements but on August 19 a standstill agreement froze Germany's foreign liabilities for six months. Germany received emergency funding from private banks in New York as well as the Bank of International Settlements and the Bank of England. The funding only slowed the process. Industrial failures began in Germany, a major bank closed in July and a two-day holiday for all German banks was declared. Business failures became more frequent in July, and spread to Romania and Hungary.[76]

In 1932, 90% of German reparation payments were cancelled. (In the 1950s, Germany repaid all its missed reparations debts.) Widespread unemployment reached 25% as every sector was hurt. The government did not increase government spending to deal with Germany's growing crisis, as they were afraid that a high-spending policy could lead to a return of the hyperinflation that had affected Germany in 1923. Germany's Weimar Republic was hit hard by the depression, as American loans to help rebuild the German economy now stopped.[123] The unemployment rate reached nearly 30% in 1932, bolstering support for the Nazi (NSDAP) and Communist (KPD) parties, causing the collapse of the politically centrist Social Democratic Party. Hitler ran for the Presidency in 1932, and while he lost to the incumbent Hindenburg in the election, it marked a point during which both Nazi Party and the Communist parties rose in the years following the crash to altogether possess a Reichstag majority following the general election in July 1932.[124][125]

Hitler followed an autarky economic policy, creating a network of client states and economic allies in central Europe and Latin America. By cutting wages and taking control of labor unions, plus public works spending, unemployment fell significantly by 1935. Large-scale military spending played a major role in the recovery.[126]

Greece

Main article: Economic history of Greece and the Greek world

The reverberations of the Great Depression hit Greece in 1932. The Bank of Greece tried to adopt deflationary policies to stave off the crises that were going on in other countries, but these largely failed. For a brief period the drachma was pegged to the U.S. dollar, but this was unsustainable given the country's large trade deficit and the only long-term effects of this were Greece's foreign exchange reserves being almost totally wiped out in 1932. Remittances from abroad declined sharply and the value of the drachma began to plummet from 77 drachmas to the dollar in March 1931 to 111 drachmas to the dollar in April, 1931. This was especially harmful to Greece as the country relied on imports from the UK, France and the Middle East for many necessities. Greece went off the gold standard in April, 1932 and declared a moratorium on all interest payments. The country also adopted protectionist policies such as import quotas, which a number of European countries did during the time period.

Protectionist policies coupled with a weak drachma, stifling imports, allowed Greek industry to expand during the Great Depression. In 1939, Greek Industrial output was 179% that of 1928. These industries were for the most part "built on sand" as one report of the Bank of Greece put it, as without massive protection they would not have been able to survive. Despite the global depression, Greece managed to suffer comparatively little, averaging an average growth rate of 3.5% from 1932 to 1939. The dictatorial regime of Ioannis Metaxas took over the Greek government in 1936, and economic growth was strong in the years leading up to the Second World War.

Iceland

Icelandic post-World War I prosperity came to an end with the outbreak of the Great Depression. The Depression hit Iceland hard as the value of exports plummeted. The total value of Icelandic exports fell from 74 million kronur in 1929 to 48 million in 1932, and was not to rise again to the pre-1930 level until after 1939.[127] Government interference in the economy increased: "Imports were regulated, trade with foreign currency was monopolized by state-owned banks, and loan capital was largely distributed by state-regulated funds".[127] Due to the outbreak of the Spanish Civil War, which cut Iceland's exports of saltfish by half, the Depression lasted in Iceland until the outbreak of World War II (when prices for fish exports soared).[127]

India

Main article: Great Depression in India

How much India was affected has been hotly debated. Historians have argued that the Great Depression slowed long-term industrial development.[128] Apart from two sectors—jute and coal—the economy was little affected. However, there were major negative impacts on the jute industry, as world demand fell and prices plunged.[129] Otherwise conditions were fairly stable. Local markets in agriculture and small-scale industry showed modest gains.[130]

Ireland

Main article: Economic history of the Republic of Ireland

Frank Barry and Mary E. Daly have argued that:

Ireland was a largely agrarian economy, trading almost exclusively with the UK, at the time of the Great Depression. Beef and dairy products comprised the bulk of exports, and Ireland fared well relative to many other commodity producers, particularly in the early years of the depression.[131][132][133][134]

Italy

Main article: Economic history of Italy

The Great Depression hit Italy very hard.[135] As industries came close to failure they were bought out by the banks in a largely illusionary bail-out—the assets used to fund the purchases were largely worthless. This led to a financial crisis peaking in 1932 and major government intervention. The Industrial Reconstruction Institute (IRI) was formed in January 1933 and took control of the bank-owned companies, suddenly giving Italy the largest state-owned industrial sector in Europe (excluding the USSR). IRI did rather well with its new responsibilities—restructuring, modernising and rationalising as much as it could. It was a significant factor in post-1945 development. But it took the Italian economy until 1935 to recover the manufacturing levels of 1930—a position that was only 60% better than that of 1913.[136][137]

Japan

The Great Depression did not strongly affect Japan. The Japanese economy shrank by 8% during 1929–31. Japan's Finance Minister Takahashi Korekiyo was the first to implement what have come to be identified as Keynesian economic policies: first, by large fiscal stimulus involving deficit spending; and second, by devaluing the currency. Takahashi used the Bank of Japan to sterilize the deficit spending and minimize resulting inflationary pressures. Econometric studies have identified the fiscal stimulus as especially effective.[138]

The devaluation of the currency had an immediate effect. Japanese textiles began to displace British textiles in export markets. The deficit spending proved to be most profound and went into the purchase of munitions for the armed forces. By 1933, Japan was already out of the depression. By 1934, Takahashi realized that the economy was in danger of overheating, and to avoid inflation, moved to reduce the deficit spending that went towards armaments and munitions.

This resulted in a strong and swift negative reaction from nationalists, especially those in the army, culminating in his assassination in the course of the February 26 Incident. This had a chilling effect on all civilian bureaucrats in the Japanese government. From 1934, the military's dominance of the government continued to grow. Instead of reducing deficit spending, the government introduced price controls and rationing schemes that reduced, but did not eliminate inflation, which remained a problem until the end of World War II.

The deficit spending had a transformative effect on Japan. Japan's industrial production doubled during the 1930s. Further, in 1929 the list of the largest firms in Japan was dominated by light industries, especially textile companies (many of Japan's automakers, such as Toyota, have their roots in the textile industry). By 1940 light industry had been displaced by heavy industry as the largest firms inside the Japanese economy.[139]

Latin America

Main article: Great Depression in Latin America

Because of high levels of U.S. investment in Latin American economies, they were severely damaged by the Depression. Within the region, Chile, Bolivia and Peru were particularly badly affected.[140]

Before the 1929 crisis, links between the world economy and Latin American economies had been established through American and British investment in Latin American exports to the world. As a result, Latin Americans export industries felt the depression quickly. World prices for commodities such as wheat, coffee and copper plunged. Exports from all of Latin America to the U.S. fell in value from $1.2 billion in 1929 to $335 million in 1933, rising to $660 million in 1940.

But on the other hand, the depression led the area governments to develop new local industries and expand consumption and production. Following the example of the New Deal, governments in the area approved regulations and created or improved welfare institutions that helped millions of new industrial workers to achieve a better standard of living.

Netherlands

Main article: Great Depression in the Netherlands

From roughly 1931 to 1937, the Netherlands suffered a deep and exceptionally long depression. This depression was partly caused by the after-effects of the Stock Market Crash of 1929 in the US, and partly by internal factors in the Netherlands. Government policy, especially the very late dropping of the Gold Standard, played a role in prolonging the depression. The Great Depression in the Netherlands led to some political instability and riots, and can be linked to the rise of the Dutch national-socialist party NSB. The depression in the Netherlands eased off somewhat at the end of 1936, when the government finally dropped the Gold Standard, but real economic stability did not return until after World War II.[141]

New Zealand

Main article: History of New Zealand § Great Depression

New Zealand was especially vulnerable to worldwide depression, as it relied almost entirely on agricultural exports to the United Kingdom for its economy. The drop in exports led to a lack of disposable income from the farmers, who were the mainstay of the local economy. Jobs disappeared and wages plummeted, leaving people desperate and charities unable to cope. Work relief schemes were the only government support available to the unemployed, the rate of which by the early 1930s was officially around 15%, but unofficially nearly twice that level (official figures excluded Māori and women). In 1932, riots occurred among the unemployed in three of the country's main cities (Auckland, Dunedin, and Wellington). Many were arrested or injured through the tough official handling of these riots by police and volunteer "special constables".[142]

Portugal

Main article: Economic history of Portugal

Already under the rule of a dictatorial junta, the Ditadura Nacional, Portugal suffered no turbulent political effects of the Depression, although António de Oliveira Salazar, already appointed Minister of Finance in 1928 greatly expanded his powers and in 1932 rose to Prime Minister of Portugal to found the Estado Novo, an authoritarian corporatist dictatorship. With the budget balanced in 1929, the effects of the depression were relaxed through harsh measures towards budget balance and autarky, causing social discontent but stability and, eventually, an impressive economic growth.[143]

Puerto Rico

In the years immediately preceding the depression, negative developments in the island and world economies perpetuated an unsustainable cycle of subsistence for many Puerto Rican workers. The 1920s brought a dramatic drop in Puerto Rico's two primary exports, raw sugar and coffee, due to a devastating hurricane in 1928 and the plummeting demand from global markets in the latter half of the decade. 1930 unemployment on the island was roughly 36% and by 1933 Puerto Rico's per capita income dropped 30% (by comparison, unemployment in the United States in 1930 was approximately 8% reaching a height of 25% in 1933).[144][145] To provide relief and economic reform, the United States government and Puerto Rican politicians such as Carlos Chardon and Luis Munoz Marin created and administered first the Puerto Rico Emergency Relief Administration (PRERA) 1933 and then in 1935, the Puerto Rico Reconstruction Administration (PRRA).[146]

South Africa

Main article: Great Depression in South Africa

As world trade slumped, demand for South African agricultural and mineral exports fell drastically. The Carnegie Commission on Poor Whites had concluded in 1931 that nearly one third of Afrikaners lived as paupers. The social discomfort caused by the depression was a contributing factor in the 1933 split between the "gesuiwerde" (purified) and "smelter" (fusionist) factions within the National Party and the National Party's subsequent fusion with the South African Party.[147][148] Unemployment programs were begun that focused primarily on the white population.[149]

Soviet Union

The Soviet Union was the world's sole communist state with very little international trade. Its economy was not tied to the rest of the world and was only slightly affected by the Great Depression.[150] Its forced transformation from a rural to an industrial society succeeded in building up heavy industry, at the cost of millions of lives in rural Russia and Ukraine.[151]

At the time of the Depression, the Soviet economy was growing steadily, fuelled by intensive investment in heavy industry. The apparent economic success of the Soviet Union at a time when the capitalist world was in crisis led many Western intellectuals to view the Soviet system favorably. Jennifer Burns wrote:

As the Great Depression ground on and unemployment soared, intellectuals began unfavorably comparing their faltering capitalist economy to Russian Communism. ... More than ten years after the Revolution, Communism was finally reaching full flower, according to New York Times reporter Walter Duranty, a Stalin fan who vigorously debunked accounts of the Ukraine famine, a man-made disaster that would leave millions dead."[152]

Despite all of this, The Great Depression caused mass immigration to the Soviet Union, mostly from Finland and Germany. Soviet Russia was at first happy to help these immigrants settle, because they believed they were victims of capitalism who had come to help the Soviet cause. However, when the Soviet Union entered the war in 1941, most of these Germans and Finns were arrested and sent to Siberia, while their Russian-born children were placed in orphanages. Their fate is unknown.[153]

Spain

Main article: Economic history of Spain

Spain had a relatively isolated economy, with high protective tariffs and was not one of the main countries affected by the Depression. The banking system held up well, as did agriculture.[154]

By far the most serious negative impact came after 1936 from the heavy destruction of infrastructure and manpower by the civil war, 1936–39. Many talented workers were forced into permanent exile. By staying neutral in the Second World War, and selling to both sides, the economy avoided further disasters.[155]

Sweden

Main article: Economy of Sweden

By the 1930s, Sweden had what America's Life magazine called in 1938 the "world's highest standard of living". Sweden was also the first country worldwide to recover completely from the Great Depression. Taking place in the midst of a short-lived government and a less-than-a-decade old Swedish democracy, events such as those surrounding Ivar Kreuger (who eventually committed suicide) remain infamous in Swedish history. The Social Democrats under Per Albin Hansson formed their first long-lived government in 1932 based on strong interventionist and welfare state policies, monopolizing the office of Prime Minister until 1976 with the sole and short-lived exception of Axel Pehrsson-Bramstorp's "summer cabinet" in 1936. During forty years of hegemony, it was the most successful political party in the history of Western liberal democracy.[156]

Thailand

In Thailand, then known as the Kingdom of Siam, the Great Depression contributed to the end of the absolute monarchy of King Rama VII in the Siamese revolution of 1932.

United Kingdom

Main articles: Great Depression in the United Kingdom and Interwar Britain

Unemployed people in front of a workhouse in London, 1930

The World Depression broke at a time when the United Kingdom had still not fully recovered from the effects of the First World War more than a decade earlier. The country was driven off the gold standard in 1931.

The world financial crisis began to overwhelm Britain in 1931; investors across the world started withdrawing their gold from London at the rate of £2.5 million per day.[77] Credits of £25 millions each from the Bank of France and the Federal Reserve Bank of New York and an issue of £15 millions fiduciary note slowed, but did not reverse the British crisis. The financial crisis now caused a major political crisis in Britain in August 1931. With deficits mounting, the bankers demanded a balanced budget; the divided cabinet of Prime Minister Ramsay MacDonald's Labour government agreed; it proposed to raise taxes, cut spending and most controversially, to cut unemployment benefits by 20%. The attack on welfare was totally unacceptable to the Labour movement. MacDonald wanted to resign, but King George V insisted he remain and form an all-party coalition "National Government". The Conservative and Liberals parties signed on, along with a small cadre of Labour, but the vast majority of Labour leaders denounced MacDonald as a traitor for leading the new government. Britain went off the gold standard, and suffered relatively less than other major countries in the Great Depression. In the 1931 British election, the Labour Party was virtually destroyed, leaving MacDonald as Prime Minister for a largely Conservative coalition.[157][79]

The effects on the northern industrial areas of Britain were immediate and devastating, as demand for traditional industrial products collapsed. By the end of 1930 unemployment had more than doubled from 1 million to 2.5 million (20% of the insured workforce), and exports had fallen in value by 50%. In 1933, 30% of Glaswegians were unemployed due to the severe decline in heavy industry. In some towns and cities in the north east, unemployment reached as high as 70% as shipbuilding fell by 90%.[158] The National Hunger March of September–October 1932 was the largest[159] of a series of hunger marches in Britain in the 1920s and 1930s. About 200,000 unemployed men were sent to the work camps, which continued in operation until 1939.[160]

In the less industrial Midlands and Southern England, the effects were short-lived and the later 1930s were a prosperous time. Growth in modern manufacture of electrical goods and a boom in the motor car industry was helped by a growing southern population and an expanding middle class. Agriculture also saw a boom during this period.[161]

United States

Main articles: Great Depression in the United States and New Deal

Unemployed men queued outside a depression soup kitchen in Chicago 1931.

Hoover's first measures to combat the depression were based on voluntarism by businesses not to reduce their workforce or cut wages. But businesses had little choice and wages were reduced, workers were laid off, and investments postponed.[162][163]

In June 1930 Congress approved the Smoot–Hawley Tariff Act which raised tariffs on thousands of imported items. The intent of the Act was to encourage the purchase of American-made products by increasing the cost of imported goods, while raising revenue for the federal government and protecting farmers. Other nations increased tariffs on American-made goods in retaliation, reducing international trade, and worsening the Depression.[164]

In 1931, Hoover urged bankers to set up the National Credit Corporation[165] so that big banks could help failing banks survive. But bankers were reluctant to invest in failing banks, and the National Credit Corporation did almost nothing to address the problem.[166]

Shacks on the Anacostia flats, Washington, D.C. put up by the Bonus Army (World War I veterans) burning after the battle with the 1,000 soldiers accompanied by tanks and machine guns, 1932[167]

By 1932, unemployment had reached 23.6%, peaking in early 1933 at 25%.[168] Drought persisted in the agricultural heartland, businesses and families defaulted on record numbers of loans, and more than 5,000 banks had failed.[169] Hundreds of thousands of Americans found themselves homeless, and began congregating in shanty towns – dubbed "Hoovervilles" – that began to appear across the country.[170] In response, President Hoover and Congress approved the Federal Home Loan Bank Act, to spur new home construction, and reduce foreclosures. The final attempt of the Hoover Administration to stimulate the economy was the passage of the Emergency Relief and Construction Act (ERA) which included funds for public works programs such as dams and the creation of the Reconstruction Finance Corporation (RFC) in 1932. The Reconstruction Finance Corporation was a Federal agency with the authority to lend up to $2 billion to rescue banks and restore confidence in financial institutions. But $2 billion was not enough to save all the banks, and bank runs and bank failures continued.[162] Quarter by quarter the economy went downhill, as prices, profits and employment fell, leading to the political realignment in 1932 that brought to power Franklin Delano Roosevelt. It is important to note, however, that after volunteerism failed, Hoover developed ideas that laid the framework for parts of the New Deal.

Buried machinery in a barn lot; South Dakota, May 1936. The Dust Bowl on the Great Plains coincided with the Great Depression.[171]

Shortly after President Franklin Delano Roosevelt was inaugurated in 1933, drought and erosion combined to cause the Dust Bowl, shifting hundreds of thousands of displaced persons off their farms in the Midwest. From his inauguration onward, Roosevelt argued that restructuring of the economy would be needed to prevent another depression or avoid prolonging the current one. New Deal programs sought to stimulate demand and provide work and relief for the impoverished through increased government spending and the institution of financial reforms.

During a "bank holiday" that lasted five days, the Emergency Banking Act was signed into law. It provided for a system of reopening sound banks under Treasury supervision, with federal loans available if needed. The Securities Act of 1933 comprehensively regulated the securities industry. This was followed by the Securities Exchange Act of 1934 which created the Securities and Exchange Commission. Although amended, key provisions of both Acts are still in force. Federal insurance of bank deposits was provided by the FDIC, and the Glass–Steagall Act.

The Agricultural Adjustment Act provided incentives to cut farm production in order to raise farming prices. The National Recovery Administration (NRA) made a number of sweeping changes to the American economy. It forced businesses to work with government to set price codes through the NRA to fight deflationary "cut-throat competition" by the setting of minimum prices and wages, labor standards, and competitive conditions in all industries. It encouraged unions that would raise wages, to increase the purchasing power of the working class. The NRA was deemed unconstitutional by the Supreme Court of the United States in 1935.

CCC workers constructing road, 1933. Over 3 million unemployed young men were taken out of the cities and placed into 2,600+ work camps managed by the CCC.[172]

These reforms, together with several other relief and recovery measures, are called the First New Deal. Economic stimulus was attempted through a new alphabet soup of agencies set up in 1933 and 1934 and previously extant agencies such as the Reconstruction Finance Corporation. By 1935, the "Second New Deal" added Social Security (which was later considerably extended through the Fair Deal), a jobs program for the unemployed (the Works Progress Administration, WPA) and, through the National Labor Relations Board, a strong stimulus to the growth of labor unions. In 1929, federal expenditures constituted only 3% of the GDP. The national debt as a proportion of GNP rose under Hoover from 20% to 40%. Roosevelt kept it at 40% until the war began, when it soared to 128%.

By 1936, the main economic indicators had regained the levels of the late 1920s, except for unemployment, which remained high at 11%, although this was considerably lower than the 25% unemployment rate seen in 1933. In the spring of 1937, American industrial production exceeded that of 1929 and remained level until June 1937. In June 1937, the Roosevelt administration cut spending and increased taxation in an attempt to balance the federal budget.[173] The American economy then took a sharp downturn, lasting for 13 months through most of 1938. Industrial production fell almost 30 per cent within a few months and production of durable goods fell even faster. Unemployment jumped from 14.3% in 1937 to 19.0% in 1938, rising from 5 million to more than 12 million in early 1938.[174] Manufacturing output fell by 37% from the 1937 peak and was back to 1934 levels.[175]

The WPA employed 2–3 million at unskilled labor.

Producers reduced their expenditures on durable goods, and inventories declined, but personal income was only 15% lower than it had been at the peak in 1937. As unemployment rose, consumers' expenditures declined, leading to further cutbacks in production. By May 1938 retail sales began to increase, employment improved, and industrial production turned up after June 1938.[176] After the recovery from the Recession of 1937–38, conservatives were able to form a bipartisan conservative coalition to stop further expansion of the New Deal and, when unemployment dropped to 2% in the early 1940s, they abolished WPA, CCC and the PWA relief programs. Social Security remained in place.

Between 1933 and 1939, federal expenditure tripled, and Roosevelt's critics charged that he was turning America into a socialist state.[177] The Great Depression was a main factor in the implementation of social democracy and planned economies in European countries after World War II (see Marshall Plan). Keynesianism generally remained the most influential economic school in the United States and in parts of Europe until the periods between the 1970s and the 1980s, when Milton Friedman and other neoliberal economists formulated and propagated the newly created theories of neoliberalism and incorporated them into the Chicago School of Economics as an alternative approach to the study of economics. Neoliberalism went on to challenge the dominance of the Keynesian school of Economics in the mainstream academia and policy-making in the United States, having reached its peak in popularity in the election of the presidency of Ronald Reagan in the United States, and Margaret Thatcher in the United Kingdom.[178]

Literature

And the great owners, who must lose their land in an upheaval, the great owners with access to history, with eyes to read history and to know the great fact: when property accumulates in too few hands it is taken away. And that companion fact: when a majority of the people are hungry and cold they will take by force what they need. And the little screaming fact that sounds through all history: repression works only to strengthen and knit the repressed.

–John Steinbeck, The Grapes of Wrath[179]

The Great Depression has been the subject of much writing, as authors have sought to evaluate an era that caused both financial and emotional trauma. Perhaps the most noteworthy and famous novel written on the subject is The Grapes of Wrath, published in 1939 and written by John Steinbeck, who was awarded both the Nobel Prize for literature and the Pulitzer Prize for the work. The novel focuses on a poor family of sharecroppers who are forced from their home as drought, economic hardship, and changes in the agricultural industry occur during the Great Depression. Steinbeck's Of Mice and Men is another important novella about a journey during the Great Depression. Additionally, Harper Lee's To Kill a Mockingbird is set during the Great Depression. Margaret Atwood's Booker prize-winning The Blind Assassin is likewise set in the Great Depression, centering on a privileged socialite's love affair with a Marxist revolutionary. The era spurred the resurgence of social realism, practiced by many who started their writing careers on relief programs, especially the Federal Writers' Project in the U.S.[180][181][182][183]

A number of works for younger audiences are also set during the Great Depression, among them the Kit Kittredge series of American Girl books written by Valerie Tripp and illustrated by Walter Rane, released to tie in with the dolls and playsets sold by the company. The stories, which take place during the early to mid 1930s in Cincinnati, focuses on the changes brought by the Depression to the titular character's family and how the Kittredges dealt with it.[184] A theatrical adaptation of the series entitled Kit Kittredge: An American Girl was later released in 2008 to positive reviews.[185][186] Similarly, Christmas After All, part of the Dear America series of books for older girls, take place in 1930s Indianapolis; while Kit Kittredge is told in a third-person viewpoint, Christmas After All is in the form of a fictional journal as told by the protagonist Minnie Swift as she recounts her experiences during the era, especially when her family takes in an orphan cousin from Texas.[187]

Naming

Further information: Depression (economics)

The term "The Great Depression" is most frequently attributed to British economist Lionel Robbins, whose 1934 book The Great Depression is credited with formalizing the phrase,[188] though Hoover is widely credited with popularizing the term,[188][189] informally referring to the downturn as a depression, with such uses as "Economic depression cannot be cured by legislative action or executive pronouncement" (December 1930, Message to Congress), and "I need not recount to you that the world is passing through a great depression" (1931).

Black Friday, 9 May 1873, Vienna Stock Exchange. The Panic of 1873 and Long Depression followed.

The term "depression" to refer to an economic downturn dates to the 19th century, when it was used by varied Americans and British politicians and economists. Indeed, the first major American economic crisis, the Panic of 1819, was described by then-president James Monroe as "a depression",[188] and the most recent economic crisis, the Depression of 1920–21, had been referred to as a "depression" by then-president Calvin Coolidge.

Financial crises were traditionally referred to as "panics", most recently the major Panic of 1907, and the minor Panic of 1910–11, though the 1929 crisis was called "The Crash", and the term "panic" has since fallen out of use. At the time of the Great Depression, the term "The Great Depression" was already used to refer to the period 1873–96 (in the United Kingdom), or more narrowly 1873–79 (in the United States), which has retroactively been renamed the Long Depression.[190]

Other "great depressions"

Other economic downturns have been called a "great depression", but none had been as widespread, or lasted for so long. Various nations have experienced brief or extended periods of economic downturns, which were referred to as "depressions", but none have had such a widespread global impact.

The collapse of the Soviet Union, and the breakdown of economic ties which followed, led to a severe economic crisis and catastrophic fall in the standards of living in the 1990s in post-Soviet states and the former Eastern Bloc,[191] which was even worse than the Great Depression.[192][193] Even before Russia's financial crisis of 1998, Russia's GDP was half of what it had been in the early 1990s,[193] and some populations are still poorer as of 2009 than they were in 1989, including Moldova, Central Asia, and the Caucasus.

Comparison with the Great Recession

Main article: Comparisons between the Great Recession and the Great Depression

The worldwide economic decline after 2008 has been compared to the 1930s.[194][195][196][197][198]

The causes of the Great Recession seem similar to the Great Depression, but significant differences exist. The previous chairman of the Federal Reserve, Ben Bernanke, had extensively studied the Great Depression as part of his doctoral work at MIT, and implemented policies to manipulate the money supply and interest rates in ways that were not done in the 1930s. Generally speaking, the recovery of the world's financial systems tended to be quicker during the Great Depression of the 1930s as opposed to the late-2000s recession.

If we contrast the 1930s with the Crash of 2008 where gold went through the roof, it is clear that the U.S. dollar on the gold standard was a completely different animal in comparison to the fiat free-floating U.S. dollar currency we have today. Both currencies in 1929 and 2008 were the U.S. dollar, but in an analogous way it is as if one was a Saber-toothed tiger and the other is a Bengal tiger; they are two completely different animals. Where we have experienced inflation since the Crash of 2008, the situation was much different in the 1930s when deflation set in. Unlike the deflation of the early 1930s, the U.S. economy currently appears to be in a "liquidity trap," or a situation where monetary policy is unable to stimulate an economy back to health.

In terms of the stock market, nearly three years after the 1929 crash, the DJIA dropped 8.4% on August 12, 1932. Where we have experienced great volatility with large intraday swings in the past two months, in 2011, we have not experienced any record-shattering daily percentage drops to the tune of the 1930s. Where many of us may have that '30s feeling, in light of the DJIA, the CPI, and the national unemployment rate, we are simply not living in the '30s. Some individuals may feel as if we are living in a depression, but for many others the current global financial crisis simply does not feel like a depression akin to the 1930s.[199]

1928 and 1929 were the times in the 20th century that the wealth gap reached such skewed extremes;[200] half the unemployed had been out of work for over six months, something that was not repeated until the late-2000s recession. 2007 and 2008 eventually saw the world reach new levels of wealth gap inequality that rivalled the years of 1928 and 1929.

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^ Dorfman 1959

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^ The Road to Plenty (1928)

^ Hubbert, M. King (1940). "Man Hours and Distribution, Derived from Man Hours: A Declining Quantity, Technocracy, Series A, No. 8, August 1936".

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^ Peter Temin, Gianni Toniolo, The World Economy between the Wars, Oxford University Press, 2008, ISBN 978-0198042013, p. 106

^ Randall E. Parker, Reflections on the Great Depression, Elgar publishing, 2003, ISBN 978-1843763352, p. 22.

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^ Eichengreen, Barry (1992). Golden Fetters: The Gold Standard and the Great Depression, 1919–1939. New York: Oxford University Press. ISBN 0195064313.

^ Bernanke, Ben (March 2, 2004). "Remarks by Governor Ben S. Bernanke: Money, Gold and the Great Depression". At the H. Parker Willis Lecture in Economic Policy, Washington and Lee University, Lexington, Virginia.

^ Robert Whaples, "Where Is There Consensus Among American Economic Historians? The Results of a Survey on Forty Propositions", Journal of Economic History, Vol. 55, No. 1 (Mar. 1995), pp. 139–54 in JSTOR

^ "The World in Depression". Mount Holyoke College. Archived from the original on March 10, 2008. Retrieved 2008-05-22.

^ a b c d Eichengreen, B. & Irwin, D.A. (2010). The Slide to Protectionism in the Great Depression: Who Succumbed and Why?. Journal of Economic History, 70(4), 871–97.

^ Whaples, Robert (March 1995). "Where Is There Consensus Among American Economic Historians? The Results of a Survey on Forty Propositions" (PDF). The Journal of Economic History. Cambridge University Press. 55 (1): 144. doi:10.1017/S0022050700040602. JSTOR 2123771 – via JSTOR. (Registration required (help)).

^ Protectionism and the Great Depression, Paul Krugman, New York Times, November 30, 2009

^ The protectionist temptation: Lessons from the Great Depression for today, VOX, Barry Eichengreen, Douglas Irwin, 17 March 2009

^ Charles Loch Mowat, Britain between the wars, 1918–1940 (1955) pp. 379–85.

^ a b William Ashworth, A short history of the international economy since 1850 (2nd ed 1962) pp. 237–44.

^ a b Isabel Schnabel, "The German twin crisis of 1931." Journal of Economic History 64#3 (2004): 822–871.

^ a b H.V. Hodson, Slump and Recovery, 1929–1937 (London, 1938), pp. 64–76.

^ a b David Williams, "London and the 1931 financial crisis." Economic History Review 15.3 (1963): 513–528.

^ Mowat, Britain between the wars, 1918–1940 (1955) pp. 386–412.

^ a b Sean Glynn and John Oxborrow, Interwar Britain : a social and economic history (1976) pp. 67–73.

^ a b Per-capita GDP data from MeasuringWorth: What Was the U.S. GDP Then?

^ Gauti B. Eggertsson, "Great Expectations and the End of the Depression," American Economic Review 98, No. 4 (Sep 2008): 1476–1516

^ "Was the New Deal Contractionary?" Federal Reserve Bank of New York Staff Report 264, Oct 2006, Gauti B. Eggertsson

^ "The Mistake of 1937: A General Equilibrium Analysis," Monetary and Economic Studies 24, No. S-1 (December 2006), Boj.or.jp

^ Gauti B. Eggertsson, "A Reply to Steven Horwitz's Commentary on 'Great Expectations and the End of the Great Depression,'" Econ Journal Watch 7(3), 197–204, September 2010 [1]

^ Steven Horwitz, "Unfortunately Unfamiliar with Robert Higgs and Others: A Rejoinder to Gauti Eggertsson on the 1930s," Econ Journal Watch 8(1), 2, January 2011. [2]

^ Romer, Christina D. (December 1992). "What Ended the Great Depression" (PDF). Journal of Economic History. 52 (4): 757–84. Archived from the original (PDF) on January 17, 2013. monetary development were crucial to the recovery implies that self-correction played little role in the growth of real output

^ Ben Bernanke. Essays on the Great Depression. Princeton University Press. ISBN 978-0691016986. p. 7

^ Ben S. Bernanke, "Nonmonetary Effects of the Financial Crisis in the Propaga-tion of the Great Depression," The American Economic Review 73, No. 3 (June 1983): 257–76, available from the St. Louis Federal Reserve Bank collection at Stlouisfed.org

^ "Ben S. Bernanke, "The Macroeconomics of the Great Depression: A Comparative Approach," Journal of Money, Credit, and Banking 27, No. 1 (February 1995): 1–28" (PDF). Fraser.stlouisfed.org. Retrieved 2014-10-16.

^ W.S. Woytinsky and E.S. World population and production: trends and outlook (1953) p. 148

^ Denyse Baillargeon, Making Do: Women, Family and Home in Montreal during the Great Depression (Wilfrid Laurier University Press, 1999), p. 159.

^ Jill Stephenson (2014). Women in Nazi Germany. Taylor & Francis. pp. 3–5. ISBN 978-1317876076.

^ Susan K. Foley (2004). Women in France Since 1789: The Meanings of Difference. Palgrave Macmillan. pp. 186–90. ISBN 978-0230802148.

^ Katrina Srigley (2010). Breadwinning Daughters: Young Working Women in a Depression-era City, 1929–1939. University of Toronto Press. p. 135. ISBN 978-1442610033.

^ Jessica S. Bean, "'To help keep the home going': female labour supply in interwar London." Economic History Review (2015) 68#2 pp. 441–70.

^ Ann E. McCleary, "'I Was Really Proud of Them': Canned Raspberries and Home Production During the Farm Depression." Augusta Historical Bulletin (2010), Issue 46, pp. 14–44.

^ Tari Klassen, "How Depression-Era Quiltmakers Constructed Domestic Space: An Interracial Processual Study," Midwestern Folklore: Journal of the Hoosier Folklore Society (2008) 34#2 pp. 17–47.

^ Baillargeon, Making Do: Women, Family and Home in Montreal during the Great Depression (1999), pp. 70, 108, 136–38, 159.

^ Mark Metzler, "Woman's Place in Japan's Great Depression: Reflections on the Moral Economy of Deflation." Journal of Japanese Studies (2004) 30#2 pp. 315–52.

^ N.R. Reagin, "Marktordnung and Autarkic Housekeeping: Housewives and Private Consumption under the Four-Year Plan, 1936–1939," German History (2001) 19#2 pp. 162–84.

^ Referring to the effect of World War II spending on the economy, economist John Kenneth Galbraith said, "One could not have had a better demonstration of the Keynesian ideas." Daniel Yergin, William Cran (writers / producer) (2002). Commanding Heights, see chapter 6 video or transcript (TV documentary). U.S.: PBS.

^ Romer, Christina D. (1992). "What Ended the Great Depression?". Journal of Economic History. 52 (4): 757–84. doi:10.1017/S002205070001189X. fiscal policy was of little consequence even as late as 1942, suggests an interesting twist on the usual view that World War II caused, or at least accelerated, the recovery from the Great Depression.

^ Higgs, Robert (1992-03-01). "Wartime Prosperity? A Reassessment of the U.S. Economy in the 1940s". The Journal of Economic History. 52 (1): 41–60. doi:10.1017/S0022050700010251. ISSN 1471-6372.

^ Great Depression and World War II. The Library of Congress.

^ Depression & WWII Archived 2009-06-25 at the Wayback Machine.. Americaslibrary.gov.

^ Geoffrey Lawrence, Capitalism and the Countryside: The rural crisis in Australia (Pluto Press, 1987)

^ A Century of Change in the Australian Labour Market, Australian Bureau of Statistics

^ John Birmingham (2000). Leviathan: The unauthorised biography of Sydney. Random House. ISBN 978-0091842031

^ Judy Mackinolty, ed. The Wasted Years?: Australia's Great Depression (Allen & Unwin, 1981).

^ 1929–1939 – The Great Depression Archived 2009-01-27 at the Wayback Machine., Source: Bank of Canada

^ Anthony Latham and John Heaton, The Depression and the Developing World, 1914–1939 (1981).

^ Catherine Coquery-Vidrovitch, "Mutation de l'impérialisme colonial français dans les années 30." African Economic History (1977): 103–152. online in French

^ Nicholas Westcott, "The East African sisal industry, 1929–1949: the marketing of a colonial commodity during depression and war." Journal of African History 25.4 (1984): 445–461.

^ R. Olufeni Ekundare, An Economic History of Nigeria 1860–1960 (1973) online pp. 104–226.

^ O.O. Olubomehin, "Road Transportation and the Economy of South-Western Nigeria, 1920-1939." Lagos Historical Review 2 (2002): 106–121.

^ Gatian F. Lungu, "Educational Policy-Making in Colonial Zambia: The Case of Higher Education for Africans from 1924 to 1964." The Journal of Negro History 78.4 (1993): 207–232.

^ R. Anstey, King Leopold's Legacy: The Congo under Belgian Rule 1908–1960 (1966), p. 109.

^ Moses Ochonu, "Critical convergence: the Great Depression and the meshing of Nigerian and British anti-colonial polemic." Canadian Journal of African Studies/La Revue canadienne des études africaines 43.2 (2009): 245–281.

^ Harry Gamble, "Les paysans de l'empire: écoles rurales et imaginaire colonial en Afrique occidentale française dans les années 1930. Cahiers d'Études Africaines (2009) 49#3 pp. 775–803.

^ Henry Laufenburger, "France and the Depression," International Affairs (1936) 15#2 pp. 202–24 in JSTOR

^ Jean-Pierre Dormois, The French Economy in the Twentieth Century (2004) p. 31

^ Paul Beaudry and Franck Portier, "The French Depression in the 1930s," Review of Economic Dynamics (2002) 5:73–99 doi:10.1006/redy.2001.0143

^ About the Great Depression, University of Illinois

^ Germany – Economic, Public Broadcasting Service (PBS).

^ "The History Place – Rise of Hitler: Hitler Runs for President". www.historyplace.com. Retrieved 2016-10-23.

^ Adam Tooze, The Wages of Destruction: The Making and Breaking of the Nazi Economy (2007)

^ a b c Karlsson, Gunnar (2000). History of Iceland. pp. 308–12.

^ Manikumar, K. A. (2003). A Colonial Economy in the Great Depression, Madras (1929–1937).

^ Samita Sen, "Labour, Organization and Gender: The Jute Industry in India in the 1930s," in Helmut Konrad and Wolfgang Maderthaner, eds. Routes Into the Abyss: Coping with Crises in the 1930s (2013) pp. 152–66.

^ Colin Simmons, "The Great Depression and Indian Industry: Changing interpretations and changing perceptions." Modern Asian Studies 21.3 (1987): 585–623. online

^ Frank Barry and Mary F. Daly, "Concurrent Irish Perspectives on the Great Depression" (2010) [ online ]

^ Frank Barry and Mary E. Daly, "Irish Perceptions of the Great Depression" in Michael Psalidopoulos, The Great Depression in Europe: Economic Thought and Policy in a National Context (Athens: Alpha Bank, 2012) pp. 395–424.

^ See also B. Girvin, Between Two Worlds: Politics and Economy in Independent Ireland (Dublin: Gill and Macmillan, 1989).

^ Barry, Frank, and Mary E. Daly. "Irish Perceptions of the Great Depression" (No. iiisdp349. IIIS, 2011.) Online

^ Vera Zamagni, The economic history of Italy 1860–1990 (Oxford University Press, 1993)

^ Fabrizio Mattesini, and Beniamino Quintieri. "Italy and the Great Depression: An analysis of the Italian economy, 1929–1936." Explorations in Economic History (1997) 34#3 pp: 265–294.

^ Fabrizio Mattesini and Beniamino Quintieri. "Does a reduction in the length of the working week reduce unemployment? Some evidence from the Italian economy during the Great Depression." Explorations in Economic History (2006), 43#3, pp. 413–37.

^ Myung Soo Cha, "Did Takahashi Korekiyo Rescue Japan from the Great Depression?", The Journal of Economic History 63, No. 1 (March 2003): 127–144.

^ (For more on the Japanese economy in the 1930s see "MITI and the Japanese Miracle" by Chalmers Johnson.)

^ Rosemary Thorp, Latin America in the 1930s: the role of the periphery in world crisis (Palgrave Macmillan, 2000).

^ E.H. Kossmann, The Low Countries: 1780–1940 (1978).

^ "Social Welfare and The State: Great Depression", Museum of New Zealand Te Papa Tongarewa.

^ José Cardozo, "The great depression and Portugal" in Michael Psalidopoulos, ed. (2012). The Great Depression in Europe: Economic Thought and Policy in a National Context Athens: Alpha Bank, ISBN 978-9609979368. pp. 361–94 Online

^ Rodriguez, Manuel (2011). A New Deal for the Tropics. Princeton: Markus Wiener. p. 23.

^ "Graph of U.S. Unemployment Rate: 1930–1945". American Social History Project. Retrieved April 19, 2017.

^ Dietz, James (1986). Economic History of Puerto Rico. Princeton: Princeton University Press. pp. 154–55. ISBN 0691022488.

^ Dan O'Meara, Volkskapitalisme: class, capital, and ideology in the development of Afrikaner nationalism, 1934–1948 (Cambridge University Press, 1983).

^ The Great Depression and the 1930S, Federal Research Division of the Library of Congress.

^ Anthony Minnaar, "Unemployment and relief measures during the Great Depression (1929–1934)." Kleio 26.1 (1994): 45–85.

^ Robert William Davies, Mark Harrison, and Stephen G. Wheatcroft, eds. The economic transformation of the Soviet Union, 1913–1945 (Cambridge University Press, 1994)

^ Robert Conquest, The Harvest of Sorrow: Soviet Collectivization and the Terror-Famine (1987).

^ Jennifer Burns (2009). Goddess of the Market: Ayn Rand and the American Right, p. 34. Oxford University Press. ISBN 0195324870

^ http://www.genealogia.fi/emi/art/article237e.htm

^ Gabriel Tortella and Jordi Palafox, "Banking and Industry in Spain 1918–1936," Journal of European Economic History (1984), 13#2 Special Issue, pp. 81–110.

^ R.J. Harrison, Economic History of Modern Spain (1978), pp. 129–49.

^ Göran Therborn, "A Unique Chapter in the History of Democracy: The Swedish Social Democrats", in K. Misgeld et al (eds), Creating Social Democracy, University Park, Penn State University Press, 1996.

^ Charles Loch Mowat, Britain between the wars, 1918–1940 (1955) pp. 386–412.

^ Unemployment During The Great Depression Archived 2009-01-24 at the Wayback Machine., thegreatdepression.co.uk

^ Cook, Chris and Bewes, Diccon; What Happened Where: A Guide To Places And Events In Twentieth-Century History p. 115; Routledge, 1997 ISBN 1857285336

^ "Work camps that tackled Depression", BBC News.

^ Constantine, Stephen (1983), Social Conditions in Britain 1918–1939, ISBN 0416360106

^ a b Peter Clemens, Prosperity, Depression and the New Deal: The USA 1890–1954, Hodder Education, 4. Auflage, 2008, ISBN 978-0340965887, p. 114.

^ Charles R. Morris, A Rabble of Dead Money: The Great Crash and the Global Depression: 1929–1939 (PublicAffairs, 2017), 389 pp. online review

^ "Smoot-Hawley Tariff" Archived 2009-03-12 at the Wayback Machine., U.S. Department of State.

^ "Reconstruction Finance Corporation". EH.net Encyclopedia. Archived from the original on October 29, 2013.

^ Clemens, Prosperity, Depression and the New Deal, 2008, p. 113.

^ The Great Depression (1929–1939), The Eleanor Roosevelt Papers. Archived December 23, 2008, at the Wayback Machine.

^ Swanson, Joseph; Williamson, Samuel (1972). "Estimates of national product and income for the United States economy, 1919–1941". Explorations in Economic History. 10: 53–73. doi:10.1016/0014-4983(72)90003-4.

^ "Great Depression in the United States", Microsoft Encarta. Archived 2009-10-31. Archived March 1, 2009, at the Wayback Machine.

^ Joyce Bryant, "The Great Depression and New Deal", Yale-New Haven Teachers Institute.

^ The Dust Bowl, Geoff Cunfer, Southwest Minnesota State University. Archived December 28, 2008, at the Wayback Machine.

^ "National Park History: "The Spirit of the Civilian Conservation Corps"". Nationalparkstraveler.com. Archived from the original on 2010-09-05. Retrieved September 4, 2010.

^ Robert Goldston, The Great Depression, Fawcett Publications, 1968, p. 228.

^ Economic Fluctuations, Maurice W. Lee, Chairman of Economics Dept., Washington State College, published by R.D. Irwin Inc, Homewood, Illinois, 1955, p. 236.

^ Business Cycles, James Arthur Estey, Purdue University, Prentice-Hall, 1950, pp. 22–23 chart.

^ Maurice W. Lee, 1955.

^ Schlesinger, Jr., Arthur M. The Coming of the New Deal: 1933–1935. Paperback ed. New York: Houghton Mifflin, 2003 [1958]. ISBN 0618340866; Schlesinger, Jr., Arthur M. The Politics of Upheaval: 1935–1936. Paperback ed. New York: Houghton Mifflin, 2003 [1960]. ISBN 0618340874

^ Lanny Ebenstein, Milton Friedman: A Biography (2007).

^ The Grapes of Wrath, by John Steinbeck, Penguin, 2006, 0143039431, p. 238

^ David Taylor, Soul of a People: The WPA Writers' Project Uncovers Depression America (2009).

^ Jerre Mangione, The Dream and the Deal: The Federal Writers' Project, 1935–1943 (1996)

^ Jerrold Hirsch, Portrait of America: A Cultural History of the Federal Writers' Project (2006)

^ Stacy I. Morgan, Rethinking Social Realism: African American art and literature, 1930–1953 (2004), p. 244.

^ Harry, Lou (1 October 2010). Cincinnati Magazine. Emmis Communications. pp. 59–63. Retrieved 10 July 2017.

^ Morency, Philip. On the Aisle, Volume 2: Film Reviews by Philip Morency. Dorrance Publishing. pp. 133–. ISBN 978-1434977090.

^ Pimpare, Stephen (2017). Ghettos, Tramps, and Welfare Queens: Down and Out on the Silver Screen. Oxford University Press. pp. 216–. ISBN 978-0190660727. Retrieved 10 July 2017.

^ Smith, Robert W. (2006-01-26). Spotlight on America: The Great Depression. Teacher Created Resources. ISBN 978-1420632187. Retrieved 10 July 2017.

^ a b c When Did the Great Depression Receive Its Name? (And Who Named It?), 2-16-09, by Noah Mendel, History News Network

^ William Manchester, The Glory and the Dream: A Narrative History of America, 1932–1972.

^ Fletcher, T.W. (1961). "The Great Depression of English Agriculture 1873–1896". The Economic History Review. Blackwell Publishing. 13 (3): 417–32. doi:10.2307/2599512. JSTOR 2599512.

^ "Child poverty soars in eastern Europe", BBC News, October 11, 2000.

^ See "What Can Transition Economies Learn from the First Ten Years? A New World Bank Report," in Transition Newsletter Worldbank.org, K-A.kg

^ a b Who Lost Russia?, New York Times, October 8, 2000.

^ Adam Tooze, Crashed: How iters a Decade of Financial Crises Changed the World (2018) p. 41.

^ Rampell, Catherine (March 11, 2009). "'Great Recession': A Brief Etymology". The New York Times.

^ Gibbs, Nancy (April 15, 2009). "The Great Recession: America Becomes Thrift Nation". Time.

^ Krugman, Paul (March 20, 2009). "The Great Recession versus the Great Depression". The New York Times.

^ Lahart, Justin (July 28, 2009). "The Great Recession: A Downturn Sized Up". The Wall Street Journal.

^ Rabinowitz, Marco (October 6, 2011). "The Great Depression vs. the Great Recession: A look at the value of the U.S. dollar in 1929 and 2008; what has changed and where that leaves us today". MSN Money. Benzinga.

^ Evans-Pritchard, Ambrose (September 14, 2010). "IMF Fears 'Social Explosion' From World Jobs Crisis". The Daily Telegraph (London). "America and Europe face the worst jobs crisis since the 1930s and risk 'an explosion of social unrest' unless they tread carefully, the International Monetary Fund has warned."

External links

Wikimedia Commons has media related to Great Depression. Wikiquote has quotations related to: Great Depression

Rare Color Photos from the Great Depression – slideshow by The Huffington Post
EH.net, "An Overview of the Great Depression", by Randall Parker.
America in the 1930s. Extensive library of projects on America in the Great Depression from American Studies at the University of Virginia
The 1930s Timeline, year by year timeline of events in science and technology, politics and society, culture and international events with embedded audio and video. AS@UVA
Great Myths of the Great Depression by Lawrence Reed
Franklin D. Roosevelt Library & Museum for copyright-free photos of the period
An Age of Lost Innocence: Childhood Realities and Adult Fears in the Depression. American Studies at the University of Virginia
Great Depression in the Deep South
Soul of a People documentary on Smithsonian Networks
The Great Depression at the History Channel
"Chairman Ben Bernanke Lecture Series Part 1".Recorded live on March 20, 2012 10:35am MST at a class at George Washington University

The Great Wall 2016

Will Great Tribulation Begin in 2019? - cogwriter.com

Will Great Tribulation Begin in 2019?

By COGwriter

Can the Great Tribulation start this year? Can the Great Tribulation begin in 2019? Can the Great Tribulation begin in 2020? Can the Great Tribulation begin in 2021?

No, it cannot. The Great Wall 2016 Not according to Bible prophecy. The Great Wall 2016 And while sorrows and tribulation are prophesied to happen prior (Matthew 24:4-12) to the "great tribulation" (Matthew 24:21), the Great Tribulation (the final times of the Gentiles) itself cannot start in 2019 nor prior to 2022--and it may be later.

Related to nearly every individual year beginning in 2008, I have denounced false prophets as well as those that speculated on each of those years as the start of the Great Tribulation as all who did so were much too close to that date/year for it to be possible.

At this moment it is now impossible that the Great tribulation can begin in 2019 or 2020 or 2021. The Great Tribulation will come relatively soon, but 2022 is the earliest possible start date, with a later date more likely at this stage (you may also wish to watch a short YouTube video titled: The Great Wall 2016 Might the Great Tribulation start in 2019?; there is also a sermon video titled The Great Tribulation from the Mount of Olives, as well another sermon titled Can the Great Tribulation begin before 2020?).

Jesus' disciples specifically asked Him how to know when this would happen (Matthew 24:3; Mark 13:4; Luke 21:7)--and He responded with details. Several of those details are yet to be fulfilled.

But sadly, many overlook what Jesus taught, but instead try to point to other things--but in this article I have striven to draw conclusions from what the Bible actually teaches.

Consider, for example, that although some claimed that the blood moons in 2014 and 2015' may have marked the beginning, I correctly denounced that years ago (Blood Moons, Eclipses, and Prophecy; a related YouTube video is also available: Blood Moons, Prophecy, 2014, and 2015) and was proven right. I also denounced the so-called Shemitah year and the claimed devastation that was supposed to hit the world economy, etc. in late 2015 (ee also 6000 years up and Jesus to return in 2016? and September ‘convergence’: a harbinger of potential disaster?), and again was right. On January 1, 2017, I blasted the idea of the claimed 'Jubilee of 2017" would mark the end (see Can the Great Tribulation Start in 2017? Furthermore, I blasted the idea that the solar eclipse of August 21, 2017 (see Solar Eclipse and the Apocalypse) or Planet Nibiru would begin the tribulation or destroy the Earth (see Doomsayers: Planet Nibiru to destroy Planet Earth in four weeks). I also denounced the view that because of the formation of the tiny nation of Israel in 1948, that the Great Tribulation needed to start 70 years later, like in 2018 (watch Can the Great Tribulation begin in 2018?).

Why?

Because according to the Bible, other events needed to occur, that had not yet occurred.

We must base the timing of the Great Tribulation based upon what the Bible teaches.

The reality is that there are various clues in the Bible, and such as in the books of Daniel and Matthew, that make the prospective of the Great Tribulation happening in the next three years impossible. This article will discuss the earliest timing of the Great Tribulation, the Beginning of Sorrows, some of what happens in the Great Tribulation itself, and the Day of the Lord.

Here is a link to a version of this article in the Spanish language: ¿Puede comenzar la Gran Tribulación en 2018 o 2019? ¿Es el Tiempo de los Gentiles?

(Our most recent Great Tribulation video is available to watch: Might the Great Tribulation start in 2019?)

(See also 19 items to prophetically watch in 2019.)

Some are Claiming that the Great Tribulation Will or May Begin in 2019 or 2020

Each year, I have denounced various ones who claimed that knew when or were fairly certain the Great Tribulation would begin.

Consider, for example, that although some claimed that the blood moons in 2014 and 2015′ may have marked the beginning, I correctly denounced that years ago (Blood Moons, Eclipses, and Prophecy; a related YouTube video is also available: Blood Moons, Prophecy, 2014, and 2015) and was proven right. I also denounced the so-called Shemitah year and the claimed devastation that was supposed to hit the world economy, etc. in late 2015 (see also 6000 years up and Jesus to return in 2016? and September ‘convergence’: a harbinger of potential disaster?), and again was right. On January 1, 2017, I blasted the idea that the claimed ‘Jubilee of 2017, would mark the end (see Can the Great Tribulation Start in 2017? Furthermore, I blasted the idea that the solar eclipse of August 21, 2017 (see Solar Eclipse and the Apocalypse) or Planet Nibiru would begin the tribulation or destroy the Earth (see Doomsayers: Planet Nibiru to destroy Planet Earth in four weeks). Plus those associated with the 70th anniversary of Israel's founding (see Will the Great Tribulation begin in 2018? and/or watch Can the Great Tribulation begin in 2018?).

Here is one false prediction related to the rapture and the 70th anniversary:

The main reason I think the rapture will be in 2018 (or early-2019) is that it corresponds to the 70th anniversary of Israel, which started May 14, 2018, and obviously lasts for one year. The logical reason for the 70th anniversary is that the true meaning of the Seals already contains ‘two’ 70-year periods, in Israel’s history, so the rapture would make a ‘third’, since the rapture is the 6th Seal. (Rapture in 2018 (or early 2019). Daniel 11" God's Timeline. http://daniel11truth.com/rapture-2018.htm)

Here is a prediction for a 2019 Great Tribulation from The Sabbatical Code website:

The rapture will commence before the Great Tribulation begins. ... The Great Tribulation according to God’s Clock is speculated to begin in January, 2019 = October/ Tishri, 2016, which is the sabbatical code 2016-2017/ 5776-5777 as shown in God’s Calendars. 1260 days is 3.5 years of Great Tribulation. Matthew 24 was not written in chronological order. This would result the Great Tribulation lasting from 2019 to 2022, ...

In Matthew 24, it says about the “flight”, which is the rapture. Then, it comes the word “great tribulation”, which pertains to this rapture timeframe. This confirms what was said from above. January, 2019 will be winter time and would be seen as the Sabbath, as it hits at 7:00 in God’s Clock. (The Great Tribulation 3.5 Years From 2019-2022. January 24, 2018. https://sabbaticalcode.com/2018/01/24/the-great-tribulation-3-5-years-from-2019-2022/)

While faithful Christians have long kept the Sabbath, the 'God's Clock' nonsense reminds me of the flawed numerical nonsense that the late Protestant Harold Camping used (see Harold Camping's Teachings About the End of the World Do Not Agree with the Bible). Jesus did NOT say to look for a clock to determine this.

Here's another one:

This is THE SCRIPTURAL TIMELINE for major tribulation events, REGARDLESS OF WHICH YEAR the Rapture TAKES PLACE. We have provided THE RABBINIC DATE for each event, followed by the PRESUMED Gregorian date. The Gregorian date ASSUMES that the Tribulation will begin in 2019. If these things happen SOME OTHER YEAR, Gregorian dates would need to be adjusted accordingly. ...

Adar II 29 - Rosh Chodesh Aviv (Nisan)
Friday-Saturday April 5-6 2019

6th seal open

Signs happen

Tribulation begins (Revelation 6:12)

Aviv (Nisan) 10 (10 days later)
Sunday-Monday April 14-15 2019

Rapture of the Church takes place (Joshua 4:19; Revelation 2:10)

(Tribulation timeline, updated September 2018. https://revelation2012.ch/38-articles-in-english/381-tribulation-timeline accessed 11/02/18)

The coming of the Great Tribulation is NOT based on the accuracy or inaccuracy of the Gregorian calendar. 2019 is wrong. So is the following logic:

There have only been TWO decrees to return and build Jerusalem: the first took place in 445 B.C. and the second took place on April 1, 1969.

If we count 7 shemitta cycles of 49 years FROM the first shemitta cycle after 1969 (when the SECOND DECREE was given), the SECOND COMING of Christ must take place in the year 2022.

The Rapture MUST occur approximately 3½ years PRIOR TO the end of the tribulation, which would be in spring 2019. (https://revelation2012.ch/38-articles-in-english/384-rapture-of-the-church-in-2017-and-second-coming-of-jesus-in-2020 accessed 11/13/18)

Jesus DID NOT say anything about calculating 'shemita' years, but many do not seem to want to heed Jesus' words--they want to watch the wrong things, not what He said to.

Thomas Words has a YouTube video titled THE GREAT TRIBULATION 2019-THE THIRD TEMPLE-ENDTIMES BIBLE PROPHECY-WARNINGS REPENT! (December 6, 2017). He claims that the Great Tribulation begins in 2019:

The Great Tribulation ... That must be 2019 then. ... This is the truth.

He also insists that the 'third temple' is about to be built--but that view of his is also in error (see also Why is a Jewish Temple in Jerusalem Not Required?).

A fringe Catholic site, possibly based on Jacinta Marto of Fatima fame and/or other apparition reports claims related to WWIII, which some would consider the start of the Great Tribulation:

A Possible Date of World War III - #1...

June 13 through 15 2019

A Possible Date of World War III - #2...

October 13 through 15 2019

(What Could Happen in 2018 and 2019... These Last Days Ministry, Updated July 13, 2018. https://www.tldm.org/Jacinta1972. Update.htm accessed 11/01/18)

One who claims to be COG (Church of God), James Malm, has pointed to pretty much every year starting with 2008 (for some details, check out the article: Error-Ridden James Malm Not Doing an Elijah Work).

In 2008, he posted:

The only possible years for the 1335 days to begin in the forseeable future are 2008 or 2009…

In short the last day of the 1335 days may occur on the day before Pentecost, making the Feast of Pentecost representative of a NEW BEGINNING IN THE KINGDOM OF GOD. If this is true, and I shall study it further; the final False Prophet will be set up on 3 Oct 2009! (Malm. J. 2008 and Prophecy, 30 SEP 08).

Here is what he wrote in late 2014:

There is an extremely high probability [at least 90%] that Christ will come in early 2020 and that the abomination will be set up in the Vatican in early Oct 2016 with the tribulation beginning by the end of 2016. (October 30, 2014)

Here is what James Malm wrote in late 2018:

Jerusalem has announced that Ukraine President Petro Poroshenko would soon come for a visit and this week the Israeli air force was reported to be taking part in the US-led Clear Sky exercise in Ukraine, practicing attacks against Russian S-300 and S-400 air defense missile systems.

The probability of the great tribulation beginning at the end of 2019 or 2020 is now extremely high and will increase as these matters progress. (Malm J. TheShiningLight Update, October 31, 2018. https://godourlight.info/theshininglight-update/)

At this time all events are lining up for the 42 month great tribulation to begin at the end of 2019, or if things go slowly at the end of 2020. (Malm J. TheShiningLight Update, November 25, 2018. https://godourlight.info/theshininglight-update/)

He, and others, who claim prior to 2022 are in error. There is NO possibility that the Great Tribulation will begin in 2019 or 2020. To see more of James Malm's specific predictions, check out the article: Error-Ridden James Malm Not Doing an Elijah Work.

Necessary events that Jesus and Daniel mentioned have not happened.

There is No Final King of the North or King of the South Yet

One reason that the Great Tribulation will not begin yet is that one known as the final King of the North needs to rise up.

The Bible, in the Book of Daniel, shows that the coming "the King of the North" will make a deal of some sort with one called the King of the South just before the appointed time of the end:

27 Both these kings' hearts shall be bent on evil, and they shall speak lies at the same table; but it shall not prosper, for the end will still be at the appointed time (Daniel 11:27).

Daniel chapter 11 tells much about the end times and it involves both a King of the South and a King of the North. And while there has been a president of the South and a president of the North in the Union for the Mediterranean (see Deal Leading to Psalm 83?), these individuals have not held the type of power (nor prerogatives) of the prophesied King of the North and the King of the South.

Nor will European Union's Herman Van Rompuy likely be the final King of the North as he does not seem to fit that description. However, if his successor raises taxes, he may fulfill the role of the person listed in Daniel 11:20; but again that would not make him the final King of the North.

I have been specifically asked why I can be so certain that the Great Tribulation cannot begin for at least 3 1/2 years by various ones.

Why can YOU and I be certain?

Because of what Jesus taught about the end.

In Matthew 24:15 and Mark 13:14, Jesus specifically referred to an event in the writings from the Prophet Daniel as the SIGN to know when to flee--a fleeing that takes place BEFORE the Great Tribulation begins (Matthew 24:21). The sign Jesus referred to had to do with actions of a prince (Daniel 9:27) who will become the King of the North (Daniel 11).

Here is that sign that comes AFTER the deal in Daniel 11:27--this is essentially the sign Jesus said to look for:

31 And forces shall be mustered by him, and they shall defile the sanctuary fortress; then they shall take away the daily sacrifices, and place there the abomination of desolation. (Daniel 11:31)

The “him” is the final King of the North--the Great Tribulation takes place AFTER that event (cf. Matthew 24:15; Matthew 24:21).

Not only will the Great Tribulation not start before there is an actual King of the South and an actual final King of the North, a prince who will later become that King of the North will first confirm a deal (probably a peace deal) with Israel (probably somewhat including the United States and some Arab lands as part of the "many" in Daniel 9:27).

Daniel 11:27 itself requires two kings, which suggests that the future "prince" will gain more and more importance after the deal in Daniel 9:27 (for more information on the sequence of Daniel 11, please see the article the King of the North). It may take a regional or other war in the Middle East to trigger a peace deal. And if Isaiah 17:1 concerning the destruction of Damascus is to be fulfilled prior to the start of the Great Tribulation, the destruction of Damascus in Syria should be a clear sign to those who discount biblical prophecy that Bible prophecy will come to pass. Damascus has claimed to the longest continuously inhabited city on the earth and its destruction would be unprecedented. But with all the news about Syria, it is certainly possibly that the destruction of Damascus can come soon (for some details, please watch Damascus and Syria in Prophecy).

As far as the King of the South goes, there simply is not a confederation of Islamic nations that work close enough together yet in order to be led by the King of the South. While it is true that there are two groups that ultimately may ultimately allow this (see Iraq & the King of the South and Mediterranean Union Makes Deal With Israel and Arab States), the Islamic Mahdi/Caliph has not yet been recognized by a major amount of Muslims. And while this is possible to occur in 2019, the King of the South also will not be ready militarily to fulfill prophecies such as those in Daniel 11:40. The Muslim Brotherhood is a group that seems to want to end up with the biblical King of the South. Although the Muslim Brotherhood gained some prominence for a time, it also has problems. Nor does it yet have the type of confederation that could fulfill Daniel 11:40-43. The same goes for the Islamic State, al Qaeda, and Boko Haram at this stage.

A "Prince" Comes First

As alluded to earlier, there is something that takes place 3 1/2 years before the Great Tribulation. Furthermore, the Bible shows that prior to being referred to as "the King of the North," there is an individual who initially appears to be referred to as a "prince" in Daniel 9:26-27 (one is normally a "prince", or rising leader, before one becomes a "king").

Since this deal has still not been made, let alone confirmed, this would suggest that contrary to claims of various false prophets (Ronald Weinland of CGPFK and Harold Camping come to mind) the Great Tribulation has not already began.

Notice that in the book of Daniel there is a prophecy related to the end times that states:

26 And the people of the prince who is to come
Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be with a flood,
And till the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.
And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined,
Is poured out on the desolate (Daniel 9:26-27).

The ‘one week’ has generally been understood by prophecy watchers to mean a seven year deal, that is broken in the middle of it (after 3 1/2 years). It has long been my view that Israel will not agree to the type of seven-year covenant what the Bible mentions in Daniel 9:27 without pressure and that the Europeans will be involved.

For more details on this deal and why it would involve a European, please check out the article: The 'Peace Deal' of Daniel 9:27.

Since this Middle East peace deal has not been completed (at least not publicly), then if one adds 3 1/2 years to now, the earliest this could be would be the year 2022. We are simply not yet to the part that a "prince of the north" has come on the scene in that major way. Which of course means that there still is no final King of the North--though he is alive now, but not yet in that role.

Again, for more details on this deal, please check out the article: The 'Peace Deal' of Daniel 9:27.

Brief Sequential Prophetic Summary

Since the Great Tribulation cannot happen yet, what are some specific events to look for which occur prior to the Great Tribulation?

The basic sequence is that certain sorrows and troubles will continue (Mark 13:5-8). This is happening. Some nation will become highly indebted (Habakkuk 2:6)--this is happening.

The 'peace' deal of Daniel 9:27 is confirmed. Deals have been proposed, but the biblical one has not yet been made nor confirmed.

A King of the North (who was a 'prince' in Daniel 9:27) and a King of the South (Daniel 11:27) will arise. Europe will get a "great army" (Daniel 11:25). We are seeing the foundations for this now.

Animal sacrifices will begin (cf. Daniel 9:27). (Note: It is possible that the King of the South could rise up prior to Daniel 9:27 or even after the sacrifices resume as could the King of the North--and his army will be greater years after the deal of Daniel 9:27 is confirmed.)

The gospel then will have been preached enough to the world as a witness for the end to come (Matthew 24:14)--steps related to this are in process (see also The Final Phase of the Work). This seems to be related to the ‘short work’ of Romans 9:28--preparations for this are also occurring (see also Preparing for the 'Short Work' and The Famine of the Word).

Jewish sacrifices will be stopped (Daniel 9:27). Some Jews would like to start them now, but the Israeli government will not currently allow it.

Europe will reorganize into ten 'kingdoms' (not necessarily ten currently existing nations as some have improperly insisted upon and give power the Beast; see Must the Ten Kings of Revelation 17:12 Rule over Ten Currently Existing Nations?)--some of this could happen earlier--and reorganization has been proposed.

The abomination of desolation will then be set up (Matthew 24:15; Mark 13:14) because of actions of the King of the North (Daniel 9:27; 11:31). The most faithful expect to continue to tell what is happening until they are somehow stopped (cf. Amos 8:11-12; see also Preparing for the 'Short Work' and The Famine of the Word).

A decree is to be issued (Zephaniah 2:1-3) and then the most faithful Philadelphians will 'fly' to the wilderness (Revelation 12:14-16) and those in Judea should flee per Jesus' statements in Matthew 24:15-19 and Mark 13:15-18 (see also There is a Place of Safety for the Philadelphians. Why it May Be Petra). Prior to the time the Great Tribulation starts, the two witnesses will support the work, and several days before its start, they will get power to do their job (Revelation 11:3-15; see also Who Are The Two Witnesses?).

Bolstered by the Antichrist, then the Great Tribulation will begin (Matthew 24:21-22; Mark 13:19-20; Daniel 11:39, 12:1b; cf. Habakkuk 2:7-8). This will eliminate the USA and its Anglo-Saxon descended allies as nations (Daniel 11:39; Jeremiah 30:7; Habakkuk 2:7-8; see also USA in Prophecy: The Strongest Fortresses). The King of the South will shortly later push against the King of the North and get eliminated (Daniel 11:40-43)--those loyal to that leader will know tribulation (cf. Ezekiel 30:2-8).

About a month or so less than 2 ½ years after the Great Tribulation began, the sixth seal will be opened, there will be a 'blood moon' and a darkened sun (Revelation 6:12; Joel 2:30-31; see also Blood Moons and Prophecy), then the 144,000 of Revelation 7:1-8 will be sealed.

Shortly thereafter, the seventh seal will be opened (Revelation 8:1-6) and year long Day of the Lord (Isaiah 34:8) will begin with trumpet blasts, plagues, etc. (Revelation 8-7-13; 9:1-21; 11”13-14). Shortly thereafter, the seventh seal will be opened (Revelation 8:1-6) and year long Day of the Lord (Isaiah 34:8) will begin with trumpet blasts, plagues, etc. (Revelation 8-7-13; 9:1-21; 11:13-14). The gathering for Armageddon will begin related to the sixth trumpet blast (Revelation 8:13-19; 16:12-16).

Then at the seventh trumpet (Revelation 11:15), Jesus will return to establish the millennial kingdom.

The Great Tribulation should begin about 3 1/2 years after the peace deal (Daniel 9:27) is confirmed, and right after the King of the North tries to proclaim peace and safety (1 Thessalonians 5:3) to throw people off (cf. Daniel 11:24) for his invasion plans.

Europe is Not Quite Ready to Support the King of the North Yet

Another reason that now is not quite the time for the start of the Great Tribulation (though the peace deal could happen very soon), is that I have traveled to Europe many times in the past several years, and can state that the Europeans are simply not unified enough to be ready to fulfill their role as the supporters of the King of the North – the Final Beast military power, yet.

But they are looking at proposing peace deals in the Middle East and to takeover the leadership of the West (see ‘America Has Abdicated Its Leadership of the West’). Much of Europe is so irreligious that it is likely that Europeans will need to see "signs and lying wonders" to get fully ready--but that is expected according to biblical (2 Thessalonians 2:7-9; Revelation 13:11-17; 18:23) and even non-biblical prophecy.

Now, in order to be able to destroy the United States and its Anglo-allies (which will start the Great Tribulation), the Europeans would also benefit from having their own military satellite tracking system--and while that may not be an absolute requirement, they will not have enough of their own ready until around 2020 or later (see also EU Approves Galileo For Military Use, which first thought it could be sooner). And oddly, the USA has decided to let the European Galileo system link to GPS (see US Cites China as Reason to Link to Galileo! and USA GPS and EU Galileo linking was expected), this will give the Europeans a unique military capability in a few years.

Furthermore, while Europe is getting information about USA surveillance, it has not received enough to be ready yet, but the USA has announced steps that will help Europe here (Will USA Spying Help the Beast Power? and The Snowden Leaks are Leading to the Destruction of the USA).

Additionally, Europe still has apparently not benefited enough militarily from its Large Hadron Collider project--which may be where it will develop a major military advantage (The Large Hadron Collider has Military Potential), which it would seem to need to fulfill biblical prophecy (cf. Revelation 13:4) (for more details, also watch the video Could the Large Hadron Collider lead to destruction?). And as mentioned before, since the deal in Daniel 9:27 has not been made, it will be at least 3 1/2 years before the King of the North can stop the sacrifices.

Of course, the sacrifices must start before they stop (Daniel 9:27; 11:31). Some believe that the identification of a 'red heifer' is needed for those sacrifices to be started and one was publicly announced in 2014 (see The Red Heifer, Jewish Beliefs, and the End of the World), sacrifices could resume (some Jews believe that the red heifer needs to be three years of age, which it should be by now). And while it is remotely possible that regular sacrifices will start in 2019, that is remote (see also Why is a Jewish Temple in Jerusalem Not Required? and The Red Heifer, Jewish Beliefs, and the End of the World). But even if they do, they will not be stopped by the King of the North in 2019 in a way to fulfill the prophecies in Daniel.

Europe, by the way, will have to reorganize. And by more than the Brexit.

The Bible shows that ten kings, who have not yet a kingdom, will rise up:

12 "The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have received no kingdom as yet, but they receive authority for one hour as kings with the beast. (Revelation 17:12)

As I write this, the above has not happened yet. Apparently, somewhat shortly after the above happens, something will trigger another reorganization for them to give power to the Beast (King of the North):

13 These are of one mind, and they will give their power and authority to the beast. 14 These will make war with the Lamb ... (Revelation 17:13-14)

The Beast will then reign for 3 1/2 years (forty-two months):

3 And I saw one of his heads as if it had been mortally wounded, and his deadly wound was healed. And all the world marveled and followed the beast. 4 So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, "Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?"

5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two months.

6 Then he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, His tabernacle, and those who dwell in heaven. 7 It was granted to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe, tongue, and nation. 8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. (Revelation 13:3-8)

So, when we see Europe reorganize into ten districts/kingdoms, this could be a sign that the Great Tribulation will start soon, and the persecution, the fifth seal of Revelation, is about to open.

However, many COGs and others misunderstand this (for some details, see Must the Ten Kings of Revelation 17:12 Rule over Ten Currently Existing Nations?).

No Deal Yet, Matthew 24, Luke 21, and the Days of Daniel 12

Furthermore, notice when the 1290 days (roughly 3 1/2 years) of Daniel 12 begins:

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away, and the abomination of desolation is set up, there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days (Daniel 12:11).

Thus, both Daniel 9:27 and 12:11 seem to be referring to a common event, and 12:11 shows that this begins a period of roughly 3 1/2 years.

Notice also the following:

"...And the abomination that maketh desolate set up." What is this abomination? This refers to Daniel 11:31 and Matthew 24:15. In Daniel 11:31, the armies of Antiochus Ephiphanes were at Jerusalem, and some commentators have interpreted it as Antiochus placing a statue of Jupiter in the Holy of Holies in the Temple. Not only does Matthew 24:15 also refer to this, but in a parallel New Testament scripture, Luke 21:20 speaks of the same thing as "Jerusalem compassed with armies." This is the correct meaning of this "abomination." It is the armies--not a statue--that make Jerusalem desolate. From this time (Dan. 12:11) to Christ's coming will be 1290 days. Now, verse 12, "Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the 1335 days. Never before have we understood these periods of 1260, 1290, and 1335 days. But it seems evident, now, a blessing is pronounced on us-- GOD'S CHURCH--who wait and endure until the 1335 days--approximately 1335 days prior to Christ's coming. But since no one can know the day or the hour of His coming, we probably shall not be able to know the exact day that this 1335 days begins. But apparently that is the time when OUR WORK SHALL END. That will be a time when the UNITED EUROPE shall appear --the revival of the medieval "Holy Roman Empire." We shall then be warned, and readied to be taken to a place of refuge and safety from the Great Tribulation. Forty-five days later "the beast's" armies will surround Jerusalem. Thirty days later the Great Tribulation will probably start... (Armstrong HW. The Time We Are In, Now. Pastor General's Report-Vol 1, No. 15, November 20, 1979, Page 2)

Notice the sequence of events that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 24, it is the only place in the Bible where the expression "great tribulation" is used with when it will begin (it is also similar to Luke 21, which is also shown below) and it also says when to flee if you are in Judea:

15 "Therefore when you see the 'abomination of desolation,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever reads, let him understand), 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17 Let him who is on the housetop not go down to take anything out of his house. 18 And let him who is in the field not go back to get his clothes. 19 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! 20 And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be (Matthew 24:15-21).

20 "But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation is near. 21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her. 22 For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people. 24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. (Luke 21:20-24)

So Jesus shows that after you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel (Daniel 9:27;11:31;12:11) it is time to flee for any in Judea (for more details on where, please see the article There is a Place of Safety for the Philadelphians. Why it May Be Petra) and THEN THERE WILL BE GREAT TRIBULATION! Also, many will be taken captive (see Will the Anglo-Nations be Divided?) This is during a time of the Gentiles--a time when the Israelite Anglo-descended nations have lost their major power in the world (see also Who is the King of the West? Why is there no End-Time King of the West in Bible Prophecy?). As far as an idea of where the abomination of desolation may be set up, check out the article Church of God on Jerusalem's Western Hill.

Daniel also wrote about this time. Here is one specific quote:

1 "At that time Michael shall stand up,
The great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people;
And there shall be a time of trouble,
Such as never was since there was a nation,
Even to that time.
And at that time your people shall be delivered,
Every one who is found written in the book. (Daniel 12:1)

Daniel and Jesus were referring to the same event. The time that Michael stands up is a reference also to the sequence in Daniel 11:35 (for details, see also King of the North).

Since the peace deal with the confirmation of the future King of the North has not yet occurred, the abomination involved with removal of the sacrifices (which have not even started yet) cannot happen for at least 3 1/2 years from now. Thus the great tribulation will not occur until after the faithful flee. Then this means that (unless this agreement occurred secretly and prior to July 1, 2016, an idea that various news reports and world events suggest is impossible), that the intense 3 1/2 year period of the great tribulation cannot occur before 2022! For details on the 1335 days of Daniel, please see the article on the King of the North.

If one adds 3 1/2 years to any current or future date, then a date of 2022 or later is the only period possible (and I believe it will be later than 2022). Thus, the Great Tribulation CANNOT occur in 2019 nor prior to 2022! And I do not now believe it is possible before 2023 as I do not see a reason to think that the deal of Daniel 9:27 will be confirmed before the Fall of 2019.

Is a Peace Deal like Daniel 9:27 Under Consideration?

Perhaps that it should be noted that even though Israel sometimes seems to be moving towards an agreement like the one in Daniel 9:27, one is not yet in place:

July 01, 2015

Solving the Israeli-Arab conflict could send a signal of “peace and stability” to the region, Italian Foreign Minister Paolo Gentiloni said on Tuesday, softly contradicting Israel’s oft-stated position that the current regional turmoil shows the Palestinian issue is not key to a calm Middle East.

Gentiloni, at a photo opportunity at the Prime Minister’s Office before meeting Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, said that the way to “find peace and security” is through the “traditional way” of a two-state solution, “where the Palestinian people and the Jewish people could live in peace.” http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Politics-And-Diplomacy/Italian-FM-Peace-deal-could-send-signal-of-stability-to-Middle-East-407646

The press in Israel sometimes has hinted that it needs a peace/military deal involving the Europeans (though they will not like how it will turn out). Here is one such item:

The idea of the Greater Land of Israel lives on only in the political faction to the right of Likud. The leaders of the national majority, like their voters, have also accepted the idea of parting from Shuafat, Abu Dis and the Golan Heights.

The stumbling block that prevents Israel's departure from the territories is not the demarcation of the final border between us and our neighbors. The only obstacle seen as impassable today on the way to an agreement is the security issue after the territories are vacated. As long as this dilemma has no answer that is convincing to most Israelis, no government, weak or strong, will be able to implement an agreement with our neighbors, even if it dares to sign one...

There is little doubt that most Palestinian people, as well as the government in Ramallah, would accept such an army willingly, if not enthusiastically. The Gaza Strip is a different story, and some arm-twisting would be required, not on the people but certainly on Hamas.

Such a force cannot be established without Israel's agreement. Israel would of course demand as part of that agreement, and would undoubtedly receive, close cooperation with the international force, first and foremost in matters of intelligence and counterterrorism. The foreign force should be here temporarily, its task will include helping to set up an effective Palestinian administration and Palestinian security forces who would eventually serve as a reliable counterterrorist force. All this will ultimately allow for the departure of the foreign army from the West Bank without Israel's security being endangered.

The question is, who will take on this mission?...

At this moment the European Union appears to be the only option. The EU, under French and German leadership, could be persuaded to accept the responsibility (A foreign army at the gate Haaretz, Israel, October 7, 2008).

An interesting 2011 news development in Israel was a survey that found that 81% of Israelis want to become part of the European Union (for details, see 81% of Israelis Want to Join the EU). Because of such strong support, it would seem that the Israelis would be highly likely to accept what would otherwise be considered an unacceptable "peace deal" if the Europeans wanted them to accept it (perhaps by telling the Israelis that their acceptance could lead to EU membership).

And it should be noted that the Vatican itself wants an agreement with Israel related to local Catholic matters in Israel (WND: Kerry proposed deal to give Vatican control of at least one ‘holy site’ in Jerusalem), and made one in June 2013 (watch Does the ‘Cenacle’ deal have prophetic ramifications? or check out Church of God on Jerusalem’s Western Hill), though it still does not have all that it wants.

Thus, it may be that since Israel wants closer agreement with the Europeans and the Vatican (which supports increased European unity) wants a more comprehensive agreement with Israel than it has had in the past, that one will happen relatively soon.

In 2010 Arab nations, like Jordan were encouraging the Europeans to be part of the Middle East peace process:

AMMAN — Jordan’s King Abdullah II told the foreign ministers of France and Spain on Monday that Europe has a key role to play in the Middle East...

“Europe plays a key role in supporting peace efforts to overcome problems facing the Palestinian-Israeli talks,” the king told France’s Bernard Kouchner and Miguel Angel Moratinos of Spain at a meeting…

Speaking to reporters, Moratinos said Israel recognised Europe was playing a growing role in efforts to resolve the Middle East conflict. Habib R. Jordan backs Europe role in Mideast after Israel snub. AFP, 11 October 2010, http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jIdlxuA_nEOehq0EdrFfn3FMvZlQ?docId
=CNG.ca5885cbc217ad8dfe9576713d2a47c7.49)

We in the Continuing Church of God have tended to believe that a peace deal involving the Middle East and the EU would be confirmed, and probably in some autumn.

LCG Evangelist Dr. Meredith stated in a sermon (Prepare for the Fast, Given, February 6, 2010) that such a deal (Daniel 9:27) could happen in 2010--and when I told him within a week or so of watching that sermon that he was premature and what he said did not appear possible, he agreed, though he sadly never told his congregants that. Though he was wrong about the year, it is a fact that the Europeans intend to confirm some type of Middle East peace deal. This is especially true as the Palestinians are upset with the USA and currently do not want the USA to broker a deal (e.g. Nakba Day: Many upset because of Donald Trump’s decision).

In 2011, an "interim peace deal" was proposed by the Israelis (Israel’s Lieberman charts interim peace deal- report. Reuters, January 23, 2011. http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNews/idCATRE70M0EM20110123). Since the apparent peace deal of Daniel 9:27 has a time period on it, it is an interim deal! So, the idea of having a temporary peace deal in the Middle East has at least been proposed.

The EU had hoped to get a deal in 2011 (http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5i2SXFoczv0eZ3e57W1SuNfoGOtvg?docId=CNG.45ed54b37a8da7196eec4d99230b920e.51).

It, along with the USA, has tried to get a deal since. Negotiations fell apart in April 2015. The Russians were hoping to try to broker a deal in late 2016 (see Russia arranging peace negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians–is this the Daniel 9:27 deal?)--but that did not work out that year. The USA tried again in 2018, but the Palestinian disdain for Donlad Trump makes that appear unlikely at this time (see Palestinian Authority says no to Trump ‘peace plan,’ but …).

But again, since the deal of Daniel 9:27 has not been made yet, it is not possible that the Great Tribulation can begin prior to 2022 (and probably not until later)--even though the Europeans and others still hope for a deal. It may be that some type of regional war or other conflict may have to happen before there is the biblically-indicated peace deal (see also The 'peace' deal of Daniel 9:27).

Furthermore, that although the Bible warns about the coming King of the North and this deal, it may be interesting to realize that certain Roman Catholic prophecies seem to look forward to this individual, who they tend to call "the Great Monarch" or "the prince of the north" (this is documented in the article Who is the King of the North?). But he does not have that type of power yet.

Thus, even though the stage is being set for the end, contrary to the claims of various self-appointed ones, the Great Tribulation WILL NOT begin in 2019 (nor did it begin prior as some have falsely claimed).

The Gospel Still Needs to Be Proclaimed

A point that few seem to recognize is that Matthew 24:14 still needs to be properly fulfilled. Nor are enough portions of the Final Phase of the Work over.

Recall that Jesus said:

14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come (Matthew 24:14).

Although God did use Herbert W. Armstrong as a witness in the 20th century, the 21st century world as a whole has not had an adequate witness for the end to yet come (see also Should the Church Still Try to Place its Top Priority on Proclaiming the Gospel or Did Herbert W. Armstrong Change that Priority for the Work? and The Final Phase of the Work).

I strongly believe that God will more powerfully use part of the most faithful part the surviving remnant of the Philadelphia era of the Church of God, currently the Continuing Church of God (CCOG), to lead the final phase of the work and proclaim the good news of the The Gospel of the Kingdom of God.

The "short work" of Romans 9:28 will still happen--but CCOG will not be able to complete this work, that part of the final phase of the work, before 2022.

Related to the "short work," the late evangelist John Ogwyn wrote:

God states clearly: “He will finish the work and cut it short in righteousness” (Romans 9:28). Who will He use to do it? According to Daniel 11:32 it is “the people who know their God [that] shall be strong, and carry out great exploits.” (Ogwyn J. God’s Church Through the Ages, p. 58)

And of course, since the 6000 years of God's plan apparently has several years left (see Does God Have a 6,000 Year Plan? What Year Does the 6,000 Years End?) combined with the fact that all the other signs mentioned in this update are not ready yet (though events seem to be working towards that objective), the Great Tribulation simply cannot begin in 2019, nor has the final portion of the short work began.

Yet, sometime after the deal in Daniel 9:27 is completed people like me and other Philadelphia remnant Church of God leaders will proclaim it as well as the gospel message. Matthew 24:14 will be fulfilled and the identification of the "prince" will likely enrage him enough to get him to try to stop the work, and through government pressure he may get internet and other media suspended for us (see Who is the King of the North?).

Remember, the Bible warns:

12 And they shall wander from sea to sea, and from the north even to the east, they shall run to and fro to seek the word of the Lord, and shall not find it. (Amos 8:12, KJV)

With FCC "net neutrality" rules and other regulations, we are getting close to that time when governments will be too offended by the truth and some will take steps to stop it from being proclaimed.

So What is Happening Now? We Are in the Beginning of Sorrows

There has been an increase in natural disasters in some recent years and an acceleration of certain types of earthquakes (more details as well as most recent information on earthquakes can be found in the article Earthquakes Today and Bible Prophecy):

About 42 million people were forced to flee their homes because of natural disasters around the world in 2010, more than double the number during the previous year...The Internal Displacement Monitoring Centre said the increase from 17 million displaced people in 2009 was mainly due to the impact of "mega-disasters"...

It said more than 90 percent of the disaster displacements were caused by weather-related hazards such as floods and storms that were probably impacted by global warming, but it couldn't say to what extent.

"The intensity and frequency of extreme weather events is increasing, and this trend is only set to continue. With all probability, the number of those affected and displaced will rise as human-induced climate change comes into full force," said Elisabeth Rasmusson, the secretary general of the Norwegian Refugee Council. (Amland BH. Millions displaced by natural disasters last year. Associated Press, June 5, 2011. http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/millions-displaced-by-natural-968478.html)

A new United States Geological Survey study has found that middle America between Alabama and Montana is experiencing an "unprecedented" and "almost certainly manmade" increase in earthquakes of 3.0 magnitude or greater. In 2011, there were 134 events of that size. That's six times more than were normally seen during the 20th century. While the changes in the area's seismicity began in 2001, the trend has really accelerated since 2009, the geologists note. (Madrigal A. Middle America Is Experiencing a Massive Increase in 3.0+ Earthquakes. The Atlantic, April 6, 2012. http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/04/middle-america-is-experiencing-a-massive-increase-in-30-earthquakes/255568/

There has also been more extreme weather in the past several years, including droughts around the world as well as across the USA (an article of related interest may be Weather Blessings and Sorrows).

Some will say, why all the problems now? Surely they mean something.

And surely they do. The Apostle Paul warned that in the last days, perilous times would come:

3:1 But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away! (2 Timothy 3:1-5).

We seem to be in those perilous times.

With all of the natural disasters such as earthquakes (Earthquakes Today and Bible Prophecy), floods, related food shortages, recessions, and emerging pestilences in the past few years, perhaps this would be a good time to show people that these are to start PRIOR to the “great tribulation.”

Some do not believe that it is at all possible to know when the Great Tribulation will begin. Various ones will cite the following from Jesus:

32 "But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father (Mark 13:32).

But is that proof that we cannot know about when it will occur?

No. There are several scriptural proofs, three of which I will bring up here now.

First of all, the Apostle Paul made it clear that true Christians would know about when it would occur:

1 But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. 2 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. 3 For when they say, "Peace and safety!" then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. 4 But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 5 You are all sons of light and sons of the day. We are not of the night nor of darkness. 6 Therefore let us not sleep, as others do, but let us watch and be sober. (1 Thessalonians 5:1-6)

And second of all, the disciples asked Jesus the sequence:

3 Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?" (Matthew 24:3)

Jesus did NOT respond with, there is nothing to look for, you cannot possibly know. Instead, notice what Jesus taught in response:

4 And Jesus answered and said to them: "Take heed that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many. 6 And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. 7 For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of sorrows. 9 Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake. 10 And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. 11 Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. 12 And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. 13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.

15 "Therefore when you see the 'abomination of desolation,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever reads, let him understand), 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17 Let him who is on the housetop not go down to take anything out of his house. 18 And let him who is in the field not go back to get his clothes. 19 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! 20 And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be (Matthew 24:4-21).

Thus, recent items such as earthquakes, economic turmoils, and food shortages should, at most, be considered as related to “the beginning of sorrows” (which may or may not yet have started in their final intensity) and not the “great tribulation” itself. The “great tribulation” does NOT begin until verse 21. And while “tribulation” is involved in verse 9, this seems to be referring the persecuting tribulation that true Philadelphia Christians will face just prior to the great tribulation. But when the sacrifices stop and the abomination is set up (Daniel 9:27; 11:31), it will be time for the faithful to flee (see also There is a Place of Safety for the Philadelphians. Why it May Be Petra).

FWIW, I have suspected that the beginning of sorrows may have begun on September 19, 2009 or shortly thereafter. During the Feast of Tabernacles, in the first week of October in 2009, a sense came over me that something just happened. Like what? That we were then in the 'beginning of sorrows." I had not been watching the news, but sensed that it either began right then or perhaps it had began on the Feast of Trumpets that year.

After returning from the Feast of Tabernacles, I did some research to look to see if any major ecumenical event could have happened around then.

Well, there was a meeting of the Eastern Orthodox that included that date which seemed to embrace the ecumenical agenda of the white horseman of Revelation 6:1-2. And that seemed to be consistent with the first sorrow Jesus mentioned in Matthew 24:4-5. I perhaps should mention that I also told the presiding evangelist of my former church in November of 2009, that the beginning of sorrows may have started on September 19, 2009 or shortly thereafter, and then that church put out several writings that the beginning of sorrows had begun.

During the period of September 15-22, 2009, the Eastern Orthodox held a significant pan-Orthodox conference; working towards unity was one of the objectives (World Council of Churches Inter-Orthodox Preparatory Consultation Towards the International Ecumenical Peace Convocation (IEPC) Leros, Greece. 15-22 September 2009). Notice the following from an official Eastern Orthodox website:

1. Responding to the invitation of the World Council of Churches (WCC) to offer a theological contribution to the process leading to the 2011 International Ecumenical Peace Convocation (IEPC) in Kingston, Jamaica, an Inter-Orthodox Preparatory Consultation was held in the island of Leros, Greece, 15-22 September 2009.

2. The gathering was graciously hosted, on behalf of His All Holiness Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew, by H.E. Metropolitan Paisios of Leros, Kalymnos and Astypalaia, in the Dodecanese islands, Greece.

3. The meeting brought together twenty-five participants from nearly all Eastern Orthodox and Oriental Orthodox Churches, hierarchs, priests, members of monastic communities, university professors, lay persons male and female, and WCC staff. (World Council of Churches. Inter-Orthodox Preparatory Consultation Towards the International Ecumenical Peace Convocation (IEPC) Leros, Greece. 15-22 September 2009. 09/22/09 https://www.patriarchate.org/world-council-of-churches/-/asset_publisher/jSr7xbXp3kBW/content/world-council-of-churches-inter-orthodox-preparatory-consultation-towards-the-international-ecumenical-peace-convocation-iepc-leros-greece-15-22-septe)

By itself, the meeting did not seem like too much, but it was partially in response to the World Council of Churches. Later Orthodox statements and developments have demonstrated that it might have been quite important.

After that meeting. 0n October 15, 2009, the Vatican’s then top ecumenical official reported:

The official dialogue between the Catholic Church and the mainline Protestant Churches — Anglican, Lutheran, Reformed and Methodist — is entering a new phase, says the president of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity. Cardinal Walter Kasper pointed this out Thursday during a press conference at the Vatican…(Cardinal Kasper on 40 Years of Dialogue Says Catholic-Protestant Relations Entering New Phase.Zenit, October 16, 2009)

Notice this was called “a new phase” in the official dialogue, suggesting that major changes were occurring. On the next day, the Vatican and the Orthodox began a new round of ecumenical negotiations.

The eleventh meeting of the Joint International Commission for Theological Dialogue between the Orthodox Church and the Roman Catholic Church took place in Paphos, Cyprus, a city with a rich history, having received three Apostles, Paul, Barnabas and Mark. The meeting took place from 16-23 October 2009…The Orthodox meeting discussed among other things the negative reactions to the Dialogue by certain Orthodox circles, and unanimously considered them as totally unfounded and unacceptable, providing false and misleading information. (Comminique. JOINT INTERNATIONAL COMMISSION FOR THEOLOGICAL DIALOGUE BETWEEN THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH AND THE ORTHODOX CHURCH. 11TH PLENARY SESSION.Paphos, Cyprus, 16-23 October 2009. Paphos, Cyprus, 22 October 2009. http://www.ec-patr.org/docdisplay.php?lang=en&id=1124&tla=en).

The International Mixed Commission for Theological Dialogue Between the Catholic Church and the Orthodox Church has progressed in its reflection on the role of the bishop of Rome. The meeting was attended by 20 Catholic members; all Orthodox Churches were represented, with the exception of the Patriarchate of Bulgaria. The commission worked under the guidance of two co-presidents: the Catholic representative was Cardinal Walter Kasper, president of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity; and the Orthodox representative was Metropolitan Ioannis Zizioulas of Pergamum. (Orthodox-Catholic Commission Studies Primacy of Peter Concludes 11th Plenary Session in Paphos.Zenit, October 23, 2009)

Because of these actions, I have speculated that the ‘beginning of sorrows’ that Jesus spoke of (Matthew 24:4-8) may have actually began on or near September 19, 2009–during the WCC and Eastern Orthodox meeting. The actions of Patriarch Bartholomew may have triggered this.

Consider that this first seal is to be (or even was) opened around the time when the one who will become the False Prophet successfully works with groups which will re-connect with Rome. At least one significant re-connection happened in 2009 with some of the Anglicans (Messia H, Hanna J. Vatican welcomes Anglicans into Catholic Church. CNN, October 21, 2009. http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/europe/10/20/vatican.anglican.church/ viewed 10/25/09). This has been followed by one or more declarations involving the Lutherans, Eastern Orthodox, and others related tothe Church of Rome. Expect to see more declarations/deals beyond those which have already happened.

Interestingly, years later, on September 20, 2016, a Catholic publication referred to Patriarch Bartholomew as a "great ecumenist" (see Patriarch Bartholomew praised as a ‘great ecumenist’–will this end in disaster?). The sun-worshiping Roman Emperor Constantine is considered “great” for his compromising and blending of religions. He claimed to see a vision of the sun-god and then later a cross in the sky. Constantine impacted world history and the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople seems to be as well, though a but more subtly as far as the world is concerned. Could Patriarch Bartholomew tipped the scales for many of the Eastern Orthodox to work towards ecumenical unity at that time? It certainly seems so.

With all the troubles we have had, we certainly seem to be in the beginning of sorrows. Signs and wonders are expected (2 Thessalonians 2:9-11) and this may be what helps drive other religions without a Greco-Roman background to be “conquered” by the first horseman (cf. Revelation 18:23).

Now third of all, notice also Jesus' words:

13 "Watch therefore, for you know neither the day nor the hour in which the Son of Man is coming. (Matthew 25:13)

36 Watch therefore, and pray always that you may be counted worthy to escape all these things that will come to pass, and to stand before the Son of Man. (Luke 21:36)

3 Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you. (Revelation 3:3)

33 Take heed, watch and pray; for you do not know when the time is. 34 It is like a man going to a far country, who left his house and gave authority to his servants, and to each his work, and commanded the doorkeeper to watch. 35 Watch therefore, for you do not know when the master of the house is coming — in the evening, at midnight, at the crowing of the rooster, or in the morning — 36 lest, coming suddenly, he find you sleeping. 37 And what I say to you, I say to all: Watch! (Mark 13:33-37)

So, Jesus said to watch, because otherwise we would not know. In Mark's account, He said this RIGHT AFTER saying He did not then know the date and hour. Thus, if we watch as He taught, we certainly can have an idea that the great tribulation is close--otherwise Jesus would not have repeatedly stated to His followers to watch.

Since the "time of Jacob's trouble" (Jeremiah 30:7) first affects the descendants of Jacob (and particularly, Ephraim and Manasseh, see Anglo - America in Prophecy), it would be expected that the USA and some of its Anglo-allies will be first weakened during the "beginning of sorrows." And we have seen some of this already. Because many DO NOT understand the modern identity of Jacob's descendants, they do not realize the significance of the final time of the Gentiles. The past couple of centuries have been dominated by the descendants of Jacob's on Joseph, British-Ephraim and the American-Manasseh. But that will change.

(About the time to flee, which is after the beginning of sorrows has been going on for years, Michael will stand up and then the great tribulation will follow, "At that time Michael shall stand up, The great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people; And there shall be a time of trouble, Such as never was since there was a nation, Even to that time. And at that time your people shall be delivered, Every one who is found written in the book" Daniel 12:1.)

Notice Luke's and Mark's accounts of the beginning of sorrows:

8 And He said: "Take heed that you not be deceived. For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am He,' and, 'The time has drawn near.' Therefore do not go after them. 9 But when you hear of wars and commotions, do not be terrified; for these things must come to pass first, but the end will not come immediately." 10 Then He said to them, "Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. 11 And there will be great earthquakes in various places, and famines and pestilences; and there will be fearful sights and great signs from heaven. (Luke 21: 8-11)

5 And Jesus, answering them, began to say: "Take heed that no one deceives you. 6 For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am He,' and will deceive many. 7 But when you hear of wars and rumors of wars, do not be troubled; for such things must happen, but the end is not yet. 8 For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be earthquakes in various places, and there will be famines and troubles. These are the beginnings of sorrows (Mark 13:5-8).

Jesus spoke of events starting with the beginning of sorrows/troubles, then the great tribulation and the day of the Lord, and then His return in places like Matthew 24. He said that a particular generation would see all these events, and that generation which has seen the start of the beginning of sorrows would seem to be that generation.

In Mark's account the great "tribulation" does not start until verse 19 (essentially after the same events as Matthew's account lists). Economic recessions and even depressions can be considered as "troubles."

Even secular sources warn that things are lining up for famines and major disruptions in the first half of the 21st century. Notice one such source from March 19, 2009:

Food and energy shortages will create 'perfect storm', says Prof John Beddington

Growing populations, falling energy sources and food shortages will create the "perfect storm" by 2030, the government's chief scientist Professor John Beddington has said.

The demand for resources will create a crisis with dire consequences, Prof Beddington predicts.
Demand for food and energy will jump 50 per cent by 2030 and for fresh water by 30 per cent, as the global population tops 8.3 billion, he is due to tell a conference in London.

Climate change will exacerbate matters in unpredictable ways, he will add.

"It's a perfect storm," Prof Beddington will tell the Sustainable Development UK 09 conference… Prof Beddington said the "storm" would create war, unrest and mass migration…

He said food reserves are at a 50-year low but the world requires 50 per cent more energy, food and water by 2030.

Prof Beddington said climate change would mean Northern Europe would become new key centres for food production and other areas would need to use more advanced pesticides.

The United Nations Environment Programme predicts widespread water shortages across Africa, Europe and Asia by 2025. The amount of fresh water available per head of the population is expected to decline sharply in that time.

(Alleyne R. Food and energy shortages will create 'perfect storm', says Prof John Beddington. Telegraph, March 19, 2009. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthnews/5015051/Food-and-energy-shortages-will-create-perfect-storm-says-Prof-John-Beddington.html viewed 03/19/08)

During this time, physical preparation, while not as helpful as spiritual preparation, does make sense. We all know the Bible prophecies famines. Should we do something physically? See, Physical Preparation Scriptures for Christians. Various pestilences, food shortages, and terrors are expected PRIOR to the Great Tribulation (see also Fourth Horseman of the Apocalypse).

Perhaps it should be mentioned that there are at least 13 Ways President Donald Trump has been is Apocalyptic (watch also Trump Presidency Magic 8 Ball or Bible Prophecy?). The end is getting near, especially for the Anglo-American nations (see also Anglo - America in Prophecy) but is not yet.

Sometime during the beginning of sorrows, a prince will start to rise up who will be the final biblical King of the North. The Orthodox seem to realize that he may be identified around then. Near the end of the 4th century, there was an exchange between two important Orthodox leaders pertaining to the beginning of sorrows:

Epiphanius: When will come the end of the world? What are the ‘beginning of sorrows’ and when shall they take place? From what signs and events shall humanity be able to know that the end of the world is near and what signs will be manifest?...

Andrew the Fool-for-Christ: Now son, how can I relate to you without tears the events of the beginning of sorrows and the end of the world? During the End Times, God will reveal as King a certain poor man … This king will rule ... Happiness will reign in the world as it did in the days of Noah. People will become very rich ... The entire world will fear this king ... he will pursue all persons of the Jewish religion out of Constantinople ... and the people will rejoice like in the time of Noah until the deluge came (Tzima Otto, pp. 111, 113,114)

So, some ancient Orthodox writings indicate that the Great Monarch will rise up during the time of the beginning of sorrows—and that is correct--and he will go right into the time of the Great Tribulation and the Day of the Lord. The comment about “persons of Jewish religion” may refer to persecution of the Nazarene sect as Orthodox and Roman Catholics have often indicated that those with Nazarene practices are actually Jews pretending to be Christian. However, it also needs to be understood, that while the above Orthodox discussion indicates that having things as they were in the days of Noah is a positive thing, the Bible warns that this occurrence comes after the tribulation has began and is a sign that Jesus is about to return (Matthew 24:37-44).

There is also something, from the Book of Ezekiel, that seems to begin during the beginning of sorrows (famine and pestilences) and last until the Great Tribulation (the start of Jacob's trouble, which likely will begin with an attack on the Anglo-nations, please see Daniel 11:39 and Anglo - America in Prophecy & the Lost Tribes of Israel):

15 'So it shall be a reproach, a taunt, a lesson, and an astonishment to the nations that are all around you, when I execute judgments among you in anger and in fury and in furious rebukes. I, the Lord, have spoken. 16 When I send against them the terrible arrows of famine which shall be for destruction, which I will send to destroy you, I will increase the famine upon you and cut off your supply of bread. 17 So I will send against you famine and wild beasts, and they will bereave you. Pestilence and blood shall pass through you, and I will bring the sword against you. I, the Lord, have spoken.'" (Ezekiel 5:15-17)

So, it may be that the Anglo-nations will experience some real hunger as well as disease and/or other pestilences (that could possibly at least partially be triggered by excessive reliance on genetically-modified organisms as part of their agricultural production--for more details, see the Fourth Horseman of the Apocalypse) that will weaken them enough so that the USA and its Anglo-allies will then be considered attackable by some of their enemies.

Israel and 'This Generation'

Israel became independent on May 14, 1948, and this was officially recognized May 1, 1949. This independence has affected the views of many Protestants related to prophecy. Many base a lot of their prophetic understandings on it.

Many Protestants believe that the modern nation Israel, along with Jews scattered around the world, is ALL OF ISRAEL.

As shown by other scriptures (e.g. Genesis 48:11,15-16,19-20; cf. 1 Chronicles 5:1-2), the name Israel was to be placed on the descendants of Joseph–this made 13 tribes (see also Anglo - America in Prophecy & the Lost Tribes of Israel). Later, the Bible shows that God separated ten tribes of Israel (1 Kings 11:31) from those of Judah (1 Kings 12:20).

Yet, it was prophesied that most would call the Jews ‘Israel’:

1 Hear this, O house of Jacob, Who are called by the name of Israel, And have come forth from the wellsprings of Judah (Isaiah 48:1)

This has happened today.

However, because of not understanding other scriptures, many overlook the scriptures that teach that there are other tribes of Israel in other places. Notice the following from the New Testament:

1 James, a bondservant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, To the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad: Greetings. (James 1:1)

So, the idea that there were still other tribes that were not in the area of Judea/Palestine was still recognized in the New Testament.

What might any of this to do with the nation now called Israel?

Some, mainly Protestants, have pointed to the formation of the small nation of Israel as the fulfillment of many end time prophecies. And this has frequently been overstated. Many consider that the final generation to see the great tribulation and Jesus' return started with 1948.

The Christian Research Journal published the following:

Many Christians in the United States believe that it is their biblical responsibility to support the contemporary Jewish State of Israel for specific theological reasons (as opposed to general political ones), a view known as Christian Zionism. The Pew Research Center put the figure at 63 percent for white evangelicals. This view holds that the regathering of Jewish people to Israel since 1948 is the miraculous fulfillment of God’s promises to Abraham to establish Israel as a nation forever in Palestine. Tim LaHaye’s Left Behind novels, together with books written by Hal Lindsey, Pat Robertson, and many others, which propound this view, have sold well over 100 million copies. …

A growing number of Christians, however, are left increasingly uneasy about the idea that God would bring the Jewish people back to Palestine while they are in unbelief, since that was why they were exiled from it in the first place. The methods Israel has used, moreover, to colonize the land and subjugate the Palestinians— many of whom are Christians—do not match the picture of a God‐fearing Israel that Christian Zionists find in their literal interpretation of the ancient prophecies.

(Christian Research Journal, volume 29, number 06, 2006 http://www.equip.org/article/modern-israel-in-bible-prophecy-promised-return-or-impending-exile/#christian-books-1 accessed 04/18/15)

In other words, many Protestants believe this even though Protestants writers have made claims that are not backed up by the literal interpretation of the prophecies in the Bible.

Many claim that the Jews returning to that land from around the world fulfills biblical prophecies. Here is one such claim:

What the scriptures say (just a few of them-more at the end):

Isaiah 43
5 Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your children from the east and gather you from the west.
6 I will say to the north, `Give them up!’ and to the south, `Do not hold them back.’ Bring my sons from afar and my daughters from the ends of the earth-

In Isaiah 43:5-6, the prophet said that the people of Israel would return to their homeland from the east, the west, the north and the south. Isaiah lived 2700 years ago. Beginning at that time, a succession of empires conquered the land of Israel and forced many into exile. This led to a worldwide scattering of Jews. But, during the past century, millions have returned to Israel.–

Jeremiah 23:3-6
“I myself will gather the remnant of my flock out of all the countries where I have driven them and will bring them back to their pasture, where they will be fruitful and increase in number. I will place shepherds over them who will tend them, and they will no longer be afraid or terrified, nor will any be missing,” declares the Lord. “The days are coming,” declares the Lord, “when I will raise up to David a righteous Branch, a King who will reign wisely and do what is just and right in the land. In his days Judah will be saved and Israel will live in safety. This is the name by which he will be called: The Lord Our Righteousness. https://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/jewish-return-to-israel-in-end-times/ accessed 04/18/15

But, people in the modern nation of Israel are afraid, David has not been raised up as king of Israel, and only a relatively small percentage of the total Israelite-descended population has ended up in the nation of Israel. The same source as the above had the following:

… 93.5% of Jews in the world will end up in Israel by 2012. I wonder how true this will turn out to be…….. https://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/jewish-return-to-israel-in-end-times/ accessed 04/18/15

That prediction was in error. It is currently estimated that there are between about 14 to 18 million Jews (and I suspect much higher, along with at least hundreds of millions of descendants of Israel from the other tribes), with about 6 million living in the nation of Israel.

Even ignoring the other tribes of Israel, it is clear that since most Jews do not live in Israel, that the prophecies some interpret related to the Jews returning to Israel are in error. These particular prophecies are for a time after the Great Tribulation (see Will the Anglo-Saxon Nations be Divided and Have People Taken as Slaves?) and not prior to it as certain Protestants have claimed.

Notice also another claim from an article titled 10 Prophecies Fulfilled in 1948:

The people of Israel would return to “their own land”

Bible passage: Ezekiel 34:13
Written: between 593-571 BC
Fulfilled: after May 14, 1948

In Ezekiel 34:13, the prophet said that God would gather the people of Israel scattered throughout the world and bring them back to “their own land.” After many centuries of dispersion, hundreds of thousands of Jews returned to their ancient homeland beginning in the late 1800s. But, millions more returned after Israel declared independence in 1948. In other words, millions of exiles returned to their ancient homeland which was now truly “their own land” in the sense that it was now a sovereign Jewish state. (10 Prophecies Fulfilled in 1948 Last Updated: 07/31/2013 21:28 http://watchmanbiblestudy.com/articles/1948propheciesfulfilled.htm accessed 04/18/15)

But is what happened in Israel a possible fulfillment?

No.

Notice the verse mentioned above then others:

13 And I will bring them out from the peoples and gather them from the countries, and will bring them to their own land; I will feed them on the mountains of Israel, in the valleys and in all the inhabited places of the country. 14 I will feed them in good pasture, and their fold shall be on the high mountains of Israel. There they shall lie down in a good fold and feed in rich pasture on the mountains of Israel. 15 I will feed My flock, and I will make them lie down,” says the Lord God. 16 “I will seek what was lost and bring back what was driven away, bind up the broken and strengthen what was sick; but I will destroy the fat and the strong, and feed them in judgment.”

17 ‘And as for you, O My flock, thus says the Lord God: “Behold, I shall judge between sheep and sheep, between rams and goats. 18 Is it too little for you to have eaten up the good pasture, that you must tread down with your feet the residue of your pasture — and to have drunk of the clear waters, that you must foul the residue with your feet? 19 And as for My flock, they eat what you have trampled with your feet, and they drink what you have fouled with your feet.”

20 ‘Therefore thus says the Lord God to them: “Behold, I Myself will judge between the fat and the lean sheep. 21 Because you have pushed with side and shoulder, butted all the weak ones with your horns, and scattered them abroad, 22 therefore I will save My flock, and they shall no longer be a prey; and I will judge between sheep and sheep. 23 I will establish one shepherd over them, and he shall feed them — My servant David. He shall feed them and be their shepherd. 24 And I, the Lord, will be their God, and My servant David a prince among them; I, the Lord, have spoken.

25 “I will make a covenant of peace with them, and cause wild beasts to cease from the land; and they will dwell safely in the wilderness and sleep in the woods. 26 I will make them and the places all around My hill a blessing; and I will cause showers to come down in their season; there shall be showers of blessing. 27 Then the trees of the field shall yield their fruit, and the earth shall yield her increase. They shall be safe in their land; and they shall know that I am the Lord, when I have broken the bands of their yoke and delivered them from the hand of those who enslaved them. 28 And they shall no longer be a prey for the nations, nor shall beasts of the land devour them; but they shall dwell safely, and no one shall make them afraid. 29 I will raise up for them a garden of renown, and they shall no longer be consumed with hunger in the land, nor bear the shame of the Gentiles anymore. 30 Thus they shall know that I, the Lord their God, am with them, and they, the house of Israel, are My people,” says the Lord God.’” (Ezekiel 34:13-30)

The tiny nation of Israel since 1948 has NEVER truly dwelled safely. Furthermore, Israel is regularly ‘shamed’ by Gentiles via United Nations’ resolutions, terrorism, and various international statements and actions.

But most importantly, overwhelmingly number of Jews in Israel do not know the true God now as God. This has NOT yet been fulfilled, but will be later (see also Will the Anglo-Saxon Nations be Divided and Have People Taken as Slaves?).

What about the nation of Israel supposedly fulfilling the prophecies claimed to be related to Jesus’ parable of the fig tree?

Here are comments from two Protestant/Baptist prophecy interpreters:

Prophecy, … why is the subject so popular today? One word: Israel.

You see, none of the prophecies concerning the end times were relevant — much less understood — until Israel became a nation again in 1948.

In His parable concerning the fig tree, Jesus told His disciples that when it begins to put forth leaves, they would know that summer is near. In the same way, He said that the generation that saw all of the signs He listed occurring within the same time span, and increasing in frequency and intensity, should recognize that His coming is near.

Many of those “signs” involved the nation of Israel. But before there actually existed a nation of Israel, none of them made sense. (Lindsey H. The Hal Lindsey Report. 11-01-2013. http://www.hallindsey.com/the-hal-lindsey-report-11012013/)

And there is one main event in bible prophecy that had to happen to usher in the time that the bible calls the “Last Days”, or the “time of Jacob’s trouble”, and that event happened on May 14, 1948 … ”Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer [is] nigh: So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, [even] at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.”

Matthew 24:32-34

This is what’s known as the Fig Tree Prophecy. (The Fig Tree Prophecy of Matthew 24: How The Rebirth of Israel Signals The Last Days. http://www.nowtheendbegins.com/pages/the_fig_tree_prophecy.htm viewed 05/06/14)

Israel the fig tree has put forth its leaves and been reborn as a nation therefore the coming of Christ draws near. Luke 21:32 also states that a generation would not pass. A generation is between 70-100 years, Israel was established again on May 15, 1948. Jews are still immigrating back to Israel from nations far and wide, just like the Bible said they would. https://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/jewish-return-to-israel-in-end-times/ accessed 04/18/15

Here is one of the passages of scripture that certain ones believe relate to the 1948 formation of the State of Israel:

2 One basket had very good figs, like the figs that are first ripe; and the other basket had very bad figs which could not be eaten, they were so bad. 3 Then the Lord said to me, “What do you see, Jeremiah?”

And I said, “Figs, the good figs, very good; and the bad, very bad, which cannot be eaten, they are so bad.”

4 Again the word of the Lord came to me, saying, 5 “Thus says the Lord, the God of Israel: ‘Like these good figs, so will I acknowledge those who are carried away captive from Judah, whom I have sent out of this place for their own good, into the land of the Chaldeans. (Jeremiah 24:2-5)

Notice that the above ties Israel with figs, but only claims to bring the good figs back. Although I have seen the above shown as scriptural evidence that Jesus’ parable of the fig tree relates to the modern nation of Israel (https://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/jewish-return-to-israel-in-end-times/ accessed 04/18/15), that makes little sense as the modern Jews do not seem to be any closer to God than those in Jeremiah’s time. Furthermore, look at the other passages that follow:

6 For I will set My eyes on them for good, and I will bring them back to this land; I will build them and not pull them down, and I will plant them and not pluck them up. 7 Then I will give them a heart to know Me, that I am the Lord; and they shall be My people, and I will be their God, for they shall return to Me with their whole heart. (Jeremiah 24:6-7)

The above clearly has not happened. Not only has the nation of Israel NOT returned to God with their whole heart, that nation has also lost some of the land that it had in various ‘peace’ negotiations. Jewish settlers have been plucked up. Hence it is not appropriate to tie Jeremiah 24:2-7 to the modern nation of Israel.

Now why would anyone try? Well they do to attempt to prove that the nation of Israel is the fig tree that Jesus referred to in the gospels. Here is what Jesus said:

32 “Now learn this parable from the fig tree: When its branch has already become tender and puts forth leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 So you also, when you see all these things, know that it is near — at the doors! 34 Assuredly, I say to you, this generation will by no means pass away till all these things take place. 35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will by no means pass away. (Matthew 24:32-35)

28 “Now learn this parable from the fig tree: When its branch has already become tender, and puts forth leaves, you know that summer is near. 29 So you also, when you see these things happening, know that it is near — at the doors! 30 Assuredly, I say to you, this generation will by no means pass away till all these things take place. (Mark 13:28-30)

29 Then He spoke to them a parable: “Look at the fig tree, and all the trees. 30 When they are already budding, you see and know for yourselves that summer is now near. 31 So you also, when you see these things happening, know that the kingdom of God is near. 32 Assuredly, I say to you, this generation will by no means pass away till all things take place. (Luke 21:29-32)

We will get to what the “all things” Jesus referred to were. Before going there directly, perhaps it should be mentioned that although he believed that the 1948 recognition by the UN was a prophesied prophetic event, the late Protestant/Baptist scholar Dr. Walvoord wrote:

Matthew 24:32-35; Mark 13:28-21; Luke 21:29-33 … A common interpretation has been to interpret the fig tree as a type of Israel and the revival of Israel as the budding of the fig tree … there is no scriptural basis (Walvoord JF. Prophecy Handbook. Victor Books, 1990, pp. 390-391)

Not only was Dr. Walvoord correct that there is no scriptural basis, I will take it a step further. Unless a generation is over 70 years, it is NOT POSSIBLE THAT THE FORMATION OF THE STATE OF ISRAEL IN 1948 FULFILLED THE PARABLE OF THE FIG TREE IN MATTHEW, MARK, OR LUKE.

Why?

Jesus noted that the events in Matthew 24. Mark 13, and Luke 21 would all happen within the same generation. Biblically, a generation was normally considered only 30 or 40 years according to what seems to be Smith’s Bible Dictionary’s understanding of Job 42:16 (Smith W. Smith’s Bible Dictionary. Originally written 1863, Hendrickson Publishers, p. 211). Here is that scripture:

16 After this Job lived one hundred and forty years, and saw his children and grandchildren for four generations. (Job 42:16)

Essentially, 140 years divided by four generations equals what may be considered 35 years per generation, with 40 years more probable as that would make the grandchild of the last generation 20 years of age.

Even if a generation is biblically longer, it would not seem to be over 70 years or maybe 80:

10 The days of our lives are seventy years;
And if by reason of strength they are eighty years,
Yet their boast is only labor and sorrow;
For it is soon cut off, and we fly away. (Psalms 90:10)

70 years would seem to be the maximum length of a biblical generation. Since the Great Tribulation cannot possibly start prior to 2022 (and likely later) and Jesus cannot return until 3 1/2 years later, if Jesus reference to “this generation” meant 70 years or less, then it is not possible that the view that the formation of the State of Israel was the first sign to count the fulfillment of much of Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 could be biblically possible.

Getting back to Jesus’ statements about the parable of the fig tree, in the gospel account He specifically says that you need to look at the signs He listed earlier.

So, let’s look at the account in Matthew 24:

4 And Jesus answered and said to them: “Take heed that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many. 6 And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. 7 For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.

9 “Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. 10 And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. 11 Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. 12 And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. 13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved.

14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.

15 “Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand), 16 “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. (Matthew 24:4-15)

Some have apparently concluded that the State of Israel needed to form for the event in verse 15 to occur. And while that may well be, that was not the first of the items to be fulfilled in "this generation." The generation either starts with the start of the “beginning of sorrows” or verse 9. And because Jesus said, "this generation will by no means pass away till all these things take place" (Matthew 24:34), and those things included the sorrows, this really does not point the formation of the nation of Israel as the starting point.

As I wrote years ago, I have suspected that the beginning of sorrows may have begun on September 19, 2009 or shortly thereafter. There was an meeting of certain leaders in the Eastern Orthodox church around then that seemed to embrace the ecumenical agenda of the white horseman of Revelation 6:1-2, which is consistent with the first sorrow Jesus mentioned in Matthew 24:4-5. I perhaps should mentioned that I also told the presiding evangelist of my former church in November of 2009, that the beginning of sorrows may have started on September 19, 2009 or the next month, and not too long thereafter that church put out several writings stating that the beginning of sorrows had began.

If the beginning of sorrows began in 2009, then there is time in “this generation” to see the signs further fulfilled. The ecumenical agenda has really been pushed since that time, which is a sign that many Protestants have difficulty seeing. Certain Protestants have sadly also accepted that agenda themselves (e.g. Kenneth Copeland, Joel Osteen, Rick Warren, etc.).

Notice the following that may have necessitated having an Israeli nation in the Palestine/Judea region:

31 And forces shall be mustered by him, and they shall defile the sanctuary fortress; then they shall take away the daily sacrifices, and place there the abomination of desolation. (Daniel 11:31)

This is something that Jesus did refer to in Matthew 24:15. Of course, that prophecy about the sacrifices stopping will not be fulfilled until after the sacrifices are resumed, which having a Jewish nation could (and at some point in time will) do (see also Why is a Jewish Temple in Jerusalem Not Required?).

So, while the formation of the State of Israel was needed for the fulfillment of some aspects of prophecy, the 1948 formation itself did NOT trigger the time of “this generation.” However, it may well be that the events for the generation that Jesus spoke, started to formally occur around ten or so years ago.

But to claim that a ‘generation’ needs to be over 70 years is a stretch that I do not believe should be looked at related to Israel in 1948. The start of the nation of Israel, because of its allusion in Matthew 24:15, was not the start of sorrows. The prophecies in Jeremiah and Ezekiel do not possibly point to what happened when Israel was formed in 1948.

Jesus is coming and Bible prophecy will be fulfilled. But do not rely on ‘traditions’ that are not in full accordance with the Bible.

A video of related interest is titled Israel, 1948, and Prophecy.

The Great Tribulation: Final Time of the Gentiles, then Jesus Returns

When the Great Tribulation starts it will not be a good time for the USA or its Anglo-Allies (see also Anglo - America in Prophecy).

Many will be complacent and not really think it will happen, but that will be a mistake:

9 Rise up, you women who are at ease, Hear my voice; You complacent daughters,Give ear to my speech. 10 In a year and some days You will be troubled, you complacent women; For the vintage will fail, The gathering will not come. 11 Tremble, you women who are at ease; Be troubled, you complacent ones; Strip yourselves, make yourselves bare, And gird sackcloth on your waists. 12 People shall mourn upon their breasts For the pleasant fields, for the fruitful vine. 13 On the land of my people will come up thorns and briers, Yes, on all the happy homes in the joyous city; 14 Because the palaces will be forsaken, The bustling city will be deserted. The forts and towers will become lairs forever, A joy of wild donkeys, a pasture of flocks — (Isaiah 32:9-14)

14 The sinners in Zion are afraid;
Fearfulness has seized the hypocrites:
"Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire?
Who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings? (Isaiah 33:14)

The "sinners in Zion" looks like a reference to Laodiceans and/or descendants of Israel. It is against "an hypocritical nation" that God will send the European Assyria to punish (Isaiah 10:6, KJV. Note: The same root Hebrew word is in both Isaiah 10:6 and 33:14 for 'hypocrite').

While it is important not to discount that the Great Tribulation is coming, one should also not believe it is coming before it can (cf. Revelation 22:18-19).

Notice the following:

The fifth seal pictures a time of great tribulation — including a martyrdom for religious convictions. The New Testament, along with Revelation, emphasizes its impact on the spiritual people of God — his own Church. The great tribulation also falls on what was God's physical nation — the House of Israel, or the descendants of Jacob's 12 sons. Jeremiah wrote of this period and the events that immediately follow. He cried out: "Alas! For that day is great, so that none is like it; and it is the time of Jacob's trouble" (Jeremiah 30:7). Daniel called it "a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation" (Daniel 12:1). It is the same time described by Jesus in Matthew 24:21. This distress would climax in the death of mankind if Christ failed to intervene in human affairs (verse 22). Immediately following the great tribulation of the fifth seal come the cosmic disturbances of the sixth seal. These herald the beginning of the very last days. As Robert H. Mounce put it, this is the "grim announcement that the end of the world was at hand." (Inside the Book of Revelation Ambassador College Production)

Notice what happens during the “great tribulation” according to Jesus:

22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect's sake those days will be shortened. 23 Then if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or 'There!' do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand. 26 Therefore if they say to you, 'Look, He is in the desert!' do not go out; or 'Look, He is in the inner rooms!' do not believe it. 27 For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. 28 For wherever the carcass is, there the eagles will be gathered together (Matthew 24:22-28).

And that it starts with the fifth seal of Revelation:

9 When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, "How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?" 11 Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed. (Revelation 6:9-11)

Notice that the fifth seal is open and is related to persecutions. There are persecutions just before the Great Tribulation starts per Daniel 7:25a, 11:28-35; Revelation 12:13, and then during the time of the Great Tribulation per Daniel 7:25b, Revelation 12:17; 14:12-13. For more on persecution, please check out the article Persecutions by Church and State.

Notice more about what happens from the Book of Lamentations:

Notice the following from Jeremiah:

1 How lonely sits the city
That was full of people!
How like a widow is she,
Who was great among the nations!
The princess among the provinces
Has become a slave! (Lamentations 1:1)

5 Her adversaries have become the master,
Her enemies prosper;
For the Lord has afflicted her
Because of the multitude of her transgressions.
Her children have gone into captivity before the enemy. (Lamentations 1:5)

17 Zion spreads out her hands,
But no one comforts her;
The Lord has commanded concerning Jacob
That those around him become his adversaries; (Lamentations 1:17)

2 The Lord has swallowed up and has not pitied
All the dwelling places of Jacob.
He has thrown down in His wrath
The strongholds of the daughter of Judah;
He has brought them down to the ground;
He has profaned the kingdom and its princes.

3 He has cut off in fierce anger
Every horn of Israel;
He has drawn back His right hand
From before the enemy.
He has blazed against Jacob like a flaming fire
Devouring all around.

4 Standing like an enemy, He has bent His bow;
With His right hand, like an adversary,
He has slain all who were pleasing to His eye;
On the tent of the daughter of Zion,
He has poured out His fury like fire. (Lamentations 2:2-4)

11 My eyes fail with tears,
My heart is troubled;
My bile is poured on the ground
Because of the destruction of the daughter of my people,
Because the children and the infants
Faint in the streets of the city.

12 They say to their mothers,
“Where is grain and wine?”
As they swoon like the wounded
In the streets of the city,
As their life is poured out
In their mothers’ bosom. (Lamentations 2:11-12)

19 “Arise, cry out in the night, At the beginning of the watches; Pour out your heart like water before the face of the Lord. Lift your hands toward Him for the life of your young children, Who faint from hunger at the head of every street.” (Lamentations 2:19)

21 “Young and old lie
On the ground in the streets;
My virgins and my young men
Have fallen by the sword;
You have slain them in the day of Your anger,
You have slaughtered and not pitied. (Lamentations 2:21)

8 Now their appearance is blacker than soot;
They go unrecognized in the streets;
Their skin clings to their bones,
It has become as dry as wood.

9 Those slain by the sword are better off
Than those who die of hunger;
For these pine away,
Stricken for lack of the fruits of the field.

10 The hands of the compassionate women
Have cooked their own children;
They became food for them
In the destruction of the daughter of my people.

11 The Lord has fulfilled His fury,
He has poured out His fierce anger.
He kindled a fire in Zion,
And it has devoured its foundations. (Lamentations 4:8-11)

15 The joy of our heart has ceased;
Our dance has turned into mourning.
16 The crown has fallen from our head.
Woe to us, for we have sinned!
17 Because of this our heart is faint;
Because of these things our eyes grow dim; (Lamentations 5:15-17)

Since Jesus said this will be the greatest tribulation of all time, it will be at least as bad as what Jeremiah was inspired to write.

Although many in the Church of God have experienced economic and social persecution in their walk with Christ, future severe persecution, beginning first with the Philadelphia remnant of Christians, is expected (Daniel 7:25a, 11:28-35), it is then followed by persecution on all Christians once the Great Tribulation (Matthew 24:21) begins.

Is all hopeless?

No!

Jeremiah also wrote:

25 The Lord is good to those who wait for Him,
To the soul who seeks Him.
26 It is good that one should hope and wait quietly
For the salvation of the Lord. (Lamentations 3:25-26)

Although your nation probably will not repent (Anglo or otherwise), you can.

Some, but not most, Christians will be protected (cf. Revelation 3:7-17; 12:14-17)

While many like to focus on the idea that the Philadelphians will flee to a place of protection, it needs to be understood that there will apparently be a time of severe persecution just prior to the fleeing and the start of the Great Tribulation.

This will be also be a time of demonic signs and lying wonders (2 Thessalonians 2:7-12; Revelation 16:12-16; 13:13-15; 18:23; 19:20).

Notice some other accounts of events that will happen:

47 “Because you did not serve the Lord your God with joy and gladness of heart, for the abundance of everything, 48 therefore you shall serve your enemies, whom the Lord will send against you, in hunger, in thirst, in nakedness, and in need of everything; and He will put a yoke of iron on your neck until He has destroyed you. 49 The Lord will bring a nation against you from afar, from the end of the earth, as swift as the eagle flies, a nation whose language you will not understand, 50 a nation of fierce countenance, which does not respect the elderly nor show favor to the young. 51 And they shall eat the increase of your livestock and the produce of your land, until you are destroyed; they shall not leave you grain or new wine or oil, or the increase of your cattle or the offspring of your flocks, until they have destroyed you. (Deuteronomy 28:47-51)

16 Moreover He said to me, "Son of man, surely I will cut off the supply of bread in Jerusalem; they shall eat bread by weight and with anxiety, and shall drink water by measure and with dread, 17 that they may lack bread and water, and be dismayed with one another, and waste away because of their iniquity. (Ezekiel 4:16-17)

1 "And you, son of man, take a sharp sword, take it as a barber's razor, and pass it over your head and your beard; then take scales to weigh and divide the hair. 2 You shall burn with fire one-third in the midst of the city, when the days of the siege are finished; then you shall take one-third and strike around it with the sword, and one-third you shall scatter in the wind: I will draw out a sword after them. 3 You shall also take a small number of them and bind them in the edge of your garment. 4 Then take some of them again and throw them into the midst of the fire, and burn them in the fire. From there a fire will go out into all the house of Israel.

5 "Thus says the Lord God: 'This is Jerusalem; I have set her in the midst of the nations and the countries all around her. 6 She has rebelled against My judgments by doing wickedness more than the nations, and against My statutes more than the countries that are all around her; for they have refused My judgments, and they have not walked in My statutes.' 7 Therefore thus says the Lord God: 'Because you have multiplied disobedience more than the nations that are all around you, have not walked in My statutes nor kept My judgments, nor even done according to the judgments of the nations that are all around you' — 8 therefore thus says the Lord God: 'Indeed I, even I, am against you and will execute judgments in your midst in the sight of the nations. 9 And I will do among you what I have never done, and the like of which I will never do again, because of all your abominations. 10 Therefore fathers shall eat their sons in your midst, and sons shall eat their fathers; and I will execute judgments among you, and all of you who remain I will scatter to all the winds.

11 'Therefore, as I live,' says the Lord God, 'surely, because you have defiled My sanctuary with all your detestable things and with all your abominations, therefore I will also diminish you; My eye will not spare, nor will I have any pity. 12 One-third of you shall die of the pestilence, and be consumed with famine in your midst; and one-third shall fall by the sword all around you; and I will scatter another third to all the winds, and I will draw out a sword after them. (Ezekiel 5:1-12)

The bolded portion is consistent with Jesus' comments in Matthew 24:21 and Mark 13:19, hence much of the above has to do with the Great Tribulation.

Yet, despite what some think, the Great Tribulation will initially mainly be directed to those who are descended from Jacob/Israel:

6 Ask now, and see,
Whether a man is ever in labor with child?
So why do I see every man with his hands on his loins
Like a woman in labor,
And all faces turned pale?
7 Alas! For that day is great,
So that none is like it;
And it is the time of Jacob’s trouble,
But he shall be saved out of it. (Jeremiah 30:6-7)

25… Gentiles, who do not know You…they have eaten up Jacob, Devoured him and consumed him, And made his dwelling place desolate. (Jeremiah 10:25)

So, we see that Gentiles will consume Jacob/Israel. The descendants of which have been the dominant peoples in the USA, UK, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand (see also Anglo – America in Prophecy & the Lost Tribes of Israel).

The final time of the Gentiles coincides with the time of the Great Tribulation and the time of Jacob's troubles.

Let's look at the following prophecies from the Old and New Testaments:

23 ‘Make a chain,
For the land is filled with crimes of blood,
And the city is full of violence.
24 Therefore I will bring the worst of the Gentiles,
And they will possess their houses;
I will cause the pomp of the strong to cease,
And their holy places shall be defiled.
25 Destruction comes;
They will seek peace, but there shall be none. (Ezekiel 7:23-25)

23 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people. 24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. (Luke 21:23-24)

2 But leave out the court which is outside the temple, and do not measure it, for it has been given to the Gentiles. And they will tread the holy city underfoot for forty-two months. (Revelation 11:2)

Notice that Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Jesus (whose words are recorded in Luke), and John (who penned Revelation) were talking about the same time. Also notice that “it is the time of Jacob’s trouble” and that the “Gentiles” are dominating. This means those that are descended from Israel or have the name of Jacob (cf. Genesis 48:14-16) will be mainly be trampled. One of the peoples that God says He will use to punish the descendants of Israel, Assyria (Isaiah 10:5-11), are a Gentile people–they will normally lead during the time of the Gentiles. This will be a terrible time.

Here is some of what the old Radio Church of God taught about it:

In Jesus’ prophecy in Matthew 24, He was answering the question about the TIME of the end of the world, and the second coming of Christ to rule the world.

WHOSE Tribulation?

Next, WHOSE trouble will this be? WHO will plunge the world into it? We have the what and the when. Now notice the who! The prophet Jeremiah speaks of this SAME time of greatest trouble. “For lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the Eternal : and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it” (Jer, 30: 3)…

Continue Jeremiah’s prophecy: “For thus saith the Eternal: we have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace. A TIME OF WAR! “Alas! for that day is GREAT, so that none is like it. Notice-the same GREATEST time of trouble-so great that NONE IS LIKE IT! Now , upon WHOM? ” .. it is even the time of JACOB’ S TROUBLE but he shall be delivered out of it (Jer. 30: 5,7). It is a world trouble UPON JACOB! …

No WHO is Jacob? …

Who is Jacob today? …

One of the original twelve tribes, Joseph, was given “a double portion,” and became two tribes -Ephraim and Manasseh-so named from the two sons of Joseph. And they were the Birthright tribes…

And it was these two tribes who were to bear the NAME Israel: “Let my name be named on them’ said the aged Israel ( Gen. 48:16 ), in passing on the Birth· right promises JUST before his death. And so, in prophecy, the NAME Jacob or the name Israel, often refers to the two great nations descended from Ephraim and Manasseh. These are Great Britain and the United States. The prophesied YOKE of invasion, defeat in war , and slavery, then, is to fall on Britain and the United States! (Armstrong HW. BRITAIN’S DOOM Prophesied for Common Market Seeking Membership! Plain Truth, July 1962)

Common Teachings in Error

It is the common assumption that the times of the Gentiles are a period of blessing on the nations. It is argued that since God took away the blessing of being great and dominant nations from Israel and Judah and since the Gentiles for centuries have been dominant nations, that human rule is a blessing bestowed upon the Gentiles.

Nothing could be further from the truth!

Then again, many claim that the times of the Gentiles are synonymous with the times of Judah’s punishment, that the Gentile times have already ended-some say in 1914, others say in 1917 or 1936. Some even think that it might end this year. But all these supposed dates for the ending of the times of the Gentiles are mere guesses! The truth is that almost no one really knows what the times of the Gentiles are. And yet without an understanding of the meaning of this prophetic period, you can not grasp the real significance of present day world-shaking events or understand what’s going to happen in the next twenty-five years. Let’s not assume, let’s study the Bible itself to see what these times really are.

Times of Israel’s Punishment a Key to Understanding

Israel was promised great national blessings, including national greatness if they would obey God. But God also promised that if they obstinately refused to obey Him, if they refused to follow His laws and let Him rule their lives, then He would punish them for a period called seven times (Lev. 26).

The Bible itself defines this period of seven times for us. If you turn to Revelation the twelfth chapter, and compare verses 6 and 14 you will see that the word time in prophecy simply means a year, hence seven times would be seven years or 2520 days.

Now let’s notice another key. In Numbers 14:34, God said Israel would bear their iniquities in the wilderness after the number of days they searched the land of Canaan, forty days, each day for a year.

Then seven times or 2520 prophetic days would equal 2520 literal years! This period of seven times or 2520 years punishment did come upon Israel because they went their own ways and would no: submit to the rule of God. Israel went into captivity about 721 B.C. and did not become a great people again until their times of punishment ceased about 1800 A.D. At that time the descendants of the ancient House of Israel -America and Britain and the democratic peoples of the world--began to rise to such wealth and power as the world has never enjoyed before all because of the promises made to Abraham.

Also Palestine, after a punishment against the House of Judah, that began about 604 R.C., was brought back from the Gentile Turks in 1917-exactly 2520 years later, when it came under the control of Great Britain, and finally the Jews. The seven times of Israel’s punishment was a period of great privation and suffering, of slavery and war because they would not submit their wills and their ways to God, because they would not allow Him to rule their lives by His perfect laws, which could have brought them peace and prosperity and dominion.

The Original Prophecy Found in Daniel

Now that we understand the seven times punishment on Israel, let’s understand the meaning of the times of the Gentiles.

The original prophecy to which Jesus had reference is found in the fourth chapter of Daniel. Jesus understood that this prophetic vision of the great tree had reference to the times of the Gentiles as well as to Nebuchadnezzar’s literal punishment.

Notice Daniel 4: 17. This striking vision was not only to teach Nebuchadnezzar that God rules, but it is also “to the intent that THE LIVING may know that the most High rules in the kingdom of men, and gives it to whom he will and sets over it the basest of men.” ...

Remember what Jesus said in Luke 21:24? That Jerusalem would be trodden down of the Gentiles until the very completion of the times of the Gentiles!

Since Zechariah 14: 1-3 shows that Jesus Christ will return in order to deliver Jerusalem from the Gentiles, it is plain that THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST WILL OCCUR SHORTLY BEFORE THE TIMES OF THE GENTILES ARE FULFILLED! (Isaiah 27:13; I Cor. 15:52) (Hoeh H. What are the Times of the Gentiles? Plain Truth, September 1955)

It was essentially after 2520 years that the Anglo-American powers rose up. That 2520 year time of the Gentiles is over. In 1970, the late evangelist Herman Hoeh wrote a similar article and added to it:

The Bible itself defines this period of seven times for us. If you turn to Revelation the twelfth chapter, and compare verses 6 and 14, you will see that the word "time" in prophecy simply means a year. Hence seven "times" would be "seven years," each containing twelve 30-day months — or a total of 2520 days (7x12x30). ...

God was dealing with the Gentiles in Daniel's day. The Gentile king Nebuchadnezzar had been sinning — living contrary to God's law. He had been taking his people on the road to world conquest and the enslavement of other nations and peoples. He had been traveling the way of war, not of peace.

God had sent His warning. The king did not heed. So God punished the nation seven years (569 to 562 D.C.) by cursing King Nebuchadnezzar with madness — till he acted and thought like a beast of the forest!

No punishment like that had ever come on any king before! No nation had ever been so cursed!

After these seven years Nebuchadnezzar's mind returned to sanity. He now repented, admitted that his ways were wrong, and actually wrote a great public document admitting before all nations what had happened to him and to his people!

After those seven years of punishment, the kingdom of Babylon was given the heart of a man. The leaders began to think in ways of peace instead of war. Notice Daniel 7:4. The kingdom of Chaldea (or Babylon) — here symbolized by a ferocious lion — stood "upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given it."

Notice the parallel. King Nebuchadnezzar, because of his sins, was punished seven literal years. At the end of that time he regained his sanity and began for the first time in his life to repent and to give up the ways of war for the way of peace. ... As He punished Israel and Judah for seven prophetic "times" — 2520 years — so would be the punishment of the Gentiles! God began to punish the nation by cursing their king for seven literal years. (Hoeh H. There is a Way of Escape. Plain Truth, 1970)

Interestingly there are 2520 days in 7 years of 360 days. Hence that also seems to point to the time when the seven-year 'peace deal' of Daniel 9:27 will be confirmed for. But it is only for 1/2 that time (42 months) that the Gentiles "will tread the holy city" of Jerusalem for (Revelation 11:2). Then Jesus, the Prince of Peace (Isaiah 9:6), will return and destroy the predominantly Gentile powers that will be united to fight against Him (Revelation 19:19-21).

Notice also the following, which shows that the remnant of Israel will be shamed, for a time, by Gentiles but then the Lord will come:

7 "Therefore, behold, the days are coming," says the Lord, "that they shall no longer say, 'As the Lord lives who brought up the children of Israel from the land of Egypt,' 8 but, 'As the Lord lives who brought up and led the descendants of the house of Israel from the north country and from all the countries where I had driven them.' And they shall dwell in their own land." (Jeremiah 23:7-8)

The time of Gentile domination is prophesied (Ezekiel 7:24, 30:1-3, 34:25-30; Jeremiah 10:25; Luke 21:23-24; Revelation 11:2). The old Worldwide Church of God taught:

With the second coming of Christ, the “times of the Gentiles” will at last come to an end. (Stump K. The Arab World in Prophecy. Plain Truth, December 1979, p. 38)

As mentioned earlier, the Great Tribulation itself is further described in Revelation 6:9-11 (the fifth seal, that seems to occur because the faithful church has suffered martyrdom, cf. Daniel 11:31-35; Matthew 24:9-10), Lamentations, Daniel, and other parts of the Bible. It starts with Matthew 24:21 and Daniel 11:39. Some would call this World War III (WWIII; see also World War III: Steps in Progress and/or watch Is World War III About to Begin? Can You Escape?).

Some wonder why the USA would be destroyed. Well, for one example because of politics, the USA has promoted the LGBTQ agenda around the world (though less so recently under the Trump Administration). For another, because of short-sighted economic problems, the USA has become the most indebted nation of all time. Also, because of sin, greed, and ignorance, America has been into abortion as well as producing genetically-modified foods. These "foods" are genetically identical which makes them susceptible to total elimination via famine-causing pestilential organisms. I have long suspected that the time will come when some type of pestilence will hit America's genetically-modified grain crops like corn and wreak havoc on the land. Enough so, that this may embolden its enemies to attack Britain and/or the USA to begin the Great Tribulation (for more details, see the article Fourth Horseman of the Apocalypse).

Nations will betray the USA, who has been “great among the nations”:

1 How lonely sits the city
That was full of people!
How like a widow is she,
Who was great among the nations!
The princess among the provinces
Has become a slave!

2 She weeps bitterly in the night,
Her tears are on her cheeks;
Among all her lovers
She has none to comfort her.
All her friends have dealt treacherously with her;
They have become her enemies. (Lamentations 1:1-2)

4 We pay for the water we drink, And our wood comes at a price. 5 They pursue at our heels; We labor and have no rest. 6 We have given our hand to the Egyptians And the Assyrians, to be satisfied with bread. 7 Our fathers sinned and are no more, But we bear their iniquities. 8 Servants rule over us; There is none to deliver us from their hand”. (Lamentations 5:4-8)

Notice that "friends" will betray and that Assyria, which is who God will use to punish the certain descendants of Israel, such as the U.S.A., etc. (Isaiah 10:5-12; see also Anglo – America in Prophecy & the Lost Tribes of Israel) is involved. Modern Assyrians are considered to be friends/allies of the USA, Canada, UK, etc.

Consider also that there is a Catholic prophecy that shows the taking over of North America:

Zachary the Armenian (published 1854 and summarized in 2010): And then there would be the war that the prophecy refers to as “the struggle of the strong, against the strong”. This empire of the north…will go to war against North America and North America will be fall and be conquered and brought into bondage. The next phase is the most frightful thing of all. It is then that Zachary says this text published in 1854, “and then the whole world fell under the dominion of the first born of hell.” (Originally by Priest Fattecelli, Day of Anger: The Hand of God Upon an Empire, 1854, as paraphrased by Priest P. Kramer, What are the missing contents of the third secret? Fatima Crusader, 95, Summer 2010, pp. 45-46)

North America would clearly include the USA and Canada. Since Zachary is discussing the dominion of the first born son of perdition (cf. 2 Thessalonians 2:3-12), the above is consistent with teaching that this would happen at the start of the Great Tribulation. That is consistent with the understanding of the Philadelphian remnant of the Church of God on these matters (though we do not believe that God inspired this Zachary).

Anyway, for the final time of the Gentiles to arise, the Gentiles will need to cooperate together against the USA and its Anglo-Saxon descended allies. The BRICS, EAEU, SCO, EU, and Silk Road arrangements are all intended to do that (see SCO, EAEU, and BRICS defining a ‘new world order’?) and are all taking steps which align with properly understood biblical prophecies (see BRICS, Silk Road, SCO, Eurasian Union, and European Union: Final time of the Gentiles?). A block of nations from North Africa and the Middle East, which US President Donald Trump and others have encouraged (see How Will Middle East Peace be Brought About?), will also be involved (cf. Daniel 11:27, 40-43).

Yet, most in the USA, Canada, UK, Australia, and New Zealand do not understand what is now happening on the world scene and how they will be affected.

Destruction will come to the highly indebted suddenly (the USA is the most indebted nation of all time):

8... A plunderer at noonday; I will cause anguish and terror to fall on them suddenly. (Jeremiah 15:8)

6 "Will not all these take up a proverb against him,
And a taunting riddle against him, and say,
'Woe to him who increases
What is not his — how long?
And to him who loads himself with many pledges'?
7 Will not your creditors rise up suddenly?
Will they not awaken who oppress you?
And you will become their booty.
8 Because you have plundered many nations,
All the remnant of the people shall plunder you (Habakkuk 2:6-8)

The late Pastor General of the old Worldwide Church of God, Herbert W. Armstrong, wrote the following in 1979:

What is this abomination? This refers to Daniel 11:31 and Matthew 24:15...That will be a time when the UNITED Europe shall appear--the revival of the medieval "Holy Roman Empire." We shall then be warned, and readied to be taken to a place of refuge and safety from the Great Tribulation. Forty-five days later "the beasts armies" will surround Jerusalem. Thirty days later the Great Tribulation will probably start with a nuclear attack on London and Britain--and possibly the same day or immediately after, on the United States and Canadian cities. The GREAT TRIBULATION, we shall fully then realize, is the time of "Jacob's Trouble," spoken of in Jeremiah 30:7. And Jacob's name was named on Joseph's sons, Ephraim and Manasseh (Gen. 48:16). At that time a third of the people in our nations will die, or shall have died, by famine and disease epidemics; another third will dies of the war--our cities being destroyed (Ezek. 6:6), and the remaining third will be carried to the land of our enemies as slaves (Ezek. 5:12). (Armstrong HW. The Time We Are In, Now. Pastor General's Report-Vol 1, No. 15, November 20, 1979, Page 2).

The Bible states:

33 I will scatter you among the nations and draw out a sword after you; your land shall be desolate and your cities waste (Leviticus 26:33).

Nuclear and other high-tech weapons (as well as emp, electromagnetic pulse, bombs), as well as devastating solar flares, are ways to make land desolate and modern cities waste (for more on emp-weapons and solar flares see Nuclear EMP Attack on UK Called ‘Quite Likely’).

Events that resembles nuclear or similar devastation are part of the prophesied curses mentioned in the Bible:

23 'The whole land is brimstone, salt, and burning (Deuteronomy 29:23).

19 Through the wrath of the LORD of hosts
The land is burned up,
And the people shall be as fuel for the fire; No man shall spare his brother.
20 And he shall snatch on the right hand
And be hungry;
He shall devour on the left hand
And not be satisfied; Every man shall eat the flesh of his own arm. 21 Manasseh shall devour Ephraim, and Ephraim Manasseh; Together they shall be against Judah (Isaiah 9:19-21).

6 In all your dwelling places the cities shall be laid waste (Ezekiel 6:6).

It remains likely that many of the Protestants that survive the tribulation (whether or not they believed in a pre-tribulation view of Christ’s return) will be part of the great multitude of those converted during the tribulation (c.f. Revelation 7:9) through the Continuing Church of God message which will mainly then be brought to the world by The Two Witnesses (a lot of Greco-Roman Catholics and those of non-biblically-claimed faiths will be as well; cf. Revelation 7:9-10).

How do we know that the Anglo-nations in general, and the USA in particular, and not just the land of Judea are the initial target of the great tribulation?

One reason is Daniel 11:39:

39 Thus he shall act against the strongest fortresses with a foreign god, which he shall acknowledge, and advance its glory; and he shall cause them to rule over many, and divide the land for gain. (Daniel 11:39)

The "he" is the final King of the North, the Beast of Revelation 13. The "strongest fortresses" in the world belong to the USA, and to a lessor degree, its Anglo-allies (see USA in Prophecy: The Strongest Fortresses also and/or watch Do these 7 prophesies point to the end of the USA?). The strongest fortresses, by the way, cannot be referring to China or Russia as they do not get involved until verse 44 of Daniel 11 (for more details, see King of the North). Nor the Arab lands, which do not get invaded until verses 40-43. The current nation of Israel, of course, does not have the strongest fortresses. Plus. dividing the Anglo-lands would bring much more gain, than the land of Judea (see also Will the Anglo-Nations be Divided?). Thus, this is pointing to the Anglo-nations, which currently harbor many in the faithful church.

Much more information on the times of the Gentiles can be found in the article: The Times of the Gentiles. A related sermon is also available and is titled: The Times of the Gentiles.

The Great Tribulation Starts Prior to Daniel 11:40

It should be noted that certain Laodicean COGs (LCG and PCG come to immediate mind) improperly hold to the sequence that the King of the North attacks the King of the South, then the time of Jacob's trouble begins with the Great Tribulation and the USA and/or UK is attacked. This is illogical for several reasons. Notice the following from the Statement of Official Beliefs of the Living Church of God (LCG) that was viewed online at its cogl.org website 9/20/15:

THE "GREAT TRIBULATION"

The Bible speaks of a time of great catastrophe, called the "Great Tribulation" (Matthew 24:21-22; Daniel 11:40-45; 12:1; Luke 21:19-36)—also called "Jacob’s trouble" (Jeremiah 30:3-7).

The above contains multiple contradictions. First, an attack against a confederation of nations in the Middle East and North Africa (which is what the King of the South will rule) is not part of JACOB'S TROUBLE. Secondly, the nations mentioned in the King of the South passages are not the USA nor UK nor their Anglo-Saxon descended allies. And third, LCG teaches that the 'Day of the Lord' lasts one year and comes after the Great Tribulation--yet Daniel 11:44-45 come towards the END of the Day of the Lord (which other LCG literature teaches). Hence, there are at least three errors in that one sentence that LCG holds to.

In the sequence of Daniel 11, the Great Tribulation begins in verse 39, not verse 40. Now there appear to be two reasons that LCG and PCG misunderstand the sequence. First is that the late Herbert W. Armstrong originally taught that sequence because of events related to WWII and a mistranslation of verse 39 in the KJV (which was corrected in the NKJV). Although Herbert Armstrong clearly changed his position by 1979, the leaders of LCG and PCG have overlooked/discounted that. The second reason could be based upon a misunderstanding of a translation of Daniel 11:39-40:

39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.

40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over. (Daniel 11:39-40, KJV)

The above does not make it clear that the King of the North (the 'he' in verse 39) is going against the 'strongest fortresses like the NKJV and other translations do. Notice a Jewish translation:

39 And he shall deal with the strongest fortresses with the help of a foreign god; whom he shall acknowledge, shall increase glory; and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for a price.

40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him; and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow, as he passes through. (Daniel 11:39-40, Jewish Publication Society, 1917)

Some seem to believe that the 'time of the end' does not begin until verse 40, but that is a misunderstanding of how the Hebrew text should be understood. The 'and' in verse 40 is not the start of the end, but a continuation of what began in verse 39. This is known by others. For example, the Barnes Notes on the Bible states:

And at the time of the end .... The "time of the end" must properly denote the end or consummation of the series of events under consideration, or the matter in hand, and properly and obviously means here the end or consummation of the transactions which had been referred to in the previous part of the vision. It is equivalent to what we should say by expressing it thus: "at the winding up of the affair."

The ONLY way to reconcile that the time of Jacob's trouble (Jeremiah 30:7) starts with the beginning of the Great Tribulation (Matthew 24:21) is to realize that it begins with verse 39 of the sequence in Daniel 11. Those who hold to a start of the Great Tribulation AFTER the King of the North attacks the King of the South will not know until it is too late.

Some Christians will be Protected During the Great Tribulation, Other Christians will be Persecuted

It should be noted that Jesus also called this period the hour of trial and that He promised to protect only the Philadelphia portion of the Church of God from it:

7 "And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write,

'These things says He who is holy, He who is true, "He who has the key of David, He who opens and no one shuts, and shuts and no one opens": 8 "I know your works. See, I have set before you an open door, and no one can shut it; for you have a little strength, have kept My word, and have not denied My name. 9 Indeed I will make those of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie — indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you. 10 Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth. 11 Behold, I am coming quickly! Hold fast what you have, that no one may take your crown. (Revelation 3:7-11)

The Bible also makes it clear that the only ones who will be protected will first 'gather together' (Zephaniah 2:1-3; watch also Zephaniah's 'Gather Together' Prophecy). For more details and scriptures about the place and who goes, please see There is a Place of Safety for the Philadelphians. Why it May Be Petra.

And while some erroneously feel that Revelation 3:10 has to do with a pre-tribulation rapture for all Christians (see Is There A Secret Rapture for the Church? When and Where is the Church Protected? or the YouTube video Did Jesus Teach a Pre-tribulation Rapture?), the reality is that is NOT what Jesus said. The Bible is clear that rest of the Church will face persecution for 3 1/2 years:

17 And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ (Revelation 12:17).

Many Christians will be affected by the Great Tribulation as the late evangelist John Ogwyn wrote:

Because of their faithful endurance, Philadelphians are promised protection from the great time of severe trial that will come upon the whole world in the end time (Revelation 3:10). By contrast, Christ rebukes the Church at Laodicea, representing the final era, for its lukewarm spirit. Lacking in zeal, Laodicea is beset by compromise with the world, unaware that it is spiritually impoverished and naked. Because of its attitude, the living Christ will have to spew Laodiceans out of His mouth and right into the Great Tribulation, to wake them up and bring them to ultimate repentance and complete surrender to Him. Understanding this distinction between the final two eras allows us to understand prophecies in Revelation 12 that describe Satan’s attempt to make war with the "woman"—the true Church…

Jesus warned us of the Great Tribulation—a time unique in all history (Matthew 24:21–22). The Great Tribulation begins shortly after the "abomination of desolation" (v. 15)…

This future time of trouble will clearly be a time of intense religious persecution, when all will be forced to conform to false religious practices that will be portrayed as "Christian." All will be required to give their devotion to the great false church and its hierarchy, labeled in Revelation 13:15 the "image of the beast." An outward sign of conformity called the "mark of the beast" will identify those whom Scripture labels as the children of disobedience.

There is another aspect of this coming Great Tribulation that is often overlooked. It is not only a time of religious persecution but it is also identified as "the time of Jacob’s trouble" in Jeremiah 30:7. We know that this is identical with the time of which Jesus spoke in Matthew 24:21, because in both places we are told that it is a unique time, a time such as never was before nor ever again shall be. There cannot be two separate times like that! (Ogwyn JH. Revelation: The Mystery Unveiled! 2006, pp. 17-18, 25, 26 )

John Ogwyn pointed out that it is not initially the world as a whole, but those now trying to be followers of Christ (the Laodiceans mainly, see The Laodicean Church Era) and those who are physical descendants of Israel who are the initial targets of the Great Tribulation (see Anglo - America in Prophecy & the Lost Tribes of Israel). And notice that they are persecuted by the Beast power and those supporting him.

The Laodicean Churches of God have so many prophetic misunderstandings that unless they repent they will NOT know when the Great Tribulation will happen until it is too late--over 30 prophetic errors held by Laodiceans are in the article The Laodicean Church Era.

It should be noted that Jesus only taught that the Philadelphians (Revelation 3:7-13; see also The Philadelphia Church Era) would be protected from this 'hour of trial' (Revelation 3:10), but He did not make that promise to the Laodiceans (Revelation 3:14-22); because of wrong priorities and wrong prophetic teachings, the Laodiceans will have to go through the Great Tribulation (see also The Laodicean Church Era which has a listing of dozens of Laodicean errors in prophetic understanding which will prevent any who insist on them to not possibly know when the Great Tribulation will begin). The Bible is clear that there are true Christians that will have to go through the 3 1/2 years of the Great Tribulation and the Day of the Lord (Revelation 12:17; Daniel 7:25).

Notice also what Daniel writes about two coming persecutions that the Beast king will use during this time:

24 The ten horns are ten kings
Who shall arise from this kingdom.
And another shall rise after them;
He shall be different from the first ones,
And shall subdue three kings.
25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High,
Shall persecute the saints of the Most High,
And shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand
For a time and times and half a time (Daniel 7:24-25).

There are two times of persecution in those passages. The first is where the Beast will, "persecute the saints of the Most High," which happens prior to the Great Tribulation, and then the second shortly afterwards when "the saints shall be given into his hand" for 3 ½ years (1 time + 2 times + ½ time = 3 ½ times or years). This persecuting Beast king is the final European King of the North. Christians, have been persecuted in the past, and will be in the future--for details check out Persecutions by Church and State.

But what about others, the non-Christians?

In addition to the warnings given by His two witnesses for 3 ½ years (Revelation 11:3), God is going to provide a warning of repentance to the world by way of three angels:

6 Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth--to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people-- 7 saying with a loud voice, "Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water." 8 And another angel followed, saying, "Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she has made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication." 9 Then a third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, "If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10 he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name" (Revelation 14:6-11).

God wants people everywhere to repent (Acts 17:30) and though most will not listen in this age, He still wants them to be warned (and a great multitude will respond per Revelation 7:9-10).

The final time of the Gentiles includes the Day of the Lord:

2 "Son of man, prophesy and say, 'Thus says the Lord God:

"Wail, 'Woe to the day!'
3 For the day is near,
Even the day of the Lord is near;
It will be a day of clouds, the time of the Gentiles. (Ezekiel 30:2-3)

Shortly after the above verses is when the King of the South will be defeated by the King of the North (Daniel 11:40-43; cf. Ezekiel 30:4-7).

Also notice the prophecy for this latter time tribulation in the Hebrew scriptures:

29 But from there you will seek the Lord your God, and you will find Him if you seek Him with all your heart and with all your soul. 30 When you are in distress, and all these things come upon you in the latter days, when you turn to the Lord your God and obey His voice 31 (for the Lord your God is a merciful God), He will not forsake you nor destroy you, nor forget the covenant of your fathers which He swore to them. (Deuteronomy 4:29-31)

Thus, help from God during these hard times will be available to the truly sincere who really strive for it.

Jesus will come a second time:

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Hebrews 9:28)

20 He who testifies to these things says, "Surely I am coming quickly."

Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus! (Revelation 22:20)

The Catholics Changed Their View of the Great Tribulation

What do Catholics teach about the Great Tribulation?

First it may be best to read what early supporters of the Greco-Romans taught. In the third century, Hippolytus wrote:

62. The Lord also says, "When you shall see the abomination of desolation stand in the holy place (whoso reads, let him understand), then let them which be in Judea flee into the mountains, and let him which is on the housetop not come down to take his clothes; neither let him which is in the field return back to take anything out of his house. And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved. " And Daniel says, "And they shall place the abomination of desolation a thousand two hundred and ninety days. Blessed is he that waits, and comes to the thousand two hundred and ninety-five days." (Hippolytus. On Christ and Antichrist. http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0516.htm viewed 12/17/08)

Now notice what Cyril of Jerusalem taught in the late middle portion of the fourth century:

16. For this cause the Lord knowing the greatness of the adversary grants indulgence to the godly, saying, Then let them which be in Judæa flee to the mountains. But if any man is conscious that he is very stout-hearted , to encounter Satan, let him stand (for I do not despair of the Church's nerves), and let him say, Who shall separate us from the love of Christ and the rest? But, let those of us who are fearful provide for our own safety; and those who are of a good courage, stand fast: for then shall be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, nor ever shall be. But thanks be to God who has confined the greatness of that tribulation to a few days; for He says, But for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened ; and Antichrist shall reign for three years and a half only. We speak not from apocryphal books, but from Daniel ; for he says, And they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and half a time. A time is the one year in which his coming shall for a while have increase; and the times are the remaining two years of iniquity , making up the sum of the three years; and the half a time is the six months. And again in another place Daniel says the same thing, And he sware by Him that lives for ever that it shall be for a time , and times, and half a time. And some peradventure have referred what follows also to this; namely , a thousand two hundred and ninety days ; and this, Blessed is he that endures and comes to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days . For this cause we must hide ourselves and flee; for perhaps we shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of Man be come (Cyril of Jerusalem. Catechetical Lecture 15. http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/310115.htm viewed 06/12/11).

The above appears consistent with what we of the Philadelphia remnant of the Church of God still teach.

The Catholic "saint and doctor of the Church" Jerome wrote:

But the more reasonable understanding of the matter is that in the time of the Antichrist there shall occur a tribulation such as there has never been since nations began to exist (Jerome. Commentary on Daniel, Chapter 12, Verses 1-3. Translated by Gleason L. Archer. (1958). http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/jerome_daniel_02_text.htm viewed 04/14/2010).

Jerome's position above is consistent with what Jesus (Matthew 24:21-25) and the rest of the Bible teach.

Yet, even though they consider them be saints, some of those associated with Rome now seem to teach that the Great Tribulation was over by the time that Cyril and Jerome wrote what they did (earlier writers such as the Shepherd of Hermas, Cyprian of Carthage, and Tertullian also considered that the Great Tribulation was a future event and tended to tie it in with the time of the final Antichrist).

Notice what two modern "Catholic" priests have written:

Priest W. Kurz (21st century): …great tribulation…probably already a horrific past event by the time Matthew wrote down his gospel (Kurz W. What Does the Bible Say About the End Times? A Catholic View. Servant Books, Cincinnati. Nihil Obstat: Kistner H., Schehr T.P. Imprimi Potest: Link F., Paul J.M. Imprimatur: Carl K. Moeddel, Vicar General and Auxillary Bishop, Archdiocese of Cincinnati, July 19, 2004. Servant Books, Cincinnati, 2004, p. 96).

Priest H.B. Kramer (20th century): The "great tribulation" is a stereotyped phrase used often in the Apocalypse and elsewhere in the New Testament (Mt. XXIV. 21) for the Roman persecutions. (See VII. 14)....

THE GREAT TRIBULATION. The definite article used refers to something which had been mentioned before and was presumed to be known. In chapter I. 9 and II. 10, St. John states it and warns the Christians in Asia of its coming. He calls it the "hour of temptation" in II. 10. It is bloody persecution. In this verse, the stress placed on "the great one" points to the imperial persecutions, especially to the last one under Diocletian. This scene is then in the fourth century, when the Roman persecutions had been abolished. "The great tribulation" had passed away to return no more, and since then the Church had grown to grand proportions. (Kramer H.B. L. The Book of Destiny. Nihil Obstat: J.S. Considine, O.P., Censor Deputatus. Imprimatur: +Joseph M. Mueller, Bishop of Sioux City, Iowa, January 26, 1956. Reprint TAN Books, Rockford (IL), pp. 81,181-182)

This is a change in prophetic understanding that is not consistent with the teachings of the Bible nor the traditions of the early church. The fact is that much persecution against the true Church began after Constantine protected the Greco-Romans. Actually, Constantine began persecutions against all who did not accept his militaristic view of Christianity (see also Persecutions by Church and State).

But the doctrinal truth is that the Great Tribulation that the Bible speaks about is NOT over. Even the Rheims translation of the New Testament (the first major Catholic accepted translation into English) teaches:

[20] But pray that your flight be not in the winter, or on the sabbath.
[21] For there shall be then great tribulation, such as hath not been from the beginning of the world until now, neither shall be. (Matthew 24:20-21).

Thus, the time of the great tribulation comes at a particular time of fleeing. It has not yet happened.

It should be noted that it is not only many Catholics, but various Protestants, and a group called Church of God Seventh Day teach that the Great Tribulation has already occurred and was over by 70 A.D. Those who hold that view are referred to as preterists. For details about their arguments and how the Bible and facts of history prove them wrong, please check out the article The Dangerous Rise of Preterists.

Herbert W. Armstrong's Summary of the Seals

Here is some of what the late Herbert W. Armstrong wrote about the first sixth seals:

"And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; and the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind" (Rev. 6:12-13).

"For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?" (Verse 17.)

NOTICE it!

Will you read it with your own eyes, in your own Bible?

Here in this 6th chapter of Revelation, as these six seals are opened, we have 1st false preachers; 2nd, wars climaxing in world wars; 3rd, famines; 4th, disease epidemics; 5th, GREAT TRIBULATION — martyrdom of saints; 6th, the heavenly signs, in the sun, moon, and stars.

And then WHAT NEXT — what is to follow this sixth seal? THE GREAT DAY OF GOD'S WRATH — and that, as I shall show you, is the great DAY OF THE LORD!

Now quickly turn to the prophecy of Joel in the Old Testament. "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the Lord come" (Joel 2:31).

THERE IT IS! In Matthew 24:29 you read in your own Bible that the heavenly signs in the sun, moon, and stars would occur immediately after the Great Tribulation. In Revelation 6 you saw with your own eyes that the heavenly signs in the sun and moon of the sixth seal follow immediately AFTER the Great Tribulation, or the martyrdom of the saints, of the fifth seal. Also you saw there, that following these heavenly signs of the sixth seal was to come the terrible day of GOD'S WRATH. Now here in Joel 2:31 we see that these heavenly signs in the sun and moon must occur before the great and terrible DAY OF THE LORD! ...

A trumpet is an instrument into which one blows. A trumpet sounds by blowing wind through it. These seven trumpets, which compose the seventh seal, follow immediately after the sixth seal. At the time of the sixth seal, described in the last of the 6th chapter of Revelation, it was announced that "the GREAT DAY OF GOD'S WRATH was come. These symbolic TRUMPETS portray, then, THE DAY OF THE LORD — the day of GOD'S WRATH! (Armstrong HW. The Book of Revelation Unveiled at Last).

The first seal, which relates to the first event in the 'beginning of sorrows,' already seems to be opened. The fifth seal pictures the start of the Great Tribulation.

The 144,000 Who Are Sealed After the Sixth Seal is Opened

There is a lot of confusion about the 144,000 who are sealed in Revelation 7.

Please notice the timeframe in the Book of Revelation:

12 I looked when He opened the sixth seal, and behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. 13 And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. 14 Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place. 15 And the kings of the earth, the great men, the rich men, the commanders, the mighty men, every slave and every free man, hid themselves in the caves and in the rocks of the mountains, 16 and said to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?" (Revelation 6:12-17)

7: 1 After these things I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, on the sea, or on any tree. 2 Then I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God. And he cried with a loud voice to the four angels to whom it was granted to harm the earth and the sea, 3 saying, "Do not harm the earth, the sea, or the trees till we have sealed the servants of our God on their foreheads." 4 And I heard the number of those who were sealed. One hundred and forty-four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel were sealed:

5 of the tribe of Judah twelve thousand were sealed;
of the tribe of Reuben twelve thousand were sealed;
of the tribe of Gad twelve thousand were sealed;
6 of the tribe of Asher twelve thousand were sealed;
of the tribe of Naphtali twelve thousand were sealed;
of the tribe of Manasseh twelve thousand were sealed;
7 of the tribe of Simeon twelve thousand were sealed;
of the tribe of Levi twelve thousand were sealed;
of the tribe of Issachar twelve thousand were sealed;
8 of the tribe of Zebulun twelve thousand were sealed;
of the tribe of Joseph twelve thousand were sealed;
of the tribe of Benjamin twelve thousand were sealed. (Revelation 7:1-8)

These people apparently have responded to the preaching of The Two Witnesses and/or otherwise refused to worship the Beast (cf. Revelation 11:3,7; 13:8) and have physical and/or spiritual descendancy from twelve of the tribes of Israel. Various 'European-descended' peoples will respond (see also Anglo - America in Prophecy & the Lost Tribes of Israel).

Those who claim that the above 144,000 were sealed before the sixth seal was opened seem to have overlooked what the Bible appears to be teaching here; some believe that it is the final remnant of the 144,000 that are sealed then, so that the total reaches 144,000 truly converted people from the time of Abel until then (cf. Jude 14; Exodus 20:5-6; Romans 9:27; 11:5).

Here are the next several verses from Revelation 7:

9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, 10 and crying out with a loud voice, saying, "Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!" 11 All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, 12 saying:

"Amen! Blessing and glory and wisdom,
Thanksgiving and honor and power and might,
Be to our God forever and ever.
Amen."

13 Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, "Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?"

14 And I said to him, "Sir, you know."

So he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them. (Revelation 7:9-15)

Notice also some of what the old WCG used to teach:

The 144,000 are 12,000 from each of the literal tribes of Israel. (Rev. 7:4). (Armstrong HW. The key to the Book of Revelation. WCG, 1972, p. 10)

The 144,000, as well as the great innumerable multitude from all nations referred to in verse 9, repent of their old sinful ways and turn to Almighty God in personal surrender. God then put their sins under the blood of Jesus Christ-the Passover Lamb (verse 14). "These are they," states one of the elders at God's throne, "which came out of great tribulation." These multitudes will receive eternal life, and serve God day and night in His Temple (verse 15). (Sound the Trumpet. Ambassador College Bible Correspondence Course. Lesson 28. 1986, page 9)

Some believe that only the 144,000 are saved in this age, whereas the others will be saved after the start of the millennium--but the English translation does not fully point in that direction.

Now, there is also a group of 144,000 mentioned later in the Bible:

1 Then I looked, and behold, a Lamb standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His Father's name written on their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven, like the voice of many waters, and like the voice of loud thunder. And I heard the sound of harpists playing their harps. 3 They sang as it were a new song before the throne, before the four living creatures, and the elders; and no one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who were redeemed from the earth. 4 These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb. 5 And in their mouth was found no deceit, for they are without fault before the throne of God. (Revelation 14:1-5)

These are firstfruits, and since the fact that the Bible says they stand on the Mount of Olives, this suggests that these would seem to have returned with Jesus Christ (cf. Zechariah 14:4).

Notice something from the old Radio Church of God:

What else is promised as a reward to the Philadelphia Church era? Rev. 3:12. Is all of this dependent upon being an OVERCOMER? Same verse. Through the work of preaching and publishing the gospel by the Philadelphia era of God's Church will there be a special 144,000 who also repent, endure tribulation and overcome? Compare Rev. 3:12 with Rev. 14:1.

4. What will the Philadelphia era of God's Church DO for eternity? Rev. 3:12. Note the word "pillar." Were Christ's leading disciples called "pillars"? Gal. 2:9.

COMMENT: Responsibility as "pillars" is what God promises to those in God's Church today. Each can qualify to be SPIRITUAL PILLARS OR LEADERS — THE MAIN SUPPORTS IN THE "CHURCH" SYMBOLICALLY CALLED "TEMPLE" IN REV. 3:12 FOR ALL ETERNITY. A PILLAR IS A MAIN SUPPORT IN A TEMPLE!

5. Where will the Philadelphia Church be stationed? Rev. 3:12. Note the words, "temple" and "New Jerusalem."

COMMENT: This Church -- the Philadelphia era -- is to have the name of the headquarters of the world -- the Capital City of the Universe.

The pillars of the Church ought always to be at headquarters so that everyone may appeal to it for decisions.

We, of the Philadelphia Era, are to have the name of God the Father and of the Son. God always places His name where He is. He will be dwelling in the new Jerusalem. So will we! That IS WHY we will have His name!

Notice, too, that Scripture reveals "He shall go no more out" (Rev. 3:12). We are never to be removed from that reward and responsibility.

Think of that!

We are to be at headquarters -- executing Jesus Christ's policies -- teaching those who need to come to headquarters for decisions throughout eternity as God expands the power and scope of His government! At headquarters we will have the opportunity to help with the master-plan for making a NEW HEAVENS AND NEW EARTH! (Lesson 42 - Eternal Life. Ambassador College Bible Correspondence Course. Lesson 42. 1965, page 9)

The above seems to be tying the Philadelphians in with the 144,000 of Revelation 14:1.

While the late Herbert W. Armstrong long ago wrote that Revelation 7 and 14 were referring to the same group of 144,000 (Armstrong HW. The key to the Book of Revelation. WCG, 1972, p. 10), some like former WCG vice-president and his advisor Aaron Dean believe that the Bible is referring to two groups of 144,000 and that may be so (watch also CCOG Q&A: 144,000, Cross or Pole, 10 Commandments, and more!).

If so, these could possibly be the pre-Great Tribulation firstfruits only, all saved from Abel until Jesus returned (which Aaron Dean suspects, but is not dogmatic about; cf. Jude 14; Exodus 20:5-6--if this is the case then the 'great multitude' is not sealed or truly converted in Revelation 7, which he also suspects) or the just the Philadelphian Christians (Revelation 3:12). One reason it could be a reference to the Philadelphian Christians is that there have been more than 144,000 who claimed to be part of the old Radio/Worldwide Church of God--but many of them apostatized. However, because of the prophesied coming "short work" (Romans 9:28; see also Preparing for the 'Short Work' and The Famine of the Word) it may be possible that there will end up being 144,000 Philadelphian Christians in total. The Book of Revelation distinguishes between 7 groups of Christians and most of the 4 that it shows will be around at the end have problems.

Thyatira: 20 Nevertheless I have a few things against you, because you allow that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess, to teach and seduce My servants to commit ual immorality and eat things sacrificed to idols. 21 And I gave her time to repent of her ual immorality, and she did not repent. 22 Indeed I will cast her into a sickbed, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of their deeds. 23 I will kill her children with death, and all the churches shall know that I am He who searches the minds and hearts. And I will give to each one of you according to your works. (Revelation 2:20-23)

Sardis: 1 I know your works, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead. 2 Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die, for I have not found your works perfect before God. 3 Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you. (Revelation 3:1-3)

Laodicea: 15 I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. 16 So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. 17 Because you say, 'I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing' — and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked — 18 I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see. 19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent. (Revelation 3:15-19)

Consider that the 144,000: "These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes" (Revelation 14:4). Not all the churches did--though some of the negative references could be to those that are not actual Christians. Now based upon the words in Revelation 2 & 3, it may be that some of the Thyatirans (Revelation 2:24-27), repentant Laodiceans (Revelation 3:19-21), parts of Ephesus and Smyrna (Revelation 2:1-19), and a few names in Sardis (Revelation 3:3), will be part of the 144,000, if that is mainly a Philadelphian firstfruits' group.

Therefore, the 144,000 would not seem to necessarily be all the saved as some have insisted upon.

I have spoken with Aaron Dean about this several times over the years. Also on May 1, 2017, he confirmed with me that Herbert W. Armstrong was uncertain about the 144,000 being the same group or two groups in the last couple of months of his life and had changes to his views of the 144,000 when he was alive.

The Day of the Lord is One Year Long. Will Jesus Return in 2020?

What or when is the "Day of the Lord"?

Here is the first time it is mentioned by that name in the Hebrew scriptures:

2 For the day of the Lord of hosts
Shall come upon everything proud and lofty,
Upon everything lifted up —
And it shall be brought low —
13 Upon all the cedars of Lebanon that are high and lifted up,
And upon all the oaks of Bashan;
14 Upon all the high mountains,
And upon all the hills that are lifted up;
15 Upon every high tower,
And upon every fortified wall;
16 Upon all the ships of Tarshish,
And upon all the beautiful sloops.
17 The loftiness of man shall be bowed down,
And the haughtiness of men shall be brought low;
The Lord alone will be exalted in that day,
18 But the idols He shall utterly abolish.

19 They shall go into the holes of the rocks,
And into the caves of the earth,
From the terror of the Lord
And the glory of His majesty,
When He arises to shake the earth mightily.

20 In that day a man will cast away his idols of silver
And his idols of gold,
Which they made, each for himself to worship,
To the moles and bats,
21 To go into the clefts of the rocks,
And into the crags of the rugged rocks,
From the terror of the Lord
And the glory of His majesty,
When He arises to shake the earth mightily. (Isaiah 2:12-21)

Many Protestants also seem to confuse the “Day of the Lord” and the Great Tribulation. At least one book refers to the tribulation as “the terrible week of the Lord” (LaHaye T, Jenkins J. Are We Living in the End Times? Tyndale House, Wheaton (IL), 1999, p. 159--an expression that is not in scripture) and the “Day of the Lord.” Dr. LaHaye, J. Jenkins, (LaHaye & Jenkins, p. 105, 147) and Dr. Walvoord (Walvoord, pp. 491-492) teach that the “Day of the Lord” occurs after their hoped for pre-tribulation rapture.

Thus, in a sense, the Day of the Lord is something they and others of their view seem to be looking forward to.

Yet, the Bible teaches:

18 Woe to you who desire the day of the LORD! For what good is the day of the LORD to you? It will be darkness, and not light. 19 It will be as though a man fled from a lion, And a bear met him! Or as though he went into the house, Leaned his hand on the wall, And a serpent bit him! 20 Is not the day of the LORD darkness, and not light? Is it not very dark, with no brightness in it? (Amos 5:18-20)

Since the Day of the Lord basically is a time that pre-tribulation Protestant rapturists look forward to, the above prophecy sadly, will most likely apply to many of them.

The fact is that the Great Tribulation involves horrors for physical and spiritual Israel. About 2.4 years after it starts there are to be the heavenly signs (Matthew 24:29), which are followed by the “Day of the Lord, a time of wrath and anger (Isaiah 13:9), which affects the whole world (cf. Matthew 24:30-31, Zechariah 14:1-4).

The late Herbert W. Armstrong wrote:

Some day, people will wake up to REALIZE this is the Work of GOD!

Of British churchianity, God says: "The Ephraimites are wedded to idolatry; LET THEM ALONE!—a drunken band, a lustful company, in love with shameful worship, not with my glory. When the whirlwind sweeps them off, they shall feel shame for their altars" (Hos. 4:17-19—Moffatt translation).

God says, "I withdraw to my own place, till they feel their iniquity and seek my face, searching for me in their distress, crying, 'Let us return to the Eternal, for he has torn us, he will heal us, he has wounded, he will bind us up: in a day or two [Authorized Version—after two days] he will revive us, and on the third day he will raise us to live under his care" (Hos. 5:15-6:2, Moffatt translation).

The coming Great Tribulation probably will last about 2 1/2 years—the "Day of the Lord" about one year—then comes the RESURRECTION and second coming of Christ!

The 'Philadelphia work' that began with Herbert W. Armstrong is being continued by the Continuing Church of God today.

The Bible shows that the Beast power (also called the King of the North) will persecute the saints for 3 ½ years (Daniel 7:25) and a specific “Day of the Lord” lasts one year (Isaiah 34:8).

Here is some of what Isaiah was inspired to write:

9 Behold, the day of the Lord comes, Cruel, with both wrath and fierce anger, To lay the land desolate; And He will destroy its sinners from it. 10 For the stars of heaven and their constellations Will not give their light; The sun will be darkened in its going forth, And the moon will not cause its light to shine.

11 "I will punish the world for its evil,And the wicked for their iniquity;I will halt the arrogance of the proud, And will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible. 12 I will make a mortal more rare than fine gold, A man more than the golden wedge of Ophir. 13 Therefore I will shake the heavens, And the earth will move out of her place, In the wrath of the Lord of hosts And in the day of His fierce anger. 14 It shall be as the hunted gazelle, And as a sheep that no man takes up; Every man will turn to his own people,And everyone will flee to his own land. 15 Everyone who is found will be thrust through, And everyone who is captured will fall by the sword. 16 Their children also will be dashed to pieces before their eyes; Their houses will be plundered And their wives ravished. (Isaiah 13:9-16)

1 Come near, you nations, to hear;And heed, you people!Let the earth hear, and all that is in it,The world and all things that come forth from it. 2 For the indignation of the Lord is against all nations,And His fury against all their armies; He has utterly destroyed them,He has given them over to the slaughter. 3 Also their slain shall be thrown out; Their stench shall rise from their corpses,And the mountains shall be melted with their blood. 4 All the host of heaven shall be dissolved, And the heavens shall be rolled up like a scroll; All their host shall fall down As the leaf falls from the vine, And as fruit falling from a fig tree. 5 "For My sword shall be bathed in heaven; Indeed it shall come down on Edom,And on the people of My curse, for judgment. 6 The sword of the Lord is filled with blood, It is made overflowing with fatness,With the blood of lambs and goats, With the fat of the kidneys of rams. For the Lord has a sacrifice in Bozrah,And a great slaughter in the land of Edom. 7 The wild oxen shall come down with them, And the young bulls with the mighty bulls; Their land shall be soaked with blood, And their dust saturated with fatness." 8 For it is the day of the Lord's vengeance, The year of recompense for the cause of Zion. (Isaiah 34:1-8)

The “heavenly signs” of the “sixth seal” and Day of the Lord are described in Revelation 6:12-17, Matthew 24:29, Luke 21:25-26, and other parts of the Bible.

Notice what Jesus said:

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. (Matthew 24:29-31)

We also see in the above that Jesus does not return until AFTER the tribulation.

Now, here are some comments by John Ogwyn on the Day of the Lord:

When the sixth seal is opened, John sees dramatic signs in the heavens. He describes great meteor showers—so intense that it appears that the very stars are falling out of the sky! He also describes events, resembling eclipses, involving the sun and the moon. The sun becomes dark, just as during a solar eclipse, and the moon takes on a reddish hue, just as it often does during a lunar eclipse. These dramatic and frightening events, accompanied by massive volcanic and earthquake activity (cf. Joel 2:30–31), are the prelude to the time of the Creator’s intervention, called throughout Scripture "the Day of the Lord."

At this point, there is a pause in the action before John sees the seventh seal opened. Revelation 7:1–4 makes plain that this pause is for a very specific purpose. Before the outpouring of God’s wrath, 144,000...from the 12 tribes of Israel are to be sealed so that they might be spared from what God is preparing to pour out on rebellious mankind.

A parallel can be found in Ezekiel 9, where Ezekiel saw a vision about God’s punishment on the rebellious people of Jerusalem. In the vision, he saw an angel clothed in linen with a writer’s inkhorn by his side standing beside the altar in front of the temple. The angel was told to go throughout the city, putting a mark on the foreheads of those who "sighed and cried" for all of the abominations of Jerusalem. In the wake of the angel with the writer’s inkhorn, the other angels were to go out as avenging angels to slay the rebellious and ungodly. In the same way, Revelation 7 describes...servants of God, and are to be set apart so that they might be spared God’s wrath that will be poured upon the children of disobedience during the coming Day of the Lord...

Many fail to notice that Revelation 7 records two different groups. They are both introduced by the same phrase, "after this I saw," recorded in verses 1 and 9. The 144,000 drawn from the 12 tribes precede the description of a multitude of indefinite number drawn from every nation and people. This great multitude is described in a victory celebration before the throne of God…(Ogwyn JH. Revelation: The Mystery Unveiled!, p. 27)

While most Protestant scholars understand that the 1260 days and “the time, times, and half a time” refer to 3 ½ years, some wrongly teach that the “Day of the Lord” will apparently only “be a lengthened day”(Walvoord, pp. 333,579).

That particular Protestant position is wrong because this specific “Day of the Lord” itself is shown to be a year long in Isaiah where it is basically described as punishment for those who punished the church (called Zion):

8 For it is the day of the LORD's vengeance, The year of recompense for the cause of Zion (Isaiah 34:8).

1 To proclaim liberty to the captives, And the opening of the prison to those who are bound; 2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, And the day of vengeance of our God; To comfort all who mourn, 3 To console those who mourn in Zion (Isaiah 61:1-3).

Within the Continuing Church of God (CCOG) it is understood that the seven trumpets plagues of Revelation 8, 9, and 11, and the seven plagues of Revelation 16 essentially constitute much of what will happen in the “Day of the Lord” (see also Ogwyn JH. Revelation: The Mystery Unveiled!, pp. 22-23)--though certain events in Matthew 24, Zechariah 14, and other portions of the Bible are also fulfilled then.

Since the Day of the Lord includes the event that the "star" (probably a comet) called Wormwood is to hit the planet (Revelation 8:10-11). The staging for armies in Armageddon (Revelation 16:16, and related to the sixth trumpet of Revelation 8:13-17) happens shortly after Wormwood (third trumpet) hits, hence 'Armageddon' will not happen in prior to the next decade (for more on Armageddon you can also read the article titled Armageddon).

The punishment during the Day of the Lord will come upon the spiritually desolate as God's wrath will be poured out (cf. Daniel 9:27b) (the 'Day of the Lord in 2 Peter 3 is discussed in the article What Did Early Christians Understand About the Resurrections?). Ten times in the Book of Revelation (NKJV) it speaks of God's wrath--many of those times speak of it being poured out (e.g. Revelation 16:1).

Now as far as will Jesus return in 2019 or will Jesus return in 2022? No, Jesus cannot return until seven years after the deal of Daniel 9:27a is confirmed (see also The 'Peace Deal' of Daniel 9:27). Since Jesus also does not return until after the Great Tribulation and the Day of the Lord, the next couple of years is simply not possible.

Regarding the “Day of the Lord” John Ogwyn wrote:

Here we should note that Scripture identifies the true saints as those who actually obey God and keep His commandments. Revelation 14:12 emphasizes this point by describing the saints in comparison to those who will receive God’s punishment…

John records a vision of seven angels, with seven golden bowls that pour out seven final plagues, one after another. This pouring occurs rather quickly, as we see when we examine the nature of the plagues. If the second and third plagues, for instance, lasted more than a few days, all life would perish from the planet.

When the first bowl is poured out, a grievous sore comes upon those who had disregarded the third angel’s message and were still loyal to the Beast system. Then, when the second angel pours out his bowl, all the oceans become like "the blood of a dead man" (16:3). All sea life dies. With the pouring out of the third bowl, all the fresh water turns to blood, and sources of drinking water are destroyed. Then, the fourth angel pours his bowl, and scorching heat from the sun punishes rebellious mankind. Next, great darkness comes upon Europe ("the seat of the Beast") and its people are in agonizing pain and heat, engulfed in total darkness and lacking usable water all at the same time. The darkness results from the bowl poured out by the fifth angel.

After this, John sees the sixth angel pour his bowl upon the Euphrates. Demon spirits go forth to bring all the armies together north of Jerusalem. The huge Asiatic army that had previously been massed on the east bank of the Euphrates pours into the land of Israel, and converges in the area of Armageddon (Hebrew for "mount of Megiddo"). Megiddo is a hill that stands overlooking the Valley of Jezreel, about 55 miles north of Jerusalem. When the final seventh bowl is poured out, there will be a tremendous earthquake so massive that the very topography of the earth itself will be altered (vv. 18–20). Very likely this earthquake is the same one that is described in Zechariah 14:4, when the feet of Jesus Christ finally stand once more upon the Mount of Olives, located just east of Jerusalem…

It is important that we realize now, and in the crucial years ahead, that God’s victory is certain. This history has already been written in advance! Therefore, it is imperative that we come out of this world’s Babylonish system (18:4), and give our total and true allegiance to Jesus Christ and the message that He taught! (Ogwyn JH. Revelation: The Mystery Unveiled!, pp. 38-39)

It should be noted since that apparently biggest of all earthquakes seems to take place near the end of the Day of the Lord, it probably cannot happen prior to 2022 (more on earthquakes, including a cool updated listing of major earthquakes around the world, please see Earthquakes Today and Bible Prophecy).

It should be noted that the Euphrates river DOES not dry up until the seventh seal is open which is over 2 1/2 years AFTER the start of the Great Tribulation. Also, although some teach that ancient Babylon will be end time Babylon, this is in error. Some details on this are in the link: WND: Mecca is Mystery Babylon.

There are many details, but basically this “Day of the Lord” is God’s vengeance on the world for persecuting His people and not listening to His servants like the two witnesses (watch also Prophecy and the Two Witnesses).

Also notice:

1 The word of the Lord came to me again, saying, 2 "Son of man, prophesy and say, 'Thus says the Lord God:

"Wail, 'Woe to the day!'
3 For the day is near,
Even the day of the Lord is near;
It will be a day of clouds, the time of the Gentiles. (Ezekiel 30:1-3)

35 And say, "Save us, O God of our salvation;
Gather us together, and deliver us from the Gentiles,
To give thanks to Your holy name,
To triumph in Your praise." (1 Chronicles 16:34-35)

22 I will overthrow the throne of kingdoms;
I will destroy the strength of the Gentile kingdoms.
I will overthrow the chariots
And those who ride in them;
The horses and their riders shall come down,
Every one by the sword of his brother. (Haggai 2:22)

But because of it (apparently referred to as "the day of affliction" below), many will learn and be prepared to repent:

19 O Lord, my strength and my fortress,
My refuge in the day of affliction,
The Gentiles shall come to You
From the ends of the earth and say,
"Surely our fathers have inherited lies,
Worthlessness and unprofitable things."
20 Will a man make gods for himself,
Which are not gods?

21 "Therefore behold, I will this once cause them to know,
I will cause them to know
My hand and My might;
And they shall know that My name is the LORD. (Jeremiah 16:19-21)

31 For the Lord will not cast off forever.
32 Though He causes grief,
Yet He will show compassion
According to the multitude of His mercies.
33 For He does not afflict willingly,
Nor grieve the children of men. (Lamentations 3:31-33)

Thus, there will be spiritual benefits from this time (see also Universal Offer of Salvation: There Are Hundreds of Verses in the Bible Supporting the Doctrine of True Apocatastasis). And the millennium comes after the Gentiles have trampled for their 42 months (cf. Revelation 11:2; Ezekiel 34:21-29, see also Did The Early Church Teach Millenarianism?).

Interestingly, there is a Catholic prophecy that indicates that at first their end-time two leaders will do well and turn the world Catholic (the first 2 ½ years or so) then their will be problems, leading to the destruction:

St. Caesar of Arles (6th Century): ...there will be a great Pope...This Pope shall have with him, the Great Monarch...This Great Monarch will assist the Pope in the reformation of the whole earth...All nations shall recognize the Holy See of Rome, and shall pay homage to the Pope. But after some considerable time fervor shall cool...which shall bring upon mankind the last and worse persecution of Anti-Christ...There shall be great carnage (Culleton, R. Gerald. The Prophets and Our Times. Nihil Obstat: L. Arvin. Imprimatur: Philip G. Scher, Bishop of Monterey-Fresno, November 15, 1941. Reprint 1974, TAN Books, Rockford (IL), p. 126-127).

It may be that the above Catholic prophecy is pointing to the Day of the Lord. For more information see the articles Europa, the Beast, and the Book of Revelation and Two Horned Beast of Revelation and 666.

One of the reasons that Jesus is returning will be to stop humans from destroying the earth and to punish those that are doing that:

22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect's sake those days will be shortened. (Matthew 24:22)

18 The nations were angry, and Your wrath has come,
And the time of the dead, that they should be judged,
And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints,
And those who fear Your name, small and great,
And should destroy those who destroy the earth. (Revelation 11:18)

Jesus will return at the last trumpet (1 Corinthians 15:52), the seventh one, during the time known as the Day of the Lord. The dead will be raised then (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17). This seems to have been understood by early second century leaders such as Polycarp and Polycrates who, respectively, wrote:

Wherefore, girding up your loins," "serve the Lord in fear" and truth, as those who have forsaken the vain, empty talk and error of the multitude, and "believed in Him who raised up our Lord Jesus Christ from the dead, and gave Him glory," and a throne at His right hand. To Him all things" in heaven and on earth are subject. Him every spirit serves. He comes as the Judge of the living and the dead. His blood will God require of those who do not believe in Him. But He who raised Him up from the dead will raise up us also, if we do His will, and walk in His commandments, and love what He loved (Polycarp. Letter to the Philippians, chapter II. Ante-Nicene Fathers, Volume 1 as edited by Alexander Roberts & James Donaldson. American Edition, 1885.)

For in Asia also great lights have fallen asleep, which shall rise again on the day of the Lord's coming, when he shall come with glory from heaven, and shall seek out all the saints. (Polycrates Letter to Victor as reported by Eusebius. Church History. Book V, Chapter 24).

That "Day of the Lord" includes the time of the return of Jesus Christ and the resurrection of the saints. Jesus may very well return before the end of the next decade.

Furthermore, notice:

13 So it shall be in that day:
The great trumpet will be blown;
They will come, who are about to perish in the land of Assyria,
And they who are outcasts in the land of Egypt,
And shall worship the Lord in the holy mount at Jerusalem. (Isaiah 27:13)

Jesus comes with the great sound of a trumpet (Matthew 24:31).

Concluding Comments on the Great Tribulation

We do live in perilous times. Many events are occurring that are changing the world as we have known it the past 50 or 60 years. But when will the Great Tribulation begin?

Since the deal involving the Daniel 9 prince (who is later to become the King of the North) has apparently not yet occurred, the Great Tribulation cannot possibly begin prior to 2022 (but many things of prophetic interest still are likely happen before then; see the Church of God Bible-News-Prophecy page). And the Great Tribulation probably will not begin until after then. You may also wish to watch the YouTube video titled: you may also wish to watch a short YouTube video titled: Might the Great Tribulation start in 2019? There is also another sermon produced later titled The Great Tribulation from the Mount of Olives as well as another titled Can the Great Tribulation begin before 2020?

But make no mistake about it--the end is coming and fairly soon--and most probably, sometime in the next ten or so years. But the Great Tribulation will not start in nor in 2019 nor in 2020 nor in 2021 (if there is a major war in the Middle East that is resolved by the Fall of 2019, then maybe 2023).

Yet the Great Tribulation is coming and will start under the final administration of the United States as that nation (and its Anglo-allies) will be destroyed then (see also Anglo - America in Prophecy and/or watch 13 Ways President-Elect Trump is Apocalyptic.). Jesus is coming second time (Hebrews 9:28) and that is after the Great Tribulation (Matthew 24:37-44) starts (Matthew 24:21).

Sorrows (Matthew 24:7-8) and troubles (Mark 13:7-8) have begun.

What will you do about your spiritual condition before it is too late?

Here is a link to a version of this article in the Spanish language: ¿Puede comenzar la Gran Tribulación en 2018 o 2019? ¿Es el Tiempo de los Gentiles?

Back to home page

Thiel B. Can the Great Tribulation Begin in 2019, 2020, or 2021? www.cogwriter.com/when-will-the-great-tribulation-begin.htm 2008, 2009, 2010/2011/2012/2013/2014/2015/2016/2017/2018 1223

، The Great Wall 2016

[The Great Wall 2016]

نویسنده و منبع | تاریخ انتشار: Mon, 07 Jan 2019 18:51:00 +0000

The Great Wall 2016

August 2016 - Bondage Video Discussion Forum Archive

Name Posts 14718) Flintstone

Monday, 1 August 2016 12:13 AM

to Booley: The Great Wall 2016 Those mean old Republicans are the ones who believe the government should not interfere with a person's freedom of expression through speech codes.

Sorry Boss, I know this is political, but that's a load of hooey. The Great Wall 2016 Republicans are the ones usually leading the fight to shut sites like this down, so don't blow smoke up my st and tell me Cheeto Jesus will make it all better.

14719) Ralphus

Monday, 1 August 2016 12:31 AM EMAIL

Jav Critic: Thanks for another review. The Great Wall 2016 As someone who has been mostly ignorant of the superheroine genre, I didn't even know Rapture Entertainment existed, let alone closed down. So all their movies are in the public domain now? I'll take your word, since I wasn't able to find them anywhere on the net.

So one question...after looking at your vidcaps, does this "Wizard" work for the Home Depot?

The direct link for your latest review is here: http://ralphus.net/reviews/other/wizardunvictorious.htm

-----------------------------------------

Tavy wrote:

Just came across the film "Voyage to Agatis". That girl is definitely in merciless peril after being hunted and cornered. What subsequently happens to her, with a knife, is almost sickening :)

So sickening you're smiling, I see. I haven't heard of that movie. What does happen to her?

-----------------------------------------

booley wrote:

To all you antiTrumpsters who keep posting on here: Don't you realize it's the Feminazis in the Democrat Party who would like to shut this site down on the grounds that it constitutes "hate speech"?

Uh huh. Where's your proof? Or are you just making stuff up? You do realize we've had a Democrat in the White House for the past 8 years and the site is still up and running, right?

Those mean old Republicans are the ones who believe the government should not interfere with a person's freedom of expression through speech codes.

Right, that's why there were a whopping 361 people charged with obscenity by the Obscenity Prosecution Task Force during Bush's reign of terror. And how many were there under President Obama? Only 2. Obama's Attorney General finally shut down the Obscenity Prosecution Task Force in 2011, and of course, who complained? Well, mostly it was Republicans. Big surprise. These same Republicans who continue to promise to fight in their 2016 party platform.

Seriously, guys. I don't know why you continue to ignore the obvious about the Republican party's agenda against adult entertainment. It hasn't changed for decades.

14720) Eda

Monday, 1 August 2016 12:53 AM

Wow, Brainmaster. Not sure what I said to deserve that.

Monday, 1 August 2016 02:24 AM

Ralphus : Thanks for that. I have two more reviews on the way too, and one is already finished And yeah as far as I know their films are public domain, or at least I've been treating them like they are. Also I'm pretty sure ''The Wizard'' does work at Home Depot

14722) Bill K.

Monday, 1 August 2016 02:40 AM

Well if you believe Trump will protect the 1st First Amendment....
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
... If he becomes President you have to remember how he reacts and replies to anyone, especially women, that says anything he disagrees with or is critical of what he said or did in his crooked business dealing.

He openly calls women he doesn't like "pigs" for daring to ask him a question he doesn't want to answer.

What he says tells you he can't be trusted to protect anyone's 1st amendment or any constitutional rights period. He doesn't want to be President. He wants to be a King.

Now this is my last political post.
Bill K.

14723) MrAnthony

Monday, 1 August 2016 02:47 AM

BillK: You make it sound like Mr. Trump would actually enjoy the Bring Out the GIMP website, LOL.

14724) lionrobe

Monday, 1 August 2016 03:12 AM EMAIL

May I play with you ?

14725) A Canadian

Monday, 1 August 2016 03:42 AM

Brainmaster wrote:

The finally will be when....

It ain't over till the spell check tool gets it right.

Monday, 1 August 2016 06:44 AM EMAIL

We have been filming like mad lately so I am not sure how late I am to the poll. But for me it really depends on the situation. Kind of like the vibe question a while back. Sometimes it really adds to it while other times it almost takes away. One example if I were a hired professional meant to torture and leave the body to be found, there would most likely not be rape.

14727) A Canadian

Monday, 1 August 2016 08:13 AM

Jav Critic: Great work on the review of The Wizard: Unvictorious.

I gotta admit, the caps also had me thinking there must be a dungeon section somewhere at Home Depot.

Regardless, Chloe Valentine looks like a good find. And the fact that the film can be watched guilt-free for no cost just adds to the bargain (well, guilt-free regarding the payment aspect, at any rate). I'll have to take a look.

14728) Covers the Relentless

Monday, 1 August 2016 08:18 AM

New Man Aug 1966 p25

14729) Covers the Relentless

Monday, 1 August 2016 08:18 AM

New Man Aug 1966 p24

Monday, 1 August 2016 08:23 AM EMAIL

Ralphus Voyage to Atari's. - the cute girl had spent the previous day and night tied stretched naked across the foredeck of a boat where she was raped and apparently (not seen) beaten. After being forced to swim ashore she is hunted then, once cornered, she gets belly stabbed, knife ducked, her tongue ripped out then finally disemboweled.

All in all a nice little holiday for her!

Monday, 1 August 2016 11:30 AM

@Marc:

I think I am a good candidate to answer your question #14714
The girl in the middle appears in

MOOD PICTURES
--------------
Sentenced to C.P. (corporal punishment)
Stepmother
Rehabilitation Institute

ELITEPAIN
--------
Domina Education 2
Dr Lomp's Practice 1

Monday, 1 August 2016 01:07 PM EMAIL

Hey guys and gals! The newest update to the Bunny Bound site is UP! today marks the first of several entries of the excruciating tale called 'Bunny's Boob Job!'

Also, this Friday, a NEW Weekly story begins! Set your faces to 'stunned' when you see what happens when Bunny gets abducted by ALIENS! (Sorry, I had to use that reference)

No sign up fees, ALL free to enjoy!

Of course you can help support more art by purchasing the 80 page graphic novel for a mere $9.99...I'll just leave that there...

14733) Brainmaster

Monday, 1 August 2016 03:50 PM

Eda said: Wow, Brainmaster. Not sure what I said to deserve that.

I just wanted to offer you the opportunity to "volunteer" to "sacrifice" for the greater good.

Monday, 1 August 2016 04:02 PM

Here is an interesting little article on Trump's stand on . Looks like he's anti to the core.

[nypost.com]

I'll post the test in case you dont want to click the link.

Donald Trump will crack down on internet ography if elected president, vowing to appoint a commission to examine its “harmful public health impact.”

News of the promise — which comes as racy photos of his wife, Melania, were obtained by The Post — is part of “The Children’s Internet Safety Presidential Pledge” from the group Enough Is Enough, which Trump signed on July 16.

The anti- commitment means he promises to “uphold the rule of law by aggressively enforc[ing] existing federal laws to prevent the ual exploitation of children online, including the federal obscenity laws, child ography laws, ual predation laws and the trafficking laws.”

He also pledges to:

“Aggressively enforce the Children’s Internet Protection Act (CIPA) requiring schools and public libraries using government eRate monies to filter child ography and ography by requiring effective oversight by the Federal Communications Commission;

“Protect and defend the innocence of America’s children by advancing public policies that prevent the ual exploitation of children in a manner that is consistent with the government’s compelling interest in protecting its most vulnerable citizens, within the limits set forth by the First Amendment.”

Hillary Clinton has not signed the anti- pledge, citing a policy of not signing pledges, according to the Washington Examiner.

The racy snaps capture 25-year-old Melania Trump — then Melania Knauss — in various stages of mostly undress, and in at least one, in a nude embrace with another woman. The photos were published in a now-defunct French magazine in the 1990s.

Trump spokesman Jason Miller told CNN that the mogul is “a little more focused on the direction of the country and what we need to do to get it turned around.”

“They’re a celebration of the human body as art, and [there’s] nothing to be embarrassed about with the photos. She’s a beautiful woman,” Miller added.

So, looks like we are heading back to the dark ages again if Trump gets in.

But until then, here's a little something from twitter. Enjoy it while it lasts lol.

Rick

#BONDAGE #BDSM A y bosslady gets #suspended and #whipped in "Bitter Sweet Persuasion" https://t.co/iKtQYWTWmu pic.twitter.com/H8EXwqejKs

— ZFX Productions (@ZFXProductions) July 31, 2016

14735) lionrobe

Monday, 1 August 2016 04:24 PM EMAIL

14736) frog

Monday, 1 August 2016 05:52 PM

Since the political wave has not abated and I already made my contribution to it, here is another contribution with political undertones, political prisoner theme, that is. This is a homage to Madison Young, one of the major stars in the glittering GIMP firmament.

Osouk, I recently stumbled upon your Tumblr collection. Thanks for including one of my electro manips. There is plenty of food for thought and other things in your collection, I will probably be using some of it soon.

14737) Bill K.

Monday, 1 August 2016 06:51 PM

MrAnthony you said:
"BillK: You make it sound like Mr. Trump would actually enjoy the Bring Out the GIMP website, LOL."

Not necessarily true, because in Trump's case he wants hurt women but not in an erotic fantasy way like we do.

This site is not the same as 95% of websites that the Republicans are targeting, because we fantasize violence against women so we can't say for certain a Democrat president wouldn't want to get rid of us too.

Sexual nudity and violence are two different issues yet when combined it could make this site a bigger target for both Democratic and Republican politicians.

A continuation of my last post which I said was my last. I just had to answer MrAnthony's post and point out the graphic violence angle point of view.
Bill K.

14738) lionrobe

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 12:30 AM EMAIL

14739) Judah

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 02:04 AM

14740) Ralphus

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 02:13 AM EMAIL

Judah: Congratulations, this might have been our toughest GIMP Trivia ever. I tried to make it a bit easier for folks by giving the actress's name, but this was still a very difficult one. Wear that Trivia Crown with pride.

In keeping with our recent theme of women used for target practice, the movie is The Angel and the Beasts, also known as Triangle of Lust, an extremely rare West German thriller about a beautiful young girl who parachutes onto a remote, isolated island, and finds herself taken prisoner by a gang of criminals hiding out there. Patricia Adriani is tied spread-eagled against a wall and is tormented by having knives thrown at her. But her captor, realizing how hot she looks tied up like that, doesn't stop there and precedes to rape her afterward. I have no idea how JD found such a sharp print, since all the ones I've seen are muddy and poor quality.

Here's the direct link to the scene:

[www99.zippyshare.com]

14741) Osouk

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 02:23 AM

Here's a picture I really like - even though there's no nudity. There are so may things in this picture that do it for me - the ropes gagging her and holding her head up by her hair, the way the heels on her shoes are used as part of her bondage (I've always liked that since HOM days) and the suspension which must be very uncomfortable. And the knowledge that soon she will be surrounded by men holding clubs, and electric prods, and long needles who won't believe her desperate begging and screaming that she doesn't know anything. My only criticism is that the background should look more like a dodgy room in the police cellars rather than the antiseptic white that's been used.

frog - another nice manip - I always love the detail you put into your stories. I hope you don't mind that I posted one to my Tumblr feed - if it's OK I may include others.

14742) JD

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 07:36 AM EMAIL

14743) Covers the Relentless

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 08:16 AM

New Man Aug 1966 Saunders art

14744) Kelderek

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 08:47 AM EMAIL

Here is my latest picture for your GIMPish pleasure!

The girl spent a week or two in "the Hole"... what would you evil GIMP'ers do to her next?

14745) gimpfan

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 09:27 AM

For J.D. What is the password to open the .rar files ?

14746) JD

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 11:35 AM EMAIL

gimpfan said For J.D. What is the password to open the .rar files ?

ralphus.net

14747) frog

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 11:36 AM

14741) Osouk Thanks for appreciating my "work". Feel free to post the ones you like.

Since I mentioned Madison Young in my last post I attach an image from one of her best performances, to my taste. It's a pity it is just straight bondage, but you can extrapolate to a realistic interrogation scene in any time setting or maybe a captured by "savages" soon to be ravaged scene.

14748) Bill K.

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 01:55 PM

Regarding post 14744 by Kelderek.
First of all Terrific poser artwork.

Strangely I wash the dirt and smell off her first for two weeks in a hole . Don't torture the torturers.

Then rack and rape or rape and rack followed by tenderizing whipping and branding on Spanish Horse.

Then finish her off by BATS of course.

Bill K.

14749) xerxes73

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 02:03 PM

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 03:42 PM

Answering to Rick. As far as I can see Trump is only going after kiddie and limiting access to minors. Surely thats a good thing. Porns is probably best hidden away under the counter just like in the old days. Maybe we should get back to that.
IMO - anyone who votes for Hillary must be totally deluded - the woman is 100% evil. Maybe they didn't see "Clinton Cash" (Youtube).

14751) Corvid

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 04:32 PM

Sorry- small rant ahead. Non-election, for what it's worth.

Listened to NPR on the radio this morning, a choice I increasingly suspect might be a mistake.

They had a "critic" going off on the portrayal of ual violence in HBO programming, particularly- but not limited to- "Game of Thrones".

(You can find the snippet of "Here and Now" for the price of a web search if you feel the need to fume.)

And... Good lord, the layers of nested assumptions. I don't spend a lot of time raging about the derned mainstream media, but when so much twaddle goes unchecked and unquestioned, it becomes a real stretch to call such analyses anything like "news".

Does rape in a tv program "normalize" rape in real life? Are viewers such sheep that watching actors mime out a ual assault brings forth desires for antisocial behavior heretofore unrecognized in their breasts? Must we be vigilant, in our greater wisdom, to keep our eighteen-to-eighty year old children from consuming something that might warp their tiny little minds?

I'm sure that in this venue most readers recognize the questions as rhetorical. I find it horrifying- sickening- that these people, who think themselves so enlightened, have apparently never been burdened with even answering them straight. Or contemplating what answers they would give might say about them, their opinions of human nature, democracy, free speech, and those unruly beasts known as heteroual men.

I'm frustrated as a GIMP fan, of course, but also as a story-teller. Regardless of whether I might enjoy seeing a garment torn from the body of an attractive actress, or a woman might feel a stirring at the fantasy of a handsome actor feeling such an overpowering passion that he feels compelled to take her by force, the presence of a willing audience is not enough for professional scolds. Why should creators be compelled to shape fictional narratives around the so-called sensibilities of those who fail to recognize the fictions they would impose on the real world through their own misguided narratives?

...So. How does one pen a letter to HBO, suggesting that for the sake of their creative teams, they tell the harbingers of weasel-words like "problematic" that they should go fuck themselves?

14752) JD

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 05:50 PM EMAIL

Fully agree, Corvid. A balanced discussion panel on NPR is a mild-leftist, a Bernie-grade socialist and a crazied radical SJW. Same with PBS.

The campaign to mold the fabric of the movies into what the regressive left finds acceptable is nothing new. Black James Bonds, all female Ghostbusters, it's all societal push toward the same leveling utopic dream, where every one can be replaced with every one. There's only one problem with this. The market is not really crazy about the new products and they either bomb or do mediocre. After all, they can bombard you with new-and-improved recipes but they can't force you spend your dollar in the movie hall. Not yet, anyway.

As Naomi Campbell found out in 90s when complaining about why she gets only 60% pay compared to others fairer models when doing covers, the readership tend to buy more when the cover is something they are tribally familiar with. Like 40% more.

As a note, I see that people still relate to the past when debating the merits of the platforms of each party. Please stop it. It's as useless as claiming that Republicans are the friends of black population because they pushed for Reconstruction and Blacks in positions of power after the civil war.

Keep your eyes open, as Mr. Anthony said. Look for the trends, not for the dogmatic platforms. Look which way the society is moving toward. Look who's doing the push and why.

I don't care if ralphus.net would hypothetically do better under Jimmy Carter or Gerald Ford. Neither should you.

The future belongs to grass root movements, is recent history is to be observed. Your doctrinal arguments might make sense if you weight the platform of Tea Party-iers from the right against the SJW regressives from the left. What the establishment wants is getting less and less relevant, as we witness. Please don't use it as an argument.

I'm (re)watching the BR release of Videodrome. I still believe that's the iest imaginable whipping of a TV set. I will add it in a future update.

14753) Kelderek

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 05:56 PM EMAIL

Bill K. wrote:

Regarding post 14744 by Kelderek.
First of all Terrific smile cool poser artwork.

Thank you!
It's actually not made in Poser, but in DAZ Studio... similar, but a different software! Rendering done with LuxRender.

14754) boccaccio

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 08:10 PM EMAIL

Re Mr Nowicki' comment in #14750 that the Clinton Foundation is a cesspool of corruption.

The American Institute of Philanthropy, which evaluates the % of donations that are used for the purpose intended (as opposed to often self-serving overhead), has found that 89% of the Clinton Foundation's receipts were used for its charitable mission. As you may know many fund-raising organizations only pass along 5% to 10% of their receipts to the charitable cause advertised in their promotions.

The Clinton Foundation received an A rating from the AIP.
~~~~~~~~~~~
I have enjoyed several of your films, Mr Nowicki. Keep up the good work.

Tuesday, 2 August 2016 08:40 PM EMAIL

Hey GIMP boys and girls! More good news from the Bunny Bound front!

I will soon be releasing through Patreon, a completely interactive story featuring Bunny Bound! You will be able to call the shots based on a field of options, and can GIMP out our victim in various ways!

This is going to be a lot of horrific fun, and I ca't wait to get it going!

I've already finished some new key artwork to get the story going and working out several scenarios that will leave many perils open for your input!

It will then be a matter of creating the images on a regular basis!

It's like dream custom art meets comics, meets the GIMP community!

I'll give you all a heads up when it's all ready to go! In the meantime, I hope you've enjoyed this weeks' first new update on the Bunny Bound site!

More on the way!

14756) Ralphus

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 01:22 AM EMAIL

Roman Nowicki wrote:

As far as I can see Trump is only going after kiddie and limiting access to minors.

Except he's not. I realize you're not American, so let me explain how the Republicans always justify going after ...and they've done it this way for years. What they do is disguise their intentions, conveniently using the excuse that "it's to protect the children." Who could possibly be against that? The children! Our precious CHILDREN!

Here's the truth. It's NEVER about the children. Seriously. Oh, they give their bills names like The Children Internet Protection Act and the Child Exploitation and Obscenity Section, names designed to give the public a warm feeling that their focus is honorable and is there to protect minors, but that's all a smokescreen. Under Bush, they used the 2257 regulations as an excuse to harass and threaten adult producers, legitimate businessmen who had no desire and no intention of hiring underaged performers. And the Republicans succeeded in shutting down a number of adult websites along the way.

Let me prove to you it's not just child they're going after. Closely read Trump's own words from the New York Post article that Rick linked:

Aggressively enforce the Children’s Internet Protection Act (CIPA) requiring schools and public libraries using government eRate monies to filter child ography and ography by requiring effective oversight by the Federal Communications Commission...

Notice the words "and ography" were carefully added after the words "child ography"? Why do you think that is? If they're only going after kiddy , then what other kind of ography could they be pursuing? Could it be violent ography? Gay ography? How about any kind of ography they don't like? It's pretty open-ended.

But one thing for sure...they're not going to stop at just kiddy .

-----------------------------------------

JD wrote:

I see that people still relate to the past when debating the merits of the platforms of each party. Please stop it. It's as useless as claiming that Republicans are the friends of black population because they pushed for Reconstruction and Blacks in positions of power after the civil war.

Another ludicrous example...trying to go back 150 years to prove your point. Even if you're going to totally ignore all the past 5 decades of Republican trends of attacking adult material (which you shouldn't...it's the equivalent of putting your fingers in your ears and whistling to avoid hearing the truth), just for fun, let's not go back in time. Let's try a different year. How about...2016? Did you not read the 2016 Republican Party platform that says they're going to go after ? How about Trump's own pledge where he promises to do the same thing? Jesus, can it not be any more obvious?

You remind me of the mayor in Jaws who vows not to close down the beaches even though he knows there's a Great White shark out there.

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 02:01 AM EMAIL

I don't want to make a big thing of this but when Republicans mention Pornography they are talking about "requiring schools and public libraries using government eRate monies" to have restrictions - no mention if ISPS or private users as far as I can see.

However we live in a much more dangerous times now, the Doomsday clock is almost at midnight. When voting one must look at the full picture. And politics is far more complicated than we have space for here. All I would ask is please do not get your info from the corporate run medias (especially CNN).... and now a picture from Tortured By Demons II:Trapped in Hell

14758) Bill K.

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 03:25 AM

News flash - Trump's campaign is becoming unglued.
As of right now the Republican party is in disarray and some announced they're going vote for Clinton. They just now get it. Trump is a crooked bigot and a moron.

Debating what Trump and the Republicans position on the 1st amendment this election is a waste of time.
Bill K.

14759) Bondage_Barbie_Doll

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 04:50 AM EMAIL

My first attempt at a full scene, hope you guys like it!

14760) Covers the Relentless

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 07:24 AM

New Man Aug 1967

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 07:55 AM EMAIL

Wow. Look at all of the political BS taking over the site.

Guess I should just skip logging in to check what's new until after November?

14762) Bronx_Warrior

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 03:44 PM EMAIL

JD @post 14742- Really awesome mainstream clips. This is why we want you to be in this forum forever!

Barbarian Queen uncut scenes
I found this clip in another forum, want to share here..but not surprisingly, this uncut version doesn't have onscreen tying of Lana to the torture rack (or) undressing her panties (scene has full frontal scene)!

Barbarian Queen 1985 Deleted.Scenes.mkv
[www73.zippyshare.com]

If the movie makers are planning for another sequel, my dream is to my favorite vampire star Amelia [Zita Gorog] as new Barbarian Queen..

14763) Flintstone

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 05:16 PM

to Bronx Warrior: Great find, much appreciated! I am having trouble with seeing it though; tried to get it to play from the site and by downloading it, but no go.

14764) lionrobe

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 05:33 PM EMAIL

14765) JD

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 05:36 PM EMAIL

Something to keep the ball rolling.

@Bronx_Warrior: Thanks.

@Ralphus: *sigh*, I give up. You're a textbook illustration of cognitive dissonance. You're apparently unable to think outside party lines. In your universe, a non-Democrat is a Republican and vice-versa. I give up, honestly. You have simple answers for simple problems, usually involving dichotomies. My non-binary approach can't find common grounds with your boolean mindset, no offense.

@Dick Napalm: Great! Keep them coming. Just be aware that the board can be awfully silent sometimes toward the creatives that post here. Don't confuse it with a lack of interest. This school of pervs is particularly shy.

Kathyrne said Wow. Look at all of the political BS taking over the site.

And later the good German citizens asked themselves how it was possible to end up with Nazis. After all, Hitler was elected with less than a third of the votes. Germans had better things to do than bother with this lumpenproletariat hobby, the politicks.

14766) Netrap

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 07:09 PM EMAIL

Note to JD: Germany got Adolf Hitler as Chancellor because the ruling class did not want to go through another election.

Germany had a parliamentary system of democracy. There had been an election in 1932 that had been marked by violent clashes between Communist and National-Socialist forces. No one party had the votes to form a Government all by its lonesome. Two other parties got the opportunity to form a coalition government, but neither could seal the deal. Somehow, the National Socialist German Workers' Party managed to put together a coalition that could manage a majority in the parliament.

The alternative would have been to call another election--with the fear of more riots and strife in the wake of such a happenstance. The ruing class did not want that--so, they swallowed hard, and let Hitler form the government--and you know the rest of the story!

14767) A Canadian

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 07:15 PM

JD wrote:

I'm reminded of something civil rights lawyer Harvey A. Silverglate once said. From the New York Times:

“The world didn’t suffer because too many people read ‘Mein Kampf,’ ” Mr. Silverglate said. “Sending Hitler on a speaking tour of the United States would have been quite a good idea.”

And, yes, I realize we may be verging on proving there's merit to Godwin's Law.

---

Eda and others may be interested in this. According to Dick Morris, Libertarian Leader Gary Johnson is close to having the support needed to participate in the leaders' debates: Dick Morris blog.

---

Finally, on a personal note, I'll be away from GIMP-land for a bit as I embark on a trip that will give me some first-hand exposure to election angst in America. I look forward to catching up with everyone in mid-August.

14768) elkcreek

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 07:27 PM EMAIL

Thanks for the update JD, Stryker is one of my favorite of all times. Probably my first VHS rental.

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 08:13 PM EMAIL

Thanks for saying so JD!!! Really appreciate it!

So, as well as updating the Bunny Bound site TWICE weekly, on Monday and Friday, there will be 'SURPRISE' updates too!

Like, that is to say there just might be one....SOON!

Really want to push the limits of human endurance with Bunny, beyond Ilsa, beyond ZFX, Beyond Barbarian Queen, beyond Prichard, and Stanton, and do a lot of crazy 'dream' scenarios with the plump Pain Twat! I want to really make GIMP history with this!

All of your input to the site is GREATLY appreciated!

Thanks everyone!

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 08:22 PM EMAIL

Sorry, no image this time. Don't have the time to make one.

@JD: and if this were a political site, or a general conversation site, or any other such thing, you'd have a point. This is, however, a site.

And I have been calling the Democrats "the Nazi Party" for about 6 years now. But I don't put my own opinion out there too often, and had no intention of mentioning it here.

Further, that's all I intend to say on the subject as well.

Will try to have a nice horrible torture image next time. Sorry y'all.

14771) JD

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 09:30 PM EMAIL

Something to keep the ball rolling.

Kathyrne said @JD: and if this were a political site, or a general conversation site, or any other such thing, you'd have a point. This is, however, a site.

I disagree. The topic (before it was highjacked) was 'is the new political culture more permissive or more supressive to sites like ralphus.net' and how much damage is to be expected from various political forces (including but not exclusive to) Dem and Rep. Ralphus said it's within limits.

I'm rubbed the wrong way by people who tend to assume they hold a moral higher ground simply because they don't care about the issue.

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 09:48 PM EMAIL

I never said I had the moral high ground.

I never said you did either.

I said I was mortally tired of the Political BS. It was discussed. And discussed. And discussed to death.

If I skip a few 13ths, it's gonna be because I am really, really fed up with the threads here. I'd rather not do that. Hence my posting at all on this topic.

(Pretty sure I copied that image from the forum a while ago)

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 10:32 PM EMAIL

Okay, Really felt bad not leaving a Bunny torture image with my last post...

'Just a reminder that the Bunny Bound site 'might' be posting a surprise update before the regular scheduled one this Friday!

'wink wink, nudge nudge...

That is all...

14774) Ralphus

Wednesday, 3 August 2016 10:53 PM EMAIL

JD wrote:

*sigh*, I give up...You're apparently unable to think outside party lines. In your universe, a non-Democrat is a Republican and vice-versa. I give up, honestly. You have simple answers for simple problems, usually involving dichotomies...

You can call it a dichotomy, but there really are only two legitimate choices for President, both of which are polar opposites. The discussion is about which party is more beneficial or detrimental to the future of this site. All I was stating is that based on decades of past experience, when the GOP is in charge of the presidency, bad things happen to our freedoms. To ignore history would just be foolish.

---------------------------------

Kathyrne wrote:

I said I was mortally tired of the Political BS. It was discussed. And discussed. And discussed to death.

In running this forum for many years, I can tell you that your reaction is not atypical. For the most part, people don't come here to read about politics, and some of them get annoyed when they see it discussed here. I totally get that. At our core, we're all about tying up women. But let me show you our mission statement, which has been part of the site since Day One back in 1999:

This site is devoted to reviewing and discussing Extreme Bondage Videos. Visitors are encouraged to provide their feedback about recent releases, their favorite scenes and videos, and their opinion on such issues as censorship and free expression. They are welcome to relate their personal experiences and/or problems with their fetish.

And unfortunately, we live in challenging political times where the powers that be want to take away our freedoms to view what we want in the privacy of our homes. If you think the political talk is bad now, you should peruse the Guestbook Archives during the period that Bush was President. It was a tough eight years, and we had to deal with constant threats to the adult industry, people were indicted and jailed, bondage websites closed and we even had fears that our discussion forum could be shut down at any time.

During the Obama administration, things have definitely been more relaxed around here, but these same political discussions reappear every four years around election time. I don't like politics any more than you do, but I hate having my freedoms taken away even more. So while some people may not like it, it's important to the site that it be discussed so people can be informed. I think the more vocal crowd has already said their piece on the subject, and I'm guessing the political talk will likely dwindle down to nothing in due time. I get sick of it myself, but like it or not, it's not something we should ignore. The threat is very real, and our votes do matter, especially in this upcoming election.

So...anybody seen any good movies lately?

14775) Judah

Thursday, 4 August 2016 12:34 AM

I tell you one thing if a politician came along and promised to FIRE every one of those losers at Kink.com and overhaul the entire way they shoot and then restore it to the traditional BDSM of the old days - that Politician is gonna have my vote whatever party they belong too.

14776) Mwb

Thursday, 4 August 2016 08:12 AM

Count me in as one who comes here to find GIMP, not politics.

But, given the craziness of this election, let me give you Trump's speech to his followers when he loses.

[www.youtube.com]

14777) Covers the Relentless

Thursday, 4 August 2016 08:14 AM

New Man Aug 1967 original art

14778) JD

Thursday, 4 August 2016 11:35 AM EMAIL

Something to keep the ball rolling.

There are probably 2000 lurkers around here and frankly I don't give a rat ass for their opinion on anything. If one stays mum all the time and only voices his displeasure for a temporary interruption into his supply of masturbatory material, well, I'm not paying attention.

But again, I'm a certifiable unappologetic jerk.

I'd like to know the take on the issue from someone our Relentless Knight of Unlimited Covers. Those are the people I pay attention to. Producers, not consumers.

Thursday, 4 August 2016 02:15 PM EMAIL

Hey Gimp Lovers! the New 'Suprise' post is up and ready to check out on the Bunny Bound web site!

This new art and story is in addition to the already twice weekly updates every Monday and Friday! So....Bonus!

If you have the time, please let me know your thoughts on this particular new update...Like it? Dislike it? Why? It all goes to improve the content for YOU!

Thanks!

14780) e's bodyguard

Thursday, 4 August 2016 02:40 PM

I guess I'm one of those rat's asses that JD doesn't care for. So be it, I'm tired of reading his postings.

But for the record. Hitler was never elected personally to office. His party got in, and he, as head of the party, was asked to form a government. A later referendum is usually mistaken as being
an election.

I would hope that the current 'tolerance' of Internet sites will continue, but I believe the real enemy are those who wish to control the Internet by making MORE money off of it.
I have to go thru Cox, erodite when not using my computer link, goes thru Comcast. The fourth and largest cable companies. Anyone seen them lowering prices lately? Forget Republicans trying to eleminate sites like this. It's those who do not own the site who want to charge for bringing it into your homes.

14781) Bill K.

Thursday, 4 August 2016 03:11 PM

Being Ralphus is in a gimp archery mood going by the last 4 or so today pictures I offer a less melancholy bmovievillian arrow peril.

Michelle, Ann, and Kathy are finding out about arrows, quivers, and some shakes. I think the entire thing is leaving them melon-colly.

Bill K.

14782) JD

Thursday, 4 August 2016 04:43 PM EMAIL

Something to keep the ball rolling.

e's bodyguard said So be it, I'm tired of reading his postings.

And that's PERFECT!!! The freedom to scroll stuff you don't like should be in the 28th Amendment! Just don't be a regressive asking for people to shut up because you don't like their opinions! *sheepish voice* Because we only gather here to watch and we are triggered if otherwise ... we need our safe spaces where non- is not allowed.

14783) Brainmaster

Thursday, 4 August 2016 06:04 PM

What we need here is one our the top notch gimp writers to come up with a story about a young woman feminist politician running for office, but hot with greatly suppressed gimp needs, who gets kidnapped by some Trumpians. They take her to a place in the woods where they torture and rape her for several days. Perhaps they video the entire thing and stream it online. Any takers?

Thursday, 4 August 2016 06:23 PM EMAIL

A fan commented in a message about how long the post of JUSTINE is taking. It was not a complaint. It was more like a sigh "it's taking so long". OK, for the record, the post production of a movie can take up to a year, easily. It will depend on the complexity of the film itself and what has to be done to complete it. A film like Sirwiñakuy, that was shot in 2008, it was finally released in 2010. Martyr, that was shot in 2002, premiered in a film festival in 2005, but was officially released in 2011! OLALLA's production was finished in May of 2014, it was released in January of 2015, that's 8 months after the final day of shooting. Maleficarum was shot between November 2010 and January 2011. It was released on the 31st of October, 2011, 9 months after post began. Is JUSTINE taking too long? No, the final day of production was on December 16 of last year. Post production started in earnest after the holidays. That's 7 months ago. Pretty normal. If we consider that the actual editing was done at the end of May, and that for almost two months Jac was not available to work on his film, well, that makes it even faster than normal. Thus, JUSTINE is not taking too long.

Jac and Amy want the film to look, sound, feel more than good! There's no point on rushing something that has so much promise. Jac is going over the sound, to make sure it's all great. Amy is working on the subtitles, mostly German and for the hearing impaired, since the entire movie is in ENGLISH! Yes, Amy, Bea, Mila, Jac and the rest speak in English in this movie. As soon as Jac gives the ok for the sound, the assets for the DVD and download versions of the film will be prepared for Uploading/duplicating and the store will be ready to offer the new film to the world. That is happening now! I can speculate that the film will be released sometime before the end of this month. But I rather not. I rather wait for Jac and Amy to tell me the actual date of release.

In the meantime, Amy decided to put a FOUR DAY ONLY SALE! But 2 or more of our movies and you get a 30% DISCOUNT!

14785) Bill K.

Thursday, 4 August 2016 11:56 PM

My previous post I said "Being Ralphus is in a gimp archery mood."

Darts is sort of an archery sport without the bow. Right ? Bill K.

14786) Ralphus

Friday, 5 August 2016 12:36 AM EMAIL

Final poll results:

GIMP POLL:
In thinking about your erotic entertainment (movies, videos, fiction, etc), how important is it to include some sort of rape scene? And why?
A. Essential, rape is the main thing I look for 4 votes
B. Important, but I like other stuff, too 23 votes
C. Neutral, I can take them or leave them 18 votes
D. Not important, I don't like rape scenes 14 votes

I think I may have to rethink my previous declaration that Rape is Man's Favorite Sport. Not so, according to the poll. Slightly over half (54%) either don't like rape or are neutral about it. The answer I chose (B) ultimately got the most votes, though.

I would think that logically, the main reason for tying up a woman would be to use her ually. That would be my choice, anyway. So I'm wondering, if you're not gonna rape her, what is your motivation for tying her up in the first place?

Thanks to everyone who voted in the poll.

14787) Bill K.

Friday, 5 August 2016 01:45 AM

Ralphus said "So I'm wondering, if you're not gonna rape her, what is your motivation for tying her up in the first place?"

So she don't run away and escape from her merciless peril or heaven forbid turn the table on her torturer.

In my case the stake damsel is not going to stay to be toasted if she's not tied to the stake.
Bill K.

14788) Bill K.

Friday, 5 August 2016 03:01 AM

Continuing my last post if the villain is just raping her unless you're kidnapping her too, there's less need to bind her then actually torturing her.
In most true rapes I read about the rapist overpowers them at knife point and rapes them without the need to tie them up.

Then again sometimes the rapist tying them up adds the eroticism of the act.
I for one fit that rape fantasy to tie her up her up before raping her.

Bill K.

14789) Matt

Friday, 5 August 2016 03:36 AM

JD: nice work on your most recent fake! Someone accused of (insert favorite offense: witchcraft, state treason, insulting the king, whatever) is having a very painful day.

Any additional Star Wars or Stargate fakes? Have you tried other franchises, like V, Firefly, Babylon 5, or (ugh) Star Trek? Klingons, Romulans, Cardissans, etc. have no problems torturing those who have secrets to share.

14790) lionrobe

Friday, 5 August 2016 05:01 AM EMAIL

14791) Jav Critic

Friday, 5 August 2016 05:10 AM

TMS-36 Giant Heroine Sigma Lady (2011) Review:

Giant Heroine Sigma Lady stars ‘Yu Kawakami’ as Kamishiro: the only female member of the Earth’s Defense Force, who is in fact Sigma Lady, a superheroine who has come from outer space to protect the peace of the world. One day she visits Cosmo Tower which is in the direct path of the monsters invading Tokyo，a huge 620 meter-high tower, equipped with a device to launch an electromagnetic net on any incoming intruders to Metropolis. Meanwhile the Mikarus (an evil alien organization) decide to attack the city from the inside by kidnapping Kamishiro and cloning her, now Sigma Lady's clone is destroying the city and she has to tackle her worst enemy: Herself.

And the first thing I liked about this film (as you can tell from the convoluted intro) is how plot-driven it starts out. To the extend of possibly boring some heroine-film-fans, but for me it was a blast to see a film so driven by dialogue and genuine science-fiction (without showing a lot of it for a while too).

Another thing I really loved about this film is the direction. Giving even more respectability to these opening dialogue scenes with simple, yet professional shots and scene-composition that gets you drawn in even more to the events, and for what's to come.

The special effects are also great and the direction seamlessly transitions from the miniature work to the real-life shots, but also mixes the great practical effects (Creatures, Cities) with the CGI effects too. Making everything feel incredibly fluid and not distractingly out of place at all.

And the creature fights themselves are very well done, and are supported by great choreography and fantastic sound design that mixed with the already solid direction makes you feel every hit each opponent takes.

And as the direction does become more provocative, It is still very modest and respectable, yet just as powerful as more overt direction. In the spellbinding first scene the director is able to get so many creative and magnificent angles without ever feeling flashy, and only adding to the scenes already claustrophobic feel.

The costumes are great as usual, while the creatures are OK. Sigma Lady’s costumes are fantastic, the first one being her earth costume which is a white-and-black leather and spandex catsuit that compliments Yu’s body well enough, but isn't as shiny or as skin-tight as her battle costume which is a silver, white and red catsuit that absolutely clings to Yu’s already ample body, and is just a marvel to look at throughout.

I guess one problem I had with the first fight scene is how obligatory it was, really serving no purpose other than to fill time. One could argue that the giant battle was to weaken her to then grow small again and knocked out by one of the Mikarus, but it just seems like he would've done it anyway.

But one thing I really like about the second fight scene is how even though the actresses are both wearing the exact same costume, we can still differentiate between the good Sigma Lady and the bad one. Which all relies on the performances of the actresses, and their little mannerisms & ticks that show who’s good and who’s bad, but another factor that helps this is again the direction that with the simple low-angle and high-angle motif shows this very expertly.

The electricity-net moment is ingenious, although small (and the last of my positives), it is set up a lot earlier in the film, and is paid off perfectly, plus just seeing our heroine wrapped up in those nets, helpless as they electrocute her senselessly before being beaten is beyond titillating.

And now for the negatives, the main one being the voice acting (or shall I say voice inflections). During the fights it grows very tiresome after a while. Repeating the same couple loops of grunts over-and-over it almost amplifies the already tedious at times fights, which otherwise are good in their own rights.

Sadly the end scene was my last tether with the film. Being very painstaking and overly drawn-out, it has maybe only three or four shot changes throughout this ten-minute sequence, and feels like watching paint dry at the best of times. Another problem I have with this scene is that a prosthetic is used instead of the real thing, which is strange because there was an unsimulated scene earlier, and that worked out great, but this makes the scene feel completely awkward and forced.

Another problem I have with the film is that it relies too heavily on the monster fights. To the point that I'm sitting here writing a review, and have no clue what to say about the performances and writing because they're basically non-existent as they're given no screen time whatsoever, or at least not enough for me to comment on them.

So in the end while this review was sounding very positive at first, with the film's very understated and subtly erotic direction, great special and practical effects plus some outstanding costume design, the film started to pummel my attention-span during the halfway mark with endless, passionless scenes to the point that the subtle direction that I once admired became the films biggest detriment because nothing happens. So with that being said I cannot recommend this film.

C-

Buy It Here:

[www.akiba]

Friday, 5 August 2016 06:47 AM

Rarely is an erotic movie made now days with such a good story and dialogues and full of twisted plots.

SLAVE TEARS OF ROME

Julia is the ultimate evil stepmother, beautiful and devious. She dupes her noble born step daughter Nora into a journey that ends with her being taken from her home and sold to Julia's beautiful cousin Anthea. Nora finds her privileged life of nobility over as she wakes up to the nightmare of slave tears of Rome.

clip [boundheat.com]

14793) T

Friday, 5 August 2016 09:54 AM EMAIL

"So I'm wondering, if you're not gonna rape her, what is your motivation for tying her up in the first place?" -Ralphus

(Personal Disclaimer: Each to his/her own realm of fantasy. No offense intended. Etc. Blah, blah, blah...)

See, the thing with the poll is it specifically used the word "rape."

For me at least, rape is not y. It's a violent act with a clear victim and perpetrator. It's not particularly creative, clever, or even remotely entertaining. If anything, it represents a personal failing on the part of the rapist, with the implication that he cannot otherwise acquire the he feels he needs without the use of force.

Now, I know that we're all different and this site is dedicated to pure fiction. But let me tell you a real rape story; one of several I've witnessed firsthand...

A woman is living alone in a ground floor apartment. Man cuts the power to her apartment block. He knocks on her door, claiming to be the landlord (or something), and then forces his way in when she answers.

She cries for help, he punches her in the face, knocks her teeth out, pulls her shirt up over her head and puts a knife to her throat.

He then has most pathetic, shortest and most miserable I've ever heard of with a nearly unconscious victim before dragging her to the bathtub to try and wash away the DNA. He leaves her there in a tub of water and tells her that if she calls the cops he'll kill her.

She calls the cops, they take her to the hospital.

A few weeks later, this person breaks in through a window and does it again. By now, she's saved up enough to move, so she does.

A few weeks later, a new woman has moved in.

He breaks into the apartment (again) with the intent to do the same thing as before. The difference being that this woman screams and bites and fights harder because she's much younger. He bites her back, and this time the police are able to trace his dental pattern on her skin, and also what he leaves in DNA because he had to run away without forcing her to wash it off because she's injured him.

Turns out, he was a family man (middle aged, overweight, balding) living in an apartment across the parking lot from the victims. It was an attack of opportunity, and he tried to lie his ass off when this went to trial.

He's currently serving one of the longest sentences ever handed out in my State, and I had a hand in putting him there.

This was only one of many examples of similar events I've had to deal with in my job/personal life.

So, on a psychological level, I simply cannot differentiate "rape" from the ish typically depicted in movies and things. There's such a schism between fact and fiction on this that I cannot reconcile it.

In my own personal life, yes, there's quite a bit of kink; but the ual aspect of it has always been consensual. I've never felt the want or need to force on any woman, and seeing the patterns of rape so often has left me very deadened to whatever cheap thrill entices the rapists to it.

I'm sorry to say this and ruin anyone's fantasy, but you probably have an unrealistic vision of what you think rape is. And, while I can tolerate its depiction in a fictional movie or something, it simply does not appeal to me in the slightest.

Now, why I love watching gorgeous women being tied up/tortured/punished/executed/etc, but I can't stand rape scenes?

I assure you, I don't know. Here's a video of a Girl whipping herself for real, which I do enjoy:

[embedded content]

Friday, 5 August 2016 11:23 AM EMAIL

Ralphus asked: "So I'm wondering, if you're not gonna rape her, what is your motivation for tying her up in the first place?"

Oh wait! I know the answer to this one! It's so she can't fight back while you slit her throat/cut her head off!!

Or... is that just me...?

Friday, 5 August 2016 11:30 AM EMAIL

'Morning everyone! New Bunny Bondage/Torture art today, hot off the high heels of yesterday's new post!

As any website for fans goes, sometimes you need a little boost..This is why I've started a Patreon campaign page...

Without getting into boring details, helping keep the newest Bunny Bound adventure going will take a bit of work...

What I plan to do on the site is have story lines that YOU make choices on!

Yup, you get to dictate what happens to Bunny's flesh, bone and brain! The content will be exclusive to those pitching in as little as $1...It will all be created IN ADDITION to the stuff going on the regular Bunny Bound site!

Anyway, I hope that at least some of you are game, as I'd really like to do Bunny full time just for US!

'Hate the whole 'sales pitch' thing, but honestly, the Bunny Bound site, graphic novels and all of the illustrated material is done out of passion with the hopes that enough individuals like us can make it succeed!

There's no telling where it can go with your support!

Really want to thank you guys for whatever for your support takes! Thanks!

14796) Covers the Relentless

Friday, 5 August 2016 12:26 PM

Today's MAM cover is from New Man Aug 1968.

--------------------

14778) JD wrote: I'd like to know the take on the issue from someone our Relentless Knight of Unlimited Covers. big grin Those are the people I pay attention to. Producers, not consumers.

In truth, I have not been paying much attention to the GIMP board's latest political argument. I got somewhat busier a few months ago. Most mornings I just stop by to check out Ralphus' daily posting, post my daily cover, and do a quick search to make sure nobody is calling me out of my cave. I keep an eye out for the latest manip by JD or artwork from Arcas, but then I'm on my way to the next thing.

But since you asked, my opinion is that the Republican party has been completely taken over by crazy right-wing religious zealots who will do anything in their power to repress everyone's freedom in public and then they go home and molest their children. They'd shut down this board an instant after they amended that pesky Constitution. Donald Trump is a lifelong sociopath living in a fantasy world where he is the Pharoh. I suspect that he is currently suffering from early-stage dementia, not unlike Reagan.

By way of context, within the last ten years I have been a registered Independent, registered Republican, and (currently) registered Democrat.

The Democratic party is thoroughly captured by their corporate donors and political correctness. I am pissed off at the Democratic Party for rigging the primaries against Bernie Sanders. They are less of a threat to the GIMP because they don't much care about in general, but I can see them being worked up about abuse of women. Hillary is a political hack who is mostly interested in keeping her corporate overlords happy, but she at least pays lip service to freedom and taking care of the little people. The Democrats are usually willing to accept scientific research in preferance to just making shit up.

The Libertarian party is based on a childishly simplistic view of the world. I viewed myself as a Libertarian in my early 20's, but observation of the world taught me that their principles did not take the reality of human nature into account.

This election cycle, I going to be voting based on one issue, and that is climate change. None of the other stuff everyone is talking about is an immediate and serious threat to our technological civilization. If I want the GIMP, I've gotta have the Internet. If I want the Internet, I've gotta have a technological civilization. The Democratic party is the only one that appears to have a (small) chance of averting the worst of the catastrophes currently looming.

tldr: Argue about politics all you want. I already know how I'm going to vote and it's completely dictated by which party believes in science.

14797) Bill K.

Friday, 5 August 2016 02:42 PM

Rape at the GIMP is a much more complex issue that the poll brought out so maybe we should debate that and forget politics.

Clinton's going to win anyways and rape is a much more interesting topic.
Bill K.

14798) JD

Friday, 5 August 2016 03:14 PM EMAIL

Something to keep the ball rolling.

T said: Now, why I love watching gorgeous women being tied up/tortured/punished/executed/etc, but I can't stand rape scenes?

Excellent points Sir and I wholeheartedly agree (your argumentation was a lot better than mine for the same conclusion).

Dick Napalm said: Anyway, I hope that at least some of you are game, as I'd really like to do Bunny full time just for US!

Dick, don't want to sound too pesimistic but I doubt you can make a living exclusively this way. I mean you're talented and a top notch drawing artist but our community is small, the number of people into drawings is even smaller (I'm one of those fumetto lovers) and the number of people from the rich part of the world, capable to support financially your ambitious project is almost neglijable. I doubt there are many producers in this field (of kinky stuff) that live off their passion. I'd be curious if there's anyone actually without a daytime job, maybe pd in the haydays of In. Most of the producers of BDSM stuff have another source of income. I might be wrong, though.

Covers the Relentless said: Argue about politics all you want. I already know how I'm going to vote and it's completely dictated by which party believes in science.

Excellent reading, thanks. Every informed, rational argument I listen to (regarding the existance of perv sites, in this case) makes my position better anchored in reality. Thanks again.

lionrobe said (14790) JD your fakes are stunning...

Merci, merci.

Matt said Any additional Star Wars or Stargate fakes? Have you tried other franchises, like V, Firefly, Babylon 5, or (ugh) Star Trek?

Yeah, some ... let me see what I can find ... it takes a bit of effort to figure out if I posted this one or that one ... I'm getting senior moments too early, dammit ... gotta ease off the bottle, I s'posse.

Friday, 5 August 2016 03:37 PM EMAIL

JD wrote : Dick, don't want to sound too pesimistic but I doubt you can make a living exclusively this way. I mean you're talented and a top notch drawing artist but our community is small, the number of people into drawings is even smaller (I'm one of those fumetto lovers) and the number of people from the rich part of the world, capable to support financially your ambitious project is almost neglijable. I doubt there are many producers in this field (of kinky stuff) that live off their passion. I'd be curious if there's anyone actually without a daytime job, maybe pd in the haydays of In. Most of the producers of BDSM stuff have another source of income. I might be wrong, though.

Oh goodness! No, sorry, I certainly did not suggest that I could make a LIVING off of my art...especially not THIS art! LOL! I just meant my 'full time' ART side of my life!

I do other artistic projects and stuff too, but I'd gladly work the Bunny Bound stuff exclusively if enough people on the planet helped support it...

I'm not quite certain enough individuals even here would care enough to offer support, but I HAD to at least ask...

In any case, I will be updating the Bunny Bound site every week, and I hope that a small % would at the very least pick up a download of the 80 page graphic novel for like, under $10 bucks!

Thanks everyone and thank you JD for taking the time to at least discuss the material!

Friday, 5 August 2016 07:31 PM

boccaccio - glad you like the films we have many more in the pipeline.

And back to Hitllary, I guess that everyone has their price and AIP obviously has theirs. The Clinton Slush fund Foundation's 80% claims don't even match their own tax records (which they now are resubmitting from 2011 onwards) and anyway, isn't Philanthropy when you give you own money to charity - not the Saudis? Quote:

"The Clinton family’s mega-charity took in more than $140 million in grants and pledges in 2013 but spent just $9 million on direct aid".

It really worries me how many Gimpers seem to be pro Hillary. I would love to know their news sources.

And as for keeping politics out of , remember "You may not be interested in politics - but politics is interested in you"

14801) T

Friday, 5 August 2016 08:00 PM EMAIL

Hey, everyone!

Just wondering what your thoughts are on abortion, the existence of God, whether or not the Holocaust happened and what you all think of the new Ghostbusters movie?

Off Topic: Can anyone tell me what this girl-in the-stocks scene is from? Looks European.

14802) Bill K.

Friday, 5 August 2016 08:50 PM

Roman said "It really worries me how many Gimpers seem to be pro Hillary. I would love to know their news sources."

My source is Trump's own words and actions.

He is a racist and a bigot because he said so many times over and he's proud of it.

He a crook because cheated his business partners out of millions in his hotel buildings deals and brags he's a smart businessman and wants to run the country the same as his business.

He support Vladimir Putin and thinks he's a great leader.

He insults Vietnam veterans and other USA war veterans constantly.

The women he doesn't like are all Pigs.

He is clueless about just everything going in the world for the past 10 years.

Which one of these Trump qualities do you like, Roman?

I would not trust Trump to protect the 1st amendment or any of the amendments.

Bill K.

14803) Fritz

Saturday, 6 August 2016 01:06 AM

Bill K.: And so, the enemy of my enemy is my friend? I'm not sure that's always the best strategy. As has been mentioned, there are other alternatives.

14804) DT

Saturday, 6 August 2016 01:07 AM

Hi there,

My first post in here.. well, technically it's the 3rd.

Anyone knows which site I got this from? It's way back but I love the short descriptions that leaves alot of room for imagination

Thanks,
DT

14805) Bill K.

Saturday, 6 August 2016 01:40 AM

Fritz and Gimpers I should added at the end of my last post I trust Clinton to protect the 1st amendment as all Democrats Presidents have done in the past and the future.
So what if she's dishonest which I have no doubt she is but to the degree Trump is dishonest she's Mother Teresa compared to Trump.
Bill K.

14806) Nutzoid

Saturday, 6 August 2016 03:41 AM EMAIL

Here is a nice image by Paul Poser, in the "Naked Target" theme as recently posted by Ralphus. Is there a name for this genre?

Tech Question: Can you upload more than one image file in a post?

14807) frog

Saturday, 6 August 2016 09:49 AM

There is only one solution to the political discussion. Vote for whomever your informed opinion thinks will preserve the freedom to fantasize, watch, read or whatever (except for places where real harm or exploit children), if not the discussion will go on forever, until "they" close us all down.

Although there seems to be a trend towards small or large projectiles being shot at GIMPS, I deviate somewhat and attach a psycho GIMP scene.

14808) Covers the Relentless

Saturday, 6 August 2016 11:12 AM

Today's MAM cover is from New Man Aug 1971.

-----------------------------

14798) JD wrote: Excellent reading, thanks. Every informed, rational argument I listen to (regarding the existence of perv sites, in this case) makes my position better anchored in reality. Thanks again.

JD, I'm glad you enjoyed my little rant. I'm sure that some of the other folks in this group considered it neither informed nor rational, but that's politics.

I do have a request for you. When you post one of your excellent manips, could you please mention which TV show/movie character is being depicted? When I save an image, I like have it properly identified, and I'm terrible at remembering character names.

14809) frog

Saturday, 6 August 2016 12:26 PM

Osouk, on May 2014 you posted a gif animation of a women being violated. She was on a filthy mattress and her hands were tied by barbed wire. Where is that riveting image from?

14810) Arcas

Saturday, 6 August 2016 12:53 PM

Roman Nowicki wrote:"It really worries me how many Gimpers seem to be pro Hillary. I would love to know their news sources."

No you wouldn't. You start by calling her "Hitllary" which shows you have an extreme bias to begin with. I doubt any news report would change your mind... and if we took the time to give you the info, you'd probably write it all off since the news didn't come from one of your preferred sources.

I'm happy to talk with folks about sources and facts if it makes a difference, but you've already decided she's "Hitllary" so my time would surely be wasted. Not trying to be mean, just realistic. It sounds like no amount of verifiable news sources could get you to change your vote... so go for it and we'll see ya at the polls in Nov.

P.S. I really didn't want to get into the political discussion. It's not why I come here... and I'll do my best to get back on topic ASAP

14811) mr bush

Saturday, 6 August 2016 12:59 PM

Hillary
with all the political talk, did anyone notice in pictures that Hillary has full thick eyebrows. I bet this equates to a hairy bush below.

14812) Ed

Saturday, 6 August 2016 01:58 PM

Something even sillier than American politics that still relates to Gimps.

Voila.

14813) Roman Nowicki

Saturday, 6 August 2016 02:54 PM EMAIL

Arcas. The reason I call her Hitlery is not out of bias - its out of knowledge from many, many, many sources. The evidence against her and her impeached, philandering Husband are piled high for all who want to see.

Hillary is speaking to 100s, while Trump is speaking to 1000s. The whole thing is a rigged charade by the Elite. Every area of the main stream media is attacking Trump full on (except maybe Fox). All news outlets, all Hollywoods stars, every comedy chat show.

But why don't you start by telling me one good thing Hillary has done in her whole political career?

This is not the place for political debate but all my comments are responses.

14814) Arcas

Saturday, 6 August 2016 03:53 PM

Roman Nowicki wrote: "But why don't you start by telling me one good thing Hillary has done in her whole political career?"

I'd be hard pressed to tell you of an exceptional achievement of almost anyone who's run for president this election cycle. I started as a Sanders supporter and while I support his perspective and goals, I couldn't tell you a defining political achievement for him, either. In some respects it the nature of the job (in the Senate) he's held. In the Senate your biggest achievements are usually introducing and/or supporting legislation, as well as working for the needs (collectively and individually) of your constituents.

Back to Hillary, she's held the job of Senator and Secretary of State, as well as the "position" (I'm not sure it should be called a "job") of First Lady. In those roles she's accomplished a lot and handled the jobs well (with notable glitches like preferring a personal email server and the biggest minus for me, voting to give Bush authorization to use his obviously poor judgement about whether or not to go to war in Iraq). But few of her accomplishments stand out as "headlines". Doing those jobs well is often a matter of behind the scenes dedication and fairly quiet, incremental victories.

But assuming you're still interested in an answer to the question of her accomplishments in the political arena, I can point you to these two articles for a start. If you need more, I'm sure you're as savvy with Google as I am.

What Is Hillary's Greatest Accomplishment? (Politico)

Hillary Clinton's Accomplishments Speak for Themselves (US News & World Report)

Again, Hillary was not my first choice, but I do feel she's a very capable and intelligent actor on the political stage, and I largely support the platform she's representing. The fact she's running against someone who's so blatantly unqualified, harmfully narcissistic, and recklessly dangerous as Trump adds weight to my choice to support her in the current cycle. Plus the GOP platform this go-round is a new low in awful policy objectives.

14815) Roman

Saturday, 6 August 2016 05:12 PM EMAIL

The U.S. News is owned by Mortimer Benjamin "Mort" Zuckerman (Need I say more?!) and Politico?!?! Hadas Gold (Ditto!) was exposed for tweeting: "Hey HRC, do a presser. Take questions. Please. Sure - we’ll ask about your emails. but we’ll ask about Trump/Russia".

This is not objective journalism this is Orwellian level propaganda.

(IMO) I think Sander's defining Political Achievment was telling all his supporters to vote Hillary before LEAVING the Democrat Party with a nice bundle of unspent funds.

Saturday, 6 August 2016 05:54 PM

@DT-My guess is the pic comes from actiongirls.com (had 1-2 great GIMP/AOH clips ~8 years ago now it's just cheesecake). I think the text was added elsewhere though.

In other news, as you may have heard, Margot Robbie had a short but not-great GIMP scene. She was not in the below costume unfortunately but baggy prison clothes strapped to a chair, gagged, and injected with something. Maybe AOH or other GIMPage in another movie.

14817) T

Saturday, 6 August 2016 06:24 PM EMAIL

Finally, a post I can get behind.

Margot is just about as perfect a Harley Quinn that one could ask for.

I do wish her voice was a bit more obnoxious though (like the original cartoon Harley), but I'm not complaining.

At the very least, her presence opens the door for GIMP-tastical possibilities...

Imagine a Harley vs Catwoman vs Wonder Woman movie, if they'd just cut with the pretense and give us what we want.

Reminds me of this moment from Arkham City: [youtu.be] (About half-way in)

The Joker leaves Harley tied up and gagged with duct tape for failing yet again to deal with Batman, and I love how they let the player continually rip the gag off and on when she pouts.

Somebody knew what they were doing.

Saturday, 6 August 2016 06:45 PM EMAIL

I know that this 'political talk' will keep going on for a while...there's really no avoiding it...I'm going to make it personal and have just finished a BRUTAL Bunny vs. 'Trumph' piece that I will be posting to the Bunny Bound site soon!

He said that he will be bringing waterboarding back, plus much worse...well you're all about to see how much worse, and so will BUNNY! :)

Political GIMP cartoons ladies and gents!

14819) Ralphus

Saturday, 6 August 2016 09:40 PM EMAIL

Roman Nowicki wrote:

This is not the place for political debate but all my comments are responses.

Responding to an off-topic thread doesn't make it any less off-topic.

That's it, guys. I'm shutting this discussion down right now. No more political talk unless you find a way to get back to the theme of the board. I've been working long hours and haven't been around to read the forum for the past day and a half. And I see the political talk has continued unabated in my absense. That's gonna stop now. There's all kinds of subjects we could be talking about instead. Here's a little inspiration:

14820) Bill K.

Sunday, 7 August 2016 12:35 AM

Sound great to me Ralphus no more political talk from me.

How about Margot as Harley Quinn is good start. She got beat up and tortured in several scenes. I loved it. She loves to be tortured for sure. Bill K.

14821) Ralphus

Sunday, 7 August 2016 12:51 AM EMAIL

Catching up on a few recent posts...

Jav Critic: Am I really the first person to thank you for your most recent review? Another Giga movie with superheroine costumes and no nudity this time...not my favorite genre. Still, I looked at the trailer for the buy page you linked and it looked like a fun movie, sort of reminded me of those Japanese Ultraman shows I used to watch on TV when I was a kid.

Here's the page for your latest review: http://ralphus.net/reviews/japan/jap_gigatms36.htm

-----------------------------------

T: Thanks for sharing that story with us. Are you an attorney or a member of law enforcement? Just curious, since you said you played a part in putting that rapist away.

As far as real rape versus fantasy rape, well of course there's a difference. Anyone who would hurt or violate a woman in real life is a scumbag who should be punished and put in jail. But you could say that about anyone who commits a real-life crime. I don't think you'll find too many people who think that murder is a positive thing, and yet there are thousands of movies, videos and TV shows that feature women being shot, stabbed, hung, strangled, etc. So why do you think that is? Maybe because watching women get killed is entertaining to a percentage of the population. Same thing with rape scenes. I totally disagree that rape scenes are not entertaining, although I also see how one's personal experiences may play a role in their not enjoying them.

That's the fucked up thing about this fetish. The material that turns us on is often the exact same stuff that would cause a "normal" person to be shocked and repulsed. Or maybe we're the normal ones and they just don't get it.

-----------------------------------

Nutzoid wrote:

Here is a nice image by Paul Poser, in the "Naked Target" theme as recently posted by Ralphus. Is there a name for this genre?

Good artwork, thanks. I don't know if there's a name for the genre. I have a whole folder of similar images that I just call "Target Practice". I particularly like the idea of using women as targets for knife throwers...I never saw the actual episode, but they would always do a little teaser in the opening credits of Charlie's Angels with Cheryl Ladd in that role...remember?

Tech Question: Can you upload more than one image file in a post?

Yeah, you just need a site to host your pics and a basic knowledge of HTML. E-mail me if you need any help.

-----------------------------------

Frog wrote:

Osouk, on May 2014 you posted a gif animation of a women being violated. She was on a filthy mattress and her hands were tied by barbed wire. Where is that riveting image from?

I asked about that very image here on the board and of course, Mr. GIMP Trivia Expert himself, aka MrAnthony, knew the answer.

http://ralphus.net/thegimpforum/index.php?permalink=true&entry=10325

-----------------------------------

Margot Robbie in bondage: Margot Robbie might be the most beautiful actress working in Hollywood today. Which means she should be tied up in a minimum of half her movies. At the very least. If I were her agent I'd insist on it every time. On YouTube some kind soul did a nice edit for us of her duct tape gag scene in the movie Focus. She looks awfully good that way.

[embedded content]

14822) Nutzoid

Sunday, 7 August 2016 05:10 AM

Here are 3 more naked target images.
I am not sure who the artists are (maybe the 2nd is by Crinkley)

14823) Michael Max

Sunday, 7 August 2016 07:11 AM

I suppose that a more constructive discussion is needed to replace the pesky political talk that can be indulged in 27 billion other places on the web.

One topic, very dear to my heart, is about a phenomenon that I have yet to find in any mainstream or commercial movie. A perfect wrist suspension bondage scene. It's probably worth noting down the characteristics of such a scene to contrast my expectation of it to that of other people. I know there are a few fans of wrist suspensions around and hopefully a few more converts will soon emerge.

A perfect wrist suspension bondage scene should possess the following characteristics:

1. A good build-up and backstory. For example, the victim (a pretty female, of course) is innocently accused of witchcraft and brought before the inquisition.

2. The anticipation prior to the actual event. The victim should know what awaits her and should be shown anxiously awaiting her fate to come to pass. This type of anticipation is well displayed in Braveheart, prior to Wallace's execution by the English, but of course the gender of the victim is all wrong. An analogical scene with a female delinquent would have been quite epic.

3. The lead up. A victim should be led to the place of her punishment, preferably in some form of bondage, perhaps wrists tied behind back, and further humiliated by being publicly stripped after arriving at the gallows.

4. The pacing. It's best if the scene is slow, deliberate, and ponderous, building up the mood slowly and inexorably. None of the retarded Hollywood jump cuts or shaky cam shenanigans worthy of first year film school rejects.

5. The hanging. This should continue with the tense pathos and really zero in on the elements of the scene that emphasize it. The girl, having her wrists tied is pulled up slowly, until her feet leave the ground. That's the basic premise, but there is a lot to capture here. First of all her fear just prior to experiencing the first moment of pain, the rope or chain that will bear the weight of her body growing taut, the moment when her outstretched toes can no longer touch the ground, and making her situation permanent by tying off the rope/chain.

6. Suffering. Avoid the notorious urge of film-makers to have a male run up to the hanging victim and grope and obstruct her from the camera for the rest of the scene. Linger on her experience of being hung with the growing strain of her position and utter inability to get any relief.

7. Avoid damaging her body too much via an excessive torture regimen. An eventual light whipping or something of that sort is fine, but do not destroy the poor damsel's beauty. She is a highly valuable and reusable commodity so that is simply a huge waste. All too often dumb movie villains make the mistake of prematurely damaging a GIMP who could endure long term and lasting service.

8. Having fulfilled the above criteria, enjoy your place in movie history until the end of times.

I think that the outlined scenario is quite close to perfect (subjectively speaking of course). There are some scenes that come somewhat close to this ideal, but none that really capture most of the essence. Which ones would the fellas here consider the best in that respect?

14824) zeke

Sunday, 7 August 2016 07:55 AM EMAIL

We are interested in you political persuasions, my dear, so just keep talking and talking and talking...

14825) SyzygyUK

Sunday, 7 August 2016 08:30 AM

Glad to get such a clear exposition of how a good suspension (or indeed any torture scene) could be built up to the actual torture itself. In fact the Inquisition used a sequence similar to that described by your correspondent.

1. questioning

2. threat of torture

3. taking into the torture room and shown the instruments

4. undressing and tying/binding into the instrument or frame

5. if no confession had been reached by this stage, the torture would then commence, slowly/gently and then more vigorously until a confession was obtained.

The torture itself could be suspended if the victim was rendered unconscious to be resumed when they could speak.

Two mainstream pictures come to mind which have a huge cut from discovery to torture being applied

1. Sinful Nuns of St. Valentine, where the victim is discovered fully clothed in bed which then cuts immediately to her half-naked body in the strappado equipment.

2. Love Letters from a Portuguese Nun, where the victim is being questioned and then the film cuts to her naked body being stretched on the rack.

No doubt there are limits for mainstreams as to the amount of time that a torture scene can last, but the build up can be just as chilling surely?
SyzygyUK

14826) JD

Sunday, 7 August 2016 09:53 AM EMAIL

Michael Max said I think that the outlined scenario is quite close to perfect (subjectively speaking of course).

There's only one problem with that scenario. The victim would die in half an hour due to the respiratory failure. The muscular system in the thoracic cavity is not built for that kind of stress, even less for a woman. That's why, the Romans were nailing the legs as well, to insure extra (painful) support. When they intended to shorten the sufferance of the condemned, they would crush the legs, thus eliminating the support and providing a merciful death.

Ralphus said: That's it, guys. I'm shutting this discussion down right now.
What? What about the Elizabeth Warren fight with Wall Street? Or the shenanigans of Karl Rowe? Even the dubious contributions are off topic? Life can be so cruel.

@Dick Napalm: Great image, love it. Still can't believe what an accomplished artist you are.

mr bush said Hillary
with all the political talk, did anyone notice in pictures that Hillary has full thick eyebrows. I bet this equates to a hairy bush below.

Some things are too disgusting even for a hardened crowd of pervs like us. I'm trying to erase the mental image you conjured.

Covers the Relentless said When you post one of your excellent manips, could you please mention which TV show/movie character is being depicted?

Most of the time they are not from a fixed environment. More like a mashup of elements. If you want to save them best to make a folder called JD'S BRAINFARTS. That would provide all the context required. :)

T said Just wondering what your thoughts are on abortion, the existence of God, whether or not the Holocaust happened and what you all think of the new Ghostbusters movie?

Glad you asked. Abortion is fine, we are too many anyway. God was a useful construct in early history but lost relevance in the modern world. Holocaust happened. The new Ballbusters is a shameless pandering to the SJW crowd and the rad fems.

Finally, some new files on the MAINSTREAM BONDAGE/GIMP on [www.zippyshare.com]

Make sure you check the Sara Malakul Lane file, from the "12/12/12" movie. She's the most stunning beauty I've seen recently.

14827) Stubborn Goose

Sunday, 7 August 2016 10:49 AM EMAIL

Pedro, time ago a question is consuming my mind: What happened to Katja Vitti (aka Monica)? Is she still into been savage whipped?

14828) Covers the Relentless

Sunday, 7 August 2016 02:29 PM

Today's MAM scan is from New Man Aug 1971.

----------------------

14816) MAV wrote: In other news, as you may have heard, Margot Robbie had a short but not-great GIMP scene. She was not in the below costume unfortunately but baggy prison clothes strapped to a chair, gagged, and injected with something. Maybe AOH or other GIMPage in another movie.

14821) Ralphus wrote: Margot Robbie in bondage: Margot Robbie might be the most beautiful actress working in Hollywood today. Which means she should be tied up in a minimum of half her movies. At the very least. If I were her agent I'd insist on it every time. On YouTube some kind soul did a nice edit for us of her duct tape gag scene in the movie Focus. She looks awfully good that way.

In the past week, I saw Margot Robbie in "The Legend of Tarzan" and "Suicide Squad". In Tarzan, she plays Jane captured by the villain and handcuffed to the railing of a riverboat for a good part of the movie. In Suicide Squad, as Dr Harleen Quinzel, she is strapped to a gurney and given electroshock therapy by the Joker (very short scene). As Harley Quinn (not in the Harley costume), we see her in a special prison cage, shocked into unconsciousness, strapped to rolling gurney wearing a no-bite mask over the bottom of her face and then injected in the neck with a remote controlled micro-bomb. I think Margot's on her way to becoming a GIMP board MVP.

---------------------------

14826) JD wrote:
Covers the Relentless said When you post one of your excellent manips, could you please mention which TV show/movie character is being depicted? Most of the time they are not from a fixed environment. More like a mashup of elements. If you want to save them best to make a folder called JD'S BRAINFARTS. That would provide all the context required. :)

JD, it really doesn't surprise me that you and I agree on so much, but how did you know how I've been labeling your manips?

14829) JD

Sunday, 7 August 2016 03:36 PM EMAIL

Something to keep the ball running.

Covers the Relentless said JD, it really doesn't surprise me that you and I agree on so much, but how did you know how I've been labeling your manips? wink

Aye, it was either this or "THE MOST AMAZING SHIT I FOUND TODAY ONLINE" but I thought I better keep it real.

14830) Jma

Sunday, 7 August 2016 03:38 PM EMAIL

I like BDSM

Sunday, 7 August 2016 06:44 PM

Thanks for that, it definitely does remind me a lot of those old Ultraman episodes, as well as a little bit of Power Rangers. Actually a lot of ''Giant Heroine GIGA'' revolves around ''Rangers'', and is heavily inspired by it, but they just don't use the full title to avoid copyright
[www.akiba]
[www.akiba]
[www.akiba]

Sunday, 7 August 2016 08:08 PM EMAIL

Hey GIMPers! Dick here, letting you know that, starting tomorrow, there will be some great Bunny Bound website updates! It's a Bunny vs. week with art and stories of her being destroyed by many different torturers including a certain unnamed Presidential candidate! Let's just say, he's got the best torture devices money can buy!

Also, thank you JD for the kind words on the art and your review of the Bunny Bound Graphic Novel!

Sunday, 7 August 2016 10:27 PM

Stubborn Goose asked:

Pedro, time ago a question is consuming my mind: What happened to Katja Vitti (aka Monica)? Is she still into been savage whipped?

You're asking about a girl who frequently appeared at us about 10 years ago.

Time goes by my friend. Girls don't get older in the movies but they do in real life. About 10 years passed since her last appearance in our movies. Since then she may have married, have family, children, she may have changed a lot. I don't know...

All girls quit adult filming after a few years. ALWAYS.

Please enjoy the movies she made in the past. I guess this answer won't satisfy you... you expected something different...

14834) Stubborn Goose

Sunday, 7 August 2016 11:12 PM EMAIL

Pedro, first of all thank you for your answer.
Oddly enough, your answer is at the same time complete and satisfying.
Oddly enough, she has provided some kind of hapiness and a lot of completion to my mind.
Sure she deserves the best, as she allowed herself to deep explore one side of this life, and now happily seems to be making the same in the other extreme.
Again, thank you for your answer.

14835) Ralphus

Sunday, 7 August 2016 11:57 PM EMAIL

Michael Max: I think your list is excellent, and I disagree with JD that the victim would die within a half hour due to respiratory failure. I've read of suspension roleplay between partners that went on for several hours. But generally, it is possible that you can incur nerve damage after an hour or two, since wrists are not meant to support the weight of a body. Hate to bring the harshness of reality into your fantasy setting, but suspension CAN be dangerous. I'm no expert, though. Someone like Rick might be better to weigh in on the subject, since he's done wrist suspension multiple times in his movies, and I'm almost positive he's never killed anyone. Yet.

Monday, 8 August 2016 12:50 AM EMAIL

14837) Bill K.

Monday, 8 August 2016 01:45 AM

JD: Samantha Carter of SG1, my pictured poser / manipulation, was a hot gimp but Claudia Black and Morena Baccarin were much hotter to me.

JD, Love to see your manipulation magic on them.
Bill K.

14838) Matt

Monday, 8 August 2016 02:36 AM

JD: Good to see another Stargate fake. Keep 'em coming, please. That show had plenty of GIMP potential, but sadly, it was wasted because Amanda Tapping had a no-nudity clause in her contract when the show was on Showtime.

Monday, 8 August 2016 02:45 AM

Michael Max and all:

I like the latest topic of discussion as it seems to relate to AOH bondage.

While you've all heard me go on and on about why I like AOH bondage, I remember hearing somewhere that in reality the captive's lungs would collapse if they are suspended off the ground by the wrists. When I've seen this happen in movies for short scenes, I think the actresses have been in good shape (Rhona Mitra in Doomsday, Bobbie Phillips in Chameleon 3) since it takes some upper body strength. Otherwise the actress will not be off the ground.

With that said, the most realistic scene I've seen of that Michael Max situation that is not commercial bondage is Rhona Mitra in Doomsday. She is hoisted off the ground, woken up, worked over a bit while being interrogated, and is also shown the other torture instruments. What do you guys think?

14840) Bill K.

Monday, 8 August 2016 03:12 AM

Amanda Tapping had a no-nudity clause in her contract when the show was on Showtime.

Matt, SG1 was strictly on Sci-Fy channel. I don't believe it was on Showtime.

Any actress that never did nude scenes is no problem for a manipulation artist, because they could tell who any actress is just by seeing her naked body and not seeing her face. Even if you've seen them nude 99% of time no you can't. Bill K.

14841) Covers the Relentless

Monday, 8 August 2016 08:10 AM

New Man Aug 1971

14842) T

Monday, 8 August 2016 11:07 AM EMAIL

-----------------------------------

Ralphus: Thanks for sharing that story with us. Are you an attorney or a member of law enforcement?

I work in Emergency Medical Services.

Sometimes we have to appear in court to answer questions and explain things to the jury.

I don't think you'll find too many people who think that murder is a positive thing, and yet there are thousands of movies, videos and TV shows that feature women being shot, stabbed, hung, strangled, etc. So why do you think that is?

Depends on the genre, but aside from the inherent nature of dramatized violence, artists have often utilized the female form to evoke emotional responses from audiences.

It's part of human nature to seek what we're attracted to. Placing that form in mortal danger is one tried and true method of grabbing the viewer's attention.

Some viewers more than others.

I will say that this website does tend to look a tad... Icky.

Not to say that it doesn't offer exactly what it advertises on the front door, but I wouldn't expect to find many women among the clientele here.

It looks like the sort of place where rapists would hang out; if rapists went about in black robes and hoods like movie villains on the way to a human sacrifice.

Perhaps the gallows humor and sheer ridiculousness of much of it is lost on the general public. To the normal sort of peasant, we're what kids grow up to become if they miss too many Sunday School lessons and listen to that Jungle Music too loudly...

Because that's how that works.

-----------------------------------

JD: Abortion is fine, we are too many anyway. God was a useful construct in early history but lost relevance in the modern world. Holocaust happened. The new Ballbusters is a shameless pandering to the SJW crowd and the rad fems.

I am now offended. Allow me to express my disgust with you via heated discourse.

14843) JD

Monday, 8 August 2016 02:35 PM EMAIL

Lacking too much informations about human or betazoid physiology, the Cardassian officer looked into a historical databank and recreated the most fearsome instrument in the ship's holodeck. Now he hopes to extract the Fleet codes from his Federation prisoner.

Ralphus said: I disagree with JD that the victim would die within a half hour due to respiratory failure. I've read of suspension roleplay between partners that went on for several hours.

The number of domains you show ignorance never fails to impress me. There is a good number of books written by serious historians (there are many sensationalist books as well) about torture in Antiquity. I don't recall now if it was in the "Crime and Punishment" serie or Kerrigan's compendium but the asphyxiation when hanging freely from the hands is well documented (mostly in the context of the cross, due to it's symbolistic importance for the Christian cultures). I know, asking people to read books in our day and age is more torture than the subjects of the book itself ...

Bill K. said (14837) JD: Samantha Carter of SG1, my pictured poser / manipulation, was a hot gimp but Claudia Black and Morena Baccarin were much hotter to me. JD, Love to see your manipulation magic on them.

I would gladly oblige except I don't have usable headshots of the aforementioned ladies. I hate with passion the manips that use the smiley IMDB portfolio picture of the character depicted in the dungeon. If she's smiling when someone is poking her with red irons, that's crap. So, in order to start I need a few frames with the aforementioned character in some kind of pain or mild distress. That happens in shows, and if I'm interested, I can look frame by frame to the one promising. But with a show like SG1 it's a Sisyphus' work to parse hundreds of episodes for facial expression I can use for character I don't like that much. So, here's the problem in granting your wish. The lack of materials to work with.

Bill K. said Matt, SG1 was strictly on Sci-Fy channel. I don't believe it was on Showtime.

It was, in the first 5 seasons. If you remember, the first episode included actual nudity (something you can't see ever on Sci-Fy).

T said: I am now offended. Allow me to express my disgust with you via heated discourse.

Sir, I fart in your general direction! Moreso, your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries!

14844) mr bush

Monday, 8 August 2016 03:38 PM

today's zfx suspension video is from which zfx movie?

14845) Bill K.

Monday, 8 August 2016 03:46 PM

JD: I didn't know that SG1 was on Showtime. I had no idea there were two versions of that series. Is there a DVD of those nude scene episodes to rent or buy on the web? Bill K.

Monday, 8 August 2016 04:13 PM EMAIL

14847) Michael Max

Monday, 8 August 2016 05:49 PM

"Ralphus said: I disagree with JD that the victim would die within a half hour due to respiratory failure. I've read of suspension roleplay between partners that went on for several hours."

@JD and Ralphus
Obviously, wrist suspension is an extreme form of play, best not attempted by amateurs. I was talking about an ideal movie scene though - aided by jump cuts, special effects, and camera angles - where perfect medical accuracy need not be adhered to. I doubt that any human being would survive the travails of Hollywood action-movie heroes, yet it doesn't prevent them from being enjoyed by broad audiences.

I don't think there is any precise data on how long a person can survive in a continuous wrist suspension, but I am sure no one in the right mind would want to come close to the limits. Suspension play can still be practiced, it's just that proper safety measures have to be taken.

There are obvious ways of doing it: using comfortable cuffs with proper wrist support, a bar for the "victim's" hands to grab onto and lower the stress on the body, short duration of suspension. My initial list was mostly about a semi-realistic movie fantasy though, and it should be discussed in that context only.

14848) frog

Monday, 8 August 2016 05:50 PM

Here is another take of the psycho butcher of Elm Street. No time to comment today, will do so soon. The GIMP's body is courtesy of Kashara, the face of Teraz Films.

14849) Michael Max

Monday, 8 August 2016 06:04 PM

@MAV
I like the latest topic of discussion as it seems to relate to AOH bondage.

It certainly does. Wrist suspension is the extreme variety of AOH, but classic AOH is also terrific when done right. A couple of classic examples are Judi Bowker in the 80's "Clash of the Titans" (I will love that scene forever), and "Don't Go in the House" where a pretty lady is shamefully wasted after being restrained in a classic, beautiful pose.

Even with movie illusion at work, hanging an actress by her wrists carries a risk that no one will take lightly. It's almost certain that all such scenes were done with explicit consent of the actress involved, which generally implies that she was seen as fit to pull it off.

14850) JD

Monday, 8 August 2016 06:37 PM EMAIL

Bill K. said JD: I didn't know that SG1 was on Showtime. I had no idea there were two versions of that series. Is there a DVD of those nude scene episodes to rent or buy on the web?

Not two version, only one. The show producers weren't happy with the nudity required by the channel executives and moved toward more family friendly territory after the pilot episode aired. Later, when running on SciFy they would just edit the offending nude scene out.

Look for the first episode in season 1, called "Children of the Gods".

Wiki says: The original airing of "Children of the Gods" on Showtime featured full frontal nudity during the scene showing the possession of Sha're (Vaitiare Bandera) by Amonet. While this has never been repeated on network television and subsequent airings have had the nudity cut out for syndication; it was rated R by the MPAA. According to Brad Wright, the Showtime network had insisted on the full frontal nudity despite Wright's vocal opposition; Wright told fan site GateWorld that he would cut the nudity scene from the 2009 direct-to-DVD recut of the pilot episode. The DVD version, in fact, only retains a portion of this scene, with full frontal nudity being cut and a partial syndicate friendly back nudity version used. Likely because of the nudity, the original version of this episode as well as the next two episodes of the series are the first and only ones in the series to be rated by the MPAA (it is rated R), while in the UK the episode is rated 18 by the BBFC (all other episodes have generally been rated PG, or 12, very occasionally 15). It is rated M in Australia, recommended for (but not restricted to) viewers 15 and older.

If you're interested into the nudity part, here's a very low res clip (sorry, don't have time for a lenghtier upload) to get an idea.

[www98.zippyshare.com]

14851) _blu

Monday, 8 August 2016 06:57 PM

Stargate SG-1: Children of the Gods

Comparison:
Original Version
Final Cut (Part 1)
[www.movie]

Comparison:
Original Version
Final Cut (Part 2)
[www.movie]

14852) Ralphus

Monday, 8 August 2016 11:47 PM EMAIL

T wrote:

I will say that this website does tend to look a tad... Icky.

It's all the torture pictures, isn't it? Hey, I'm a guy. Interior decorating isn't exactly my strong suit. Maybe this place needs a woman's touch. I was thinking maybe some nice curtains...

Not to say that it doesn't offer exactly what it advertises on the front door, but I wouldn't expect to find many women among the clientele here.

Ha! You think? When we took a survey earlier this year, it came out we're 92% male. But hey, we did have 7 women participate. That's something, right? And I think Bondage_Barbie_Doll is a female; if so, we're up to 8 now.

Well really, if you were a female, would you want to hang around here? It reminds me a bit of when, years ago, my then-girlfriend wanted to go the adult bookstore downtown with me so we could rent a bondage videotape (we're talking late 1980s here). I didn't force her to go; in fact, I think I tried to talk her out of it, but she wanted to come inside with me. Anyway, she said afterward that she felt extremely uncomfortable, to the point where she couldn't wait for me to just grab the movie so we could leave. She said everybody in the store was looking at her, which was probably true. I don't imagine they got too many female customers there.

I don't know, there's a lot of women who are into bondage, and the rape fantasy is actually quite common for women. What percentage of them are into more extreme treatment like torture is unknown. I think our site is probably too hardcore for most women's tastes.

It looks like the sort of place where rapists would hang out; if rapists went about in black robes and hoods like movie villains on the way to a human sacrifice.

I would hope we don't have any real life rapists here, but I guess that makes sense. The FBI thought we were dangerous enough, apparently based on our content, that they set up a fake slave auction here to entrap our readers into buying their own slave a few years back. From now on, I'm going to have GIMP security check our readers for black robes and hoods before they enter. That ought to do it.

14853) Fritz

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 12:45 AM

For once I'm here when the TT movie shows up… Bell From Hell (1973). You know where to send my prize money.

14854) T

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 12:45 AM EMAIL

For Trivia Tuesday, the movie is A Bell from Hell (1973), featuring Maribel Martin, Christine Betzer and Nuria Gimeno.

I know because I first saw it up on the Torture Rack Scenes database long before this site had appropriated it.

14855) T

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 12:47 AM EMAIL

Curses! Foiled again...

I shouldn't have paused to upload the movie poster. :)

14856) lionrobe

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 01:12 AM EMAIL

14832) Dick Napalm

Hi, you've got a mail on your webssite

Zerosen's well known drawing, but always my favorite.

14857) Ralphus

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 01:13 AM EMAIL

Wow, this one was about as close as it comes...but Fritz pulls it off by literally seconds to steal the Trivia Crown away from Mr. T. Gotta be just a little quicker next time, my friend.

Since we're talking about wrist suspension, this week's movie A Bell From Hell features one of the truly great mainstream scenes of all time. Three naked sisters are hoisted up by their wrists and led along a conveyor belt like cattle to be slaughtered. And not only that, the bad guy in this one is played by Richard Carpenter of the popular singing group The Carpenters! Okay, maybe not, but he's a dead ringer for him.

Another classic from the 1970s, the generation that gave us some of the best GIMP scenes in history. We have plenty of caps and a video link in the Torture Rack Database.

14858) Bill K.

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 01:19 AM

Thanks everyone for the information on nude SG1 and may I ask was "Children of the Gods I and II" the only episodes with nudity?

Five seasons on Showtime were there nude episodes too?

I retired from being on second shift for 25 years in 2004, so I watch every little TV and paid no attention to premium channels like HBO or Showtime until Dexter came into being around 2007 or 2008.

I missed a lot for sure. Never saw a single episode of MacGyver as an example.
Bill K.

14859) T

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 01:33 AM EMAIL

Ralphus: Maybe this place needs a woman's touch. I was thinking maybe some nice curtains...

Another thing I'll add is, it may help to be a tad more appreciative to the main ingredient of any authentic GIMP scene...

That being, the G in GIMP herself.

We do tend to banter back and forth about various forms of rape and dismemberment for hours on end, but I don't often read many comments about what the victims are looking for. I mean, presumably at least, that's their half of the fantasy.

There are of course our Amy Heskeths and Lina Romays who receive a deserved amount of praise for their art, but all too often I read arguments about some trivial grip about GIMP's tattoo being unattractive, or someone possibly being unwilling to do full nudity or something...

Let's be horrible rape-monsters, but let's not forget that there would be none of it without the helpless damsels who make it all possible.

At least before we... you know... suspend them by their wrists to commit unspeakable acts upon their quivering naked bodies. (Or whatever your personal inclinations may lead you.)

Ralphus: I don't know, there's a lot of women who are into bondage, and the rape fantasy is actually quite common for women. What percentage of them are into more extreme treatment like torture is unknown. I think our site is probably too hardcore for most women's tastes.

I'd wager that there are probably quite a few women who occasionally look at this site, but have no desire to participate in discussions, for obvious reasons.

Most women can't even use Facebook without random losers sending hastily shot photos of their junk to her message box.

Now, I know several women who love this stuff (on both sides of the torturer/torturee fantasy too), but the ironic thing is that they've married men who are either unwilling or disgusted with the idea of it.

One of my best friends is a woman whose husband simply will not entertain the notion of kink; and she has asked me for advice in how to convince him to try out even something simple, like handcuffs. So take that for the cruel ironies of life.

(I suggested divorce, since he's clearly a mad man.)

[embedded content]

Ralphus: The FBI thought we were dangerous enough, apparently based on our content, that they set up a fake slave auction here to entrap our readers into buying their own slave a few years back.

No, Ralphus, I don't know where it will be held this year.

14860) Dutches of the Devils (1969)

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 01:44 AM

14861) Bill K.

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 02:08 AM

Regarding post 14859 by T.

I have three real lady web friends that want to burn at the stake at the Stakedamsels forum and two BG and Zorf that want to be raped before and while being bats.

These ladies are not gimp actresses like Amy Hesketh but real ordinary ladies into fiery gimp action.

They do not give their real names of course but unlike us guys have victim fantasies.

Of the 7 or 8 lady Gimpers I'm not sure any of them are masochistic or have gimp fantasies.

What do lady GImpers have to say?
Bill K.

14862) Burngreave

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 07:42 AM EMAIL

Wow JD love the Cardassian torturing Counsellor Troy.....my mind is running riot with how she was captured, how she was stripped, etc. This is one of your best posts but I'd love to see it taken further, maybe applying a mind probe, electrodes, and so on forever and ever!! And then there's Doctor Crusher...............

14863) Thomas Chaser

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 07:49 AM EMAIL

JD wrote: "If you're interested into the nudity part, here's a very low res clip (sorry, don't have time for a lenghtier upload) to get an idea."

I'm interested, and I'm hoping you find time to upload a hi-res version! I believe this scene was included in the DVD, uncut.

14864) Nia

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 08:06 AM EMAIL

I haven't contributed in a long time, but since you're talking about something I know, I thought I'd chime in with my personal experience.

I've been suspended by the wrists many times while playing with my husband and it is very exciting for me... for the first 5 minutes. After that, the pain starts with the hands getting numb and the wrists feeling like they are on fire, even with suspension cuffs. One can hold on with those cuffs but after the blood is cut off, that is of no use.

Then the muscles in the arms, shoulders and chest begin to tire and cramp. The pain can be incredible when you have a cramp that can't be stretched out. But soon after the lactic acid build-up in those muscles cause them to just shut down. Breathing becomes shallow since you cannot lift your weight off of your diaphragm to get a deep breath.

Sweat pours from every gland. I've have it drip like a faucet with a bad washer from my toes. At this point you can feel your skeleton and the joints trying to stay together... the shoulders first and then the elbows. It's at this point that I usually give my safeword.

Maybe 20 minutes is my record time. We are only amateurs playing bondage games, so maybe there is something that more experienced people can do to extend the time.

This is just my personal experience. I'm a very fit and athletic woman, but at 34 now, this is getting harder and harder to recover from. At least a week, sometimes more to get my strength back. My wrists may take a month sometimes.

I hope that helps... no science, but it's what I have to offer.

14865) Sardu

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 08:07 AM

A GIMP classic. "A Bell from Hell".

14866) Covers the Relentless

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 08:13 AM

New Man Dec 1965

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 10:54 AM

14857) Ralphus

Amazing scene remember it well in a cinema in Winnipeg. Those were the days before political correctness...

14868) JD

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 12:36 PM EMAIL

Something to keep the ball running. Lord Rahl's personal collection of enslaved humans.

Thomas Chaser said I'm interested, and I'm hoping you find time to upload a hi-res version! I believe this scene was included in the DVD, uncut.

Not my upload but Hi-Res. [depositfiles.com]

password is sky

@Burngreave: Glad you enjoy it.

14869) Jesuispain

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 02:51 PM

Hey all, thought I'd come out of lurking to post my first peril picture in a while. My OC heroine, Democracy_Dame in a lab. Working on getting up to speed on the software again, but...I figured some of you might enjoy. Larger version might be up a while at [i.imgur.com]

14870) Michael Max

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 03:12 PM

@14864) Nia

Great input - thanks for contributing the info!! I have personally never tried suspension bondage with my girlfriend, although she does like some lighter stuff. I would imagine that anything more than a few minutes is extremely strenuous and probably shouldn't be done if it necessitates many days of recovery.

It's great to hear about a first hand experience though. It's a rarity when it comes to wrist suspension!

14871) Bill K.

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 03:28 PM

Hanging by the cross position is much more painful than AOH.
Crucifixion is a horrible torture slow death, especially if the gimp is nailed to the cross.

Now if you slowly batc as pictured even worst.

I wonder Nia if have you played or tried crucifixion games?

I tried just holding my arm straight out and about a couple minutes was all I could bear.

Gimp actresses: how long could they bear hanging in the cross position compared to AOH I wonder?

More food for thought. Bill K.

14872) lionrobe

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 04:08 PM EMAIL

To Bill K :

THX for the Ford Mustang meeting -:)

14873) Bill K.

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 04:40 PM

lionrobe: Those were three Chevy Corvairs. Not Ford Mustangs. But you're welcome anyways. The Chevy Corvair was only rear engine USA car ever built and it was a pile of crap quality wise.

Women driving one was considered a Gimp because catching fire in a crash safety issue and other safety issues too. Bill K.

14874) Kelderek

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 04:41 PM EMAIL

Here is a newly made render for you all!

When she heard the door open, she realized that the interrogator was back from his coffee break...

14875) Thomas Chaser

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 08:11 PM EMAIL

Thomas Chaser said "I'm interested, and I'm hoping you find time to upload a hi-res version! I believe this scene was included in the DVD, uncut."

JD responded: "Not my upload but Hi-Res. [depositfiles.com] password is sky"

Thanks, man! This is an awesome scene.

Thomas

14876) Waylon

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 08:49 PM EMAIL

Justine!!!

14877) Bill K.

Tuesday, 9 August 2016 11:27 PM

Correction about USA rear engine auto history is I believe the Tucker was rear engine too but very few were produced compared to the Corvair. Bill K.

14878) brainmaster

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 12:38 AM

Nia said: This is just my personal experience. I'm a very fit and athletic woman, but at 34 now, this is getting harder and harder to recover from. At least a week, sometimes more to get my strength back. My wrists may take a month sometimes.

Ah Nia, your post makes me think of my wife. We are in our mid 50s now but almost once per week for 20 years I would put her taught strenuous and suspension positions. She was a hot fitness hardbody and did yoga. She lasted until she was 44. Shoulder tear put and end to it. It's been cold turkey ever since :( Be safe and careful.

14879) Ralphus

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 01:18 AM EMAIL

Nia: Thanks so much for sharing your suspension experiences with us. It's always good to hear from you. Obviously, edge play like that can be dangerous. Having your wrists take a month to recover is reason enough to stay away from wrist suspension...that's some scary stuff. It's possible you suffered some nerve damage; fortunately it doesn't sound like it was permanent, but why risk it?

I found this site online that features similar stories: Effects of being hung by the wrists

One reader says she has still has pain and numbness in her hands after a 3-hour suspension scene, and that was 18 years ago! Of course, on the same page a lady says she was suspended for 4 hours by her boyfriend with apparently no damage. You never know what to believe, but it's not something I would be willing to risk unless it's for a very short time. Leave it to professional bondage riggers and actresses for your suspension thrills, or if you want to indulge in written fantasy, this story by Kirsten Smart is excellent: HANGING FOR THE WEEKEND

If you check out Kirsten's story section, she writes about being suspended in a number of her stories. And since she writes in the first person, it's like you can experience what she's going though as she describes it in vivid detail.

14880) Fritz

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 02:13 AM

Bill K.: And what about this iconic beauty?

Built in Ireland. Driven through history. But undoubtedly rear engined and American. Not to mention more popular than the Tucker and (just a little bit) faster than the Corvair.

Yeah, I know… OT. So imagine this silver enchantress imperiled in the next Fast and the Furious flick. You think those four-wheeled babes don't suffer?

14881) Bill K.

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 02:42 AM

Fritz: I thought the Delorean was made in England? Also I'm saying mass produced cars in the USA in which Chevy manufactured thousands of Corvairs over a couple years.
I'll leave it at this for I am sure cars models are not a GIMP subject.

Another example of cross bondage, but if the feet are supporting the body the effect of a hanging cross or AOH position isn't going to be the same I'm sure.

Amy Hesketh did a lot of crucifixion scenes for Red Feline. Wonder if she was ever hung by her wrists without her feet supporting her body?
Bill K.

14882) Fritz

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 03:53 AM

Bill K.: As I wrote in my post, the cars were manufactured in Ireland, but DeLorean was definitely a US brand. Over 9000 vehicles were built and sold (i,e. mass-produced), far more than the Tucker you mentioned. Sorry guy… wrong again. And now, back to your regularly expected GIMP content.

14883) T

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 05:13 AM EMAIL

Butting in for a sec...

You're both right, after a fashion.

The DeLorean DMC-12 (AKA: "The Time Machine") was manufactured at a facility in Dunmurry, North Ireland.

North Ireland is part of the U.K., which England is also part of; but, DeLorean Motor Company was a U.S. company headquartered in Detroit.

So, if you're interpreting "Ireland" as a landmass, then yes, it was in Ireland. If you're interpreting "England" as anything with a Union Jack flag on it, then yes, that is partially true too.

There is... *cough* ... some disagreement over who(m) has the rightful claim to the region, but let's not go there.

History is long, tangled and weird.

14884) Kirsten Smart

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 06:09 AM EMAIL

Ralphus thank you for the mention :)

I have played with self-suspension before and I agree with Nia about the sensations. Intense wrist and hand pain initially, the arm/shoulder pain comes slowly but it feels a lot more ominous, a real burning sensation.

The longest I ever managed was around 20 minutes and I gave up because of the pain in my wrists. I never had any trouble with breathing, and I would side with the theories that suggest crucifixion deaths are more about exhaustion and dehydration and perhaps long term shock rather than lungs collapsing, but I guess it depends on the individual!

14885) Fritz

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 06:22 AM

Ford Fusions, Fiestas and Lincoln MKZs have long been built in Mexico, but I doubt Mr. Trump would call them Mehi cars. Camaros are assembled in Canada… but they're hardly Canuck rides. C'mon… where a car is built is hardly relevant. The manufacturer's nationality is what matters. John DeLorean and his company was as Yank as they come. Ireland gave him a deal to build his vision. It tanked. That doesn't make the car a Paddy Wagon. Okay… given its performance, maybe it does.

14886) Covers the Relentless

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 07:19 AM

New Man Dec 1966

14887) Nia

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 07:46 AM EMAIL

The wrist muscles recovery time was actually measurable. I am not referring to nerve damage, that's another story. I play coed softball and volleyball and that's where I first noticed the weakness. I couldn't get around with the bat as quickly nor block with strength at the net. After I noticed those things, I measured my weight on simple wrist curls before and after a suspension. It would take about a month to get the strength back that I had lost in those 15-20 minutes.

As for crucifixion, I tried that once without a footrest and safeworded out in under a minute. I felt as though I was being ripped apart and I had inflammation in the chest muscles that attached to the sternum for weeks. It was so severe at first I thought I was having a heart attack.

14888) Gog

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 07:55 AM

Politics....now cars....what's next? Pokemon?

14889) Jav Critic

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 07:58 AM

Turtle Ninja Mutants: April and the Ooze stars Sadie Holmes as April Oneal, who is investigating the recent crime wave in New York by the evil ‘’Shredor’’. April goes against the Mutants advice and ventures deep into Shredor's underground lair where he unveils his secret plan: New ooze designed to create an army of super mutants, that he will test on April herself, but when he does it transforms the once mild mannered reporter into Super April! With her new powers, Super April has a fighting chance against Shredor, but does he have something else up his sleeve too?

And the first thing I liked about this film was the direction: Off-the-bat being incredibly ual as every single shot is either leading up to/ or resorting from April’s pantyhose-clad ass, and is a decision I definitely get behind. It starts the film instantaneously with an erotic feel, and has no pretensions as to what it is, which only makes it more exhilarating to watch (apart from the obvious).

I also love the fact (going along with the blunt uality of the film) that a fight scene doesn't even ensure before the as the film becomes completely erotically driven, and it takes us by surprise, just like April.

I also LOVE the performance of Sadie Holmes, not only is she incredibly competent and comfortable with these scenes and her dialogue in them, but she’s also great at showing the innocence of April, and without leaving the scenes silent like a lot of Superheroine films (and sadly the one I last reviewed), she pleas and begs throughout to keep things interesting, and to not lose sight of the character plus the peril aspect, which leaves the scenes feeling spellbinding from her performance alone.

She’s also as you might already guess magnificently beautiful, and a joy to watch just on a visual level, let alone the plethora of great sounds and moans she gives us throughout too.

The actor who plays Shredor is also surprisingly capable and efficient in the film as well. He makes sure not to overstay his welcome, or get in the way of Sadie's performance, but when he’s needed (and the times right) he does a very good job.

The direction is simple but effective, again not to get in the way of the stars performance (both of them) it gives us the scenes from a very stable, and (to an extent) detached angle so that we can see all the action play out clearly, which in this films case actually draws us in even more to the events. A lot of films can do the opposite and with varied, often frenzied shots they film the scene from deep inside the action, which in some cases (like the film I just reviewed) it can come off claustrophobic, heated and exhilarating. Yet in other cases it can feel incoherent and messy, as not giving a specific sense of place can often be unengaging and infuriating for the audience.

The scene is great, my only small gripe is the use of a prosthetic, while it doesn't devalue the scene at all I feel like they should've either had it real or have it completely unsimulated as making it in between means it’s a little more awkward for the actors to move around, and have more freedom to give more variety to their positions, but also to give more of a rip-roaring pace and energy to the scene too, yet still as it stands Sadie's performance makes it worthwhile and it’s by no means a terrible scene.

The second costume April wears is just great, the idea alone being very titillating (as well as the Ooze scene itself) I love the shiny almost latex-like texture her outfit has. It shows just the right amount of skin, and the mask plus the shimmering red sleeves are just the icing on the cake.

Also luckily in the last scene they seem to have heard my complaints from before as this is now fully simulated, and with the addition of Sadie's great new costume plus her already established abilities makes this scene everything I wanted it to be, and more.

So all in all this is a great, to-the-point and supremely erotic film featuring a fantastic performance from Sadie Holmes (and an honorable mention for Shredor’s actor), great costume design, fascinating scenes with increasing power, speed and ferocity plus some titillating, innovative ideas and peril throughout. So with that being said I wholeheartedly recommend this film.
A

Buy It Here! :
[clips4sale.com]

14890) Brainmaster

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 08:13 AM

I've had several offers or opportunities to play with submissive or masochistic women and turned away from them just for the reason that I knew their bodies could not take what I like to do though they were more than willing to do it in theory. I really does take a petite gymnastic type body for prolonged suspension.

Now just in case of the event, you do have such a willing gimp, here are some techniques I learned.

Do the suspension in shorter burst like 5 minutes, lower her down for 5 minutes and back up. We could do this for a half hour.

Put a good oscillating vibrator egg between her leg. She could last for 20 minutes strait while thrashing around under the whip. However, this is when injuries occurred.

Put a stool near her legs where she can regulate her own relief. This is good if you want to just watch while you play with your dick.

14891) Brainmaster

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 08:21 AM

Here's a sample of beginning suspension play with a safety device. I can't show the rest of the suspension of my wife because it would expose her identity, but you get the idea.

14892) Brainmaster

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 08:30 AM

Here I'm setting up a taught spread-eagle position but not quite through yet. If your gimp is fit, she can take such a position for an hour or more as long as her toes can firmly touch the ground. Always assess your gimp's health and capacity before engaging in such positions. Often the fantasy is bigger than the reality.

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 08:39 AM EMAIL

Fortunately my Poser-Girls don't have a problem to recover fast from each kind of suspension

14894) SyzygyUK

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 09:18 AM

Location, Location, Location!
England, UK, GB etc. Yers just the same difficulty as we have in saying America, when we mean USA.
1. Great Britain is made up from England, Scotland and Wales
2. The United Kingdom comprises England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.
3. Each country has its own Flag most frequently seen on sporting occasions.
4. The Union Flag is the flag of the United Kingdom.
I will steer clear of the political history!!

14895) Flintstone

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 10:10 AM

to Jesuispain, Quoom, Kelderek, JD, Covers, and Brainmaster: Thanks for the respective art/review; all are greatly appreciated. OK, group hug...

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 10:57 AM EMAIL

Hey GIMPers! Dick here with a special announcement! A new surprise update has just sprung up on the Bunny Bound website! It IS rather political however, but I think that you'll all dig it just the same regardless! it's entitled 'Bunny vs. Trumph!'

Also, the 'custom art' section is up and ready to take your requests! You'll see it by clicking on the 'Shop' option...As you well know, with art, anything can become a reality, so give me your best scenarios and I'll make them come to life!

Hope to hear from you soon! Best!

14897) Ed

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 11:46 AM

Arcas & Cold Comfort: Outstanding! Given my proclivities, it's easy to imagine her just as the door clicks shut and the cold quickly does its magic on her nipples.

14898) Ed

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 11:48 AM

Ran across this, a nice Flash Gordon from the 30's.

14899) Zylinderrohr

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 01:20 PM EMAIL

for the great artist Quoom...unfortunately there are no changes on your website since 12.7.2016, a pity for the members

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 01:28 PM EMAIL

@Zylinderrohr: this isn't true. The latest update has been done end of July as I have checked just now. And the coming update is already sent to my webmaster and should go online in the next days.

14901) Flintstone

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 02:38 PM

for the great artist Quoom...unfortunately there are no changes on your website since 12.7.2016, a pity for the confused members

Yes, he's even 4 months ahead of schedule...

14902) Bill K.

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 03:08 PM

Another example of cross bondage which uses a tree and a 2 by 6 board, rope and nails.

Nia post 14887: Thank you for answering my cross question and it confirms my thinking that with no feet supporting crucifixion position is far more brutal and unbearable then straight up AOH is.

I'm really sorry Ralphus about starting the car and country debate.
Bill K.

14903) Michael Max

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 04:27 PM

@brainmaster Here's a sample of beginning suspension play with a safety device. I can't show the rest of the suspension of my wife because it would expose her identity, but you get the idea.

You could blank out her face, a 2-second job in MS Paint :). The pic looks like a very promising prelude to a suspension scene.

14904) JD

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 05:26 PM EMAIL

Alas, another indefinite period in my life when I'll be away from this place.

I'll update whenever I can on zippy, so if you're into mainstream bondage check my homepage every now and then at [www.zippyshare.com]

For the older archives, password is ralphus.net

Have fun. JD

14905) _blu

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 07:33 PM

14906) johnsmart

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 09:15 PM

Kelderek: thank you for your recent updates. I love your art so much.

JD: NOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!! Please don't be gone long. You contribute a lot to this board. You will be missed.

14907) Ralphus

Wednesday, 10 August 2016 11:57 PM EMAIL

Bill K wrote:

I'm really sorry Ralphus about starting the car and country debate.

I wondered how the hell that happened. I check in this morning and see a bunch of cars on the forum; I wondered if I had typed in the right website address. Then I saw Brainmaster's bondage pictures of his wife and I felt better. I reluctantly left the car stuff on the board, but let's get back to our favorite subject instead.

I was hoping the thread about the DeLorean would eventually lead to pictures of Marty McFly's mom being tied up, but no such luck...

----------------------------------

Jav Critic: Another nice review, thanks. I could do without the vibrator pleasuring, but at least the girl playing April is cute. And bonus, the bad guy isn't played by someone wearing a large turtle costume.

Here's the link to your latest: http://ralphus.net/reviews/other/turtleninjamutants.htm

----------------------------------

Dick Napalm: "Bunny vs. Trumph" is hilarious! Not only a great cartoon, but the text accompanying it is perfect. I could just hear Trump calling Bunny a loser while he's having her tortured.

14908) Matt

Thursday, 11 August 2016 02:49 AM

JD: Come back soon, as your Sci-Fi fakes, both Star Wars and Stargate, are the best. You will be missed, and may your absence be brief.

14909) Covers the Relentless

Thursday, 11 August 2016 08:17 AM

Today's MAM cover is from New Man Dec 1966.

-----------------

14895) Flintstone wrote: to Jesuispain, Quoom, Kelderek, JD, Covers, and Brainmaster: Thanks for the respective art/review; all are greatly appreciated. OK, group hug...

Glad to be of service, Flintstone.

Thursday, 11 August 2016 11:26 AM EMAIL

Hey GIMPers! Dick here!

SOOOOO glad that you guys, (Ralphus), liked the 'Bunny vs Trumph' surprise update on the Bunny Bound site yesterday! If you haven't seen it yet, check it out...sometimes GIMP art can be BRUTAL and just a little humorous if done right, and you don't care what happens to the victim!

'Just a quick question : What do you look for in a BATS scene? I'm doing a medieval Bunny Witch torture series and I really want to get the end 'Burning at the Stake' scene right...Possible a multi scene ending in burning stages...

It will basically come down to your suggestions...remember in art, anything is possible...

Please weigh in on this and help me make it epic!

Thanks!

14911) frog

Thursday, 11 August 2016 11:34 AM

Ralphus, Thanks for the info on “Avenged” aka “Savaged.”

14904) JD Sorry about that, I enjoy your work and your words. Hope you make it back soon.

Bill K. wrote: “I'm really sorry Ralphus about starting the car and country debate.” You have nothing to be sorry about, GIMPS and motor vehicles go well together as, for example, that great Cassandra Delaney’s unforgettable scene in “Fair Game” shows.

To add to the discussion on aoh and suspension, this link clearly describes some of the types of suspension and their painful effects. It comes from professionals who deal with the effects of torture and other human rights violations, so can be trusted. [tinyurl.com]

I also think Nia’s descriptions of her experiences in 14864 and 14887 is a plus for two reasons. First her detailed depiction of what her body goes through and secondly, because it is not often we have a woman’s point of view around here. That also goes for 14884 Kirsten Smart. I recall a Kink.com video in their Hogtied page that showed ways of tying the GIMP's wrists that would lessen the effects that have been described.

One of the reasons the debate on suspension aoh or of another kind gets blurred is because sometimes there is a confusion between the real pain and damage that suspension can do and the fantasy aspect of watching a suspended GIMP. In the fantasy world there is only imagined pain and the aesthetics of the tortured body, no one really is inflicting the agonies of hell on anyone. For my imagination, however, I do need the realism that comes with a good description of what is happening to the GIMP. As to my favorite women that go to the limits of painful suspension, I can thinks of three: the late Amber Rayne, whom I have seen be placed in harsh suspension, and also Madison Young and Redsabbath, whose work I have seen in Kinbakou.

14912) frog

Thursday, 11 August 2016 11:42 AM

The saga of the Psycho Butcher continues with a spread-eagle suspension.

14913) Brainmaster

Thursday, 11 August 2016 05:12 PM

Today's picture: If only I could find me a hot young gimp who could do that for a an hour. Any volunteers?

14914) Bill K.

Friday, 12 August 2016 12:22 AM

Brainmaster: those wrist hanging Blakemore gimp movies were created 40 something years ago.
Not sure any of today's gimp actresses would willing or able to do that now.

Reading his film history "Blakemore Speaks" posted here he had true masochistic women to work with.
He did a lot worse to them than today's picture shows.
Bill K.

14915) Klingsor

Friday, 12 August 2016 05:51 AM

If the star trek series were filmed today....

14916) Covers the Relentless

Friday, 12 August 2016 10:11 AM

New Man Dec 1967 V5 No6 Basil Gogos cover

14917) Brainmaster

Friday, 12 August 2016 11:21 AM

Bill K: Yes, he did find true mashochists but there must be true ones out there now. Even though, it's incredible what those women could take. If I were looking for good gimp material, I would start here. [www.youtube.com]

It just so happens I'm going to have 2 weeks staring this Monday to play gimp games if I can find me a nubile mashochistic gimp who like Blackmore style. I'm accepting application for any volunteers. :) Good time guaranteed.

14918) T

Friday, 12 August 2016 07:44 PM EMAIL

Ralphus: I was hoping the thread about the DeLorean would eventually lead to pictures of Marty McFly's mom being tied up, but no such luck...

Sorry. I went temporarily insane.

All I can offer in atonement is this short GIMP moment from George Lucas's flawless magnum opus; Howard the Duck...

[embedded content]

14919) urvax

Saturday, 13 August 2016 12:20 AM EMAIL

The clip is Amy from the Longdozen episodes from Kshara.

14920) MrAnthony

Saturday, 13 August 2016 12:27 AM

Regarding today's GIF:
I believe the source is longdozen.com and that the model is Amy.

check out this advertisement:
[lux]

Other images with same guy using a whip:

[www.tumbex.com]

Saturday, 13 August 2016 12:35 AM

14922) lionrobe

Saturday, 13 August 2016 02:10 AM EMAIL

14923) Artur (AE)

Saturday, 13 August 2016 03:47 AM

Torture of two female soldiers.

"They call us in the Western world terrorist. That's not true. We are true believers and are in the holy war. We have here a monastery taken over by the evil Arab Christians. It is now our torture center. A good place to tortures unbelieving soldiers. ha, ha .... you are infidel whores. Especially her slovenly female soldiers. At first Mrs lieutenant is tortured. ha, ha .... You Mrs Sergeant watch it. ha, ha .... Mrs lieutenant has told us that it's your birthday today. " Mrs Sergeant! "Congratulations on your 20th birthday." Ha, ha .... "As a special gift we will burn after electric torture your pussy. Ha, ha .... Then ten soldiers rape you. Ha, ha ...."

"But now it is service time Mrs Lieutenant: Where is your division stationed?"

14924) Artur (AE)

Saturday, 13 August 2016 03:48 AM

Happy Birthday Mrs Sergeant.

"Now it's your turn. I ask you where your Division is stationed. Mrs lieutenant would not talk. Now we break their bones."
"Good day Your Excellency. Welcome to our humble Torture Center."

Emir speak:
"This incredulous females stink so terribly. Your poor men, what you have to endure for our holy war. You are truly upright holy warriors.

They with no tits ... let stand for me. I want to test my new bullwhip. I have long whipped no more woman to death. Since me this stinking infidels is just right. But Wash it, I'll bring my wife. You should see what happening with disobedient women. Goodbye brave warriors of God."

"You heard Mrs Sergeant? We now finish your torture and clean you. You will now enjoy our emir and his entourage at evening! Haha ...."

14925) asbarka

Saturday, 13 August 2016 05:41 AM

Hey T, where did you get this pic? looks like a photo not a screenshot... There is also a nice scene in tv series Esclava blanca episode 6
Here is the link

[www.seriesflv.net] 3:41, however the are speaking in Spanish

14926) asbarka

Saturday, 13 August 2016 05:48 AM

Maybe someone could translate why is she punished?

14927) e's bodyguard

Saturday, 13 August 2016 07:13 AM

Mr. Anthony scores again. Thanks for the tumbex link.

Today's pic is Amy who appeared in at least 25 Longdozen, and as many in its predecessor Kshara. She started out all smiles but as the years passed only whimpered and naturally trembled thru the scenes. However, a pure delight.

Kshara closed and retagged as Brutal Punishment. Longdozen, as I posted at 14097, is now a limp lesbian site.

Flexislave (or Sporty Women) at Clips4Sale has taken down all its nude bondage whip scenes. In fact a recheck today I couldn't find the site at all, but it may be in another category than Whipping.

14928) A Canadian

Saturday, 13 August 2016 12:10 PM

Jav Critic: Thanks for putting together your most recent heroine reviews.

As much as I like heroine movies and Yu Kawakami (particularly in her pre-boob-job days), Giant Heroine Sigma Lady definitely ain't my thing.

For one thing, I can't get into the giant heroine stuff. It reminds me too much of Godzilla (the monster, not the euphemism we GIMPers use for the website with GIGA films that can't be officially named). Second, I have no use for the GIGA films where the victim is wearing a helmet for much of the movie.

I'm OK with most of GIGA's sci-fi weirdness but I skip these types of films.

14929) Covers the Relentless

Saturday, 13 August 2016 12:22 PM

New Man Dec 1968

14930) T

Saturday, 13 August 2016 01:53 PM EMAIL

asbarka: Hey T, where did you get this pic? looks like a photo not a screenshot...

That's a good question.

Collecting and identifying pillory scenes is one of my callings in life. (Everyone needs a hobby) And, I've been working closely with the founder of Babes in the Wood to create a comprehensive list of them for future generations to peruse.

[www.babesinthewood.me.uk]

A site which is, by the way, hosted by a woman. Fun fact.

It was during one of my searches through a nigh-defunct Yahoo fan site, that I chanced upon some strange and fragmented pics from various European movies/TV.

There were about three of this girl in the foot stocks. They were grouped in with a blurry black & white pic from a Norwegian film called An-Magritt (1969).

[montages.no]

All were labeled "German", even the aforementioned Norwegian film, and I'd almost guess that they came from a newspaper or magazine, if not snapped directly from a black & white television set; but these are merely educated guesses.

asbarka: There is also a nice scene in tv series Esclava blanca episode 6... Maybe someone could translate why is she punished?

The pilloried slave girl is Colombian actress Alejandra Taborda.

In that episode, she's being punished for a crime she didn't commit. The slave-owner's wicked daughter has stolen some of her mother's jewelry and she pinned it all on this poor girl.

(But, yes: I have an ever-growing list of unidentified stock & pillory scenes that need names. If anyone knows of any more that aren't on that list, please share.)

Saturday, 13 August 2016 03:07 PM EMAIL

The countdown for the release of JUSTINE has begun! Amy is finishing the subtitling and close captioning assets, Jac is completing the sound mix. This weekend JUSTINE will be ready for the final steps, which include the making of the DVD and Download versions as well as the possible Theatrical release version. It was decided that the release date will be announced when that part of the work is done!

Waylon (14876) Justine!!!
Yes, the wait is at an end. We're all very anxious to have this amazing film out. Amazing you said? Yes! That's what I said! It is amazing. I had the chance to see the opening sequence of the film and that in and of itself is already an amazing movie! A short movie, sure, but AMAZING! I am certain that everyone will agree with me when they see it. It will soon become a classic of GIMP movie making and it will make history as the most intense opening sequence in the world of gimpy movies EVER.

There's a big discussion on the subject of AOH versus Crucifixion without feet support. I guess we have some experience with that. In the early days of RFPIX, even before the early days of RFPIX, Carmen aka Camille already experienced both. She discussed at length at some forums, particularly at the Crux Foundation forum, how she felt during her experiences and how long they lasted. It was difficult, for sure, I would like to go back there, search for her comments and share them, but it would take some time. Here's a picture from The Via Crucis of Camille 7, the first time she was suspended without feet support.

Bill K. Hanging by the cross position is much more painful than AOH.Crucifixion is a horrible torture slow death, especially if the gimp is nailed to the cross. Now if you slowly batc as pictured even worst. Gimp actresses: how long could they bear hanging in the cross position compared to AOH I wonder? More food for thought. Bill K.
The videos Camille and Amy did with both AOH and Crucifixion suspension are not very long, but they do spend a long time in that position. Amy did a very prolonged AOH suspension scene in Fantom. It lasts a very long time in the screen, and if you consider that it had to be shot for different angles... you can only imagine. I tried doing something like that once and I could not last more than a few seconds. I believe that there's a combination of body weight and arms strength. In the case of Amy and Carmen, they are both lighter than me or Vero, so they were able to withstand the pressure for long periods of time.

Amy had a long scene in Maleficarum where she was suspended AOH while being whipped for a very, very long time.

Bill K. (14881) Another example of cross bondage, but if feet are supporting body the effect of hanging cross or AOH position isn't going to be the same I'm sure.

Having your wrists together during AOH position is better than spread eagle, cross like, or during crucifixion. Carmen had that experience for the first time in The Via Crucis of Camille 8. The idea was for her to be suspended, her wrists tied to the sides of the cross bar, while being whipped until her garment fell off her body. It took a while to get to that point.

Bill K. (14881)Amy Hesketh did a lot of crucified scenes for Red Feline. Wonder if she was ever hung by her wrists without feet supporting body?

When Amy joined Jac in this adventure, she saw all the RFPIX videos Jac made with Carmen aka Camille. She was particularly impressed with the one where Camille is suspended, cross like, with her feet dangling up in the air, no support at all. So, Amy decided to try that out during her "training" sessions. And so she did. She was suspended for a very long time, her arms stretched out, her feet without any support. You can see the full video in Training Jane. If she weren't so busy, I would ask her how she felt that day.

Amy repeated her experience of being suspended, cross like, in Agent X. During that tortuous moment she had her legs spread too.

Her experience during the Training of Jane and Agent X period was a very good training for her harrowing scenes in Maleficarum, where she's suspended, again, arms stretched spread-eagle, for a long period of time. But then again, everything that Amy goes through in Maleficarum is pretty harrowing and super intense.

Bill K. Regarding post 14859 by T. I have three real lady web friends that want to burn at the stake at the Stakedamsels forum and two BG and Zorf that want to be raped before and while being bats.These ladies are not gimp actresses like Amy Hesketh but real ordinary ladies into fiery gimp action. They do not give their real names of course but unlike us guys have victim fantasies. Of the 7 or 8 lady Gimpers I'm not sure any of them are masochistic or have gimp fantasies. What do lady GImpers have to say?

I can't speak from anyone in our group, that's a fact. I might know what their fantasies are, up to a point, because of what they shared with me over a cup of coffee or during , but what I can say is that their range is very wide, it covers a multitude of tendencies and sins, when discussing this issue as a group, not individuals, but none of it has anything to do with the actual making of the movies. No one is fulfilling some fantasy or other, they are all working very hard and their minds are more into creating the perfect scene. Everything becomes too real and a victim has to be a victim and the torturer has to be the torturer and both have to concentrate on their performance.

T There are of course our Amy Heskeths and Lina Romays who receive a deserved amount of praise for their art, but all too often I read arguments about some trivial grip about GIMP's tattoo being unattractive, or someone possibly being unwilling to do full nudity or something... Let's be horrible rape-monsters, but let's not forget that there would be none of it without the helpless damsels who make it all possible. At least before we... you know... suspend them by their wrists to commit unspeakable acts upon their quivering naked bodies. (Or whatever your personal inclinations may lead you.)

The Amy Heskeths, the Milas, the Beas, ... they all have to consider what they do and how far they are willing to go for their art. The roles they accept to take are very difficult and doing that will have an effect on how they are seen by the public at large. In a small city where people in the same line of work know each other, rumors and suppositions spread very fast. Friends and family will certainly know what they are involved in and they will have an opinion. And these ladies are young, with their future ahead of them and so they must weigh everything before they get involved. It's not easy, not at all. Someone like Amy or Lina Romay, made a desicion, and they kept it for years and years and maybe gave up some friends and so on, and found their call in the roles they played, but those who are beginning, like Bea, they are not there yet. So, they tread this road carefully, but the steps they take must be appreciated, that's for sure. Mila and Bea are considering their next few roles and they are both at a point where a bit of encouragement would do wonders. Bea, particularly, is waiting to see where JUSTINE takes her, while Mila is committing to Maleficarum II, if that movie happens. It's under consideration, but it's not sure... not yet.

That's it for now, the SALE is over, but you can enjoy our movies at their normal rate. We have great movies and they are worth their cost... and all sales do help our future work. We'll release JUSTINE soon, and we would love to move on to our next projects and we'll need the cash to make them. So... it's always up to how much we sell.

RFPIX VOD
Red Feline DVD Store
VermeerWorks VOD

14932) Howie

Saturday, 13 August 2016 04:08 PM

Good old Benny Hill. Always loved his show when I was a kid, because you'd see the occasional naked woman, and can you fucking even imagine a joke like this being made on TV today?

[embedded content]

Howie

14933) asbarka

Saturday, 13 August 2016 04:13 PM

hey T i have sent you a message on your emailguessmysecretidentity@gmail.com so we wont flud the forum

14934) Waylon

Saturday, 13 August 2016 05:00 PM EMAIL

Closer to release!!! Bea??????

14935) T

Saturday, 13 August 2016 05:45 PM EMAIL

@asbarka: I responded to your email. If you have any ideas, please let me know.

@Howie: Could it be that this short moment from The Benny Hill Show is what inspired one of the most notorious video games in history?

[embedded content]

14936) A Canadian

Saturday, 13 August 2016 06:40 PM

Howie and T: Thanks, guys. Now, I've got that silly theme song from The Benny Hill Show running through my head.

14937) T

Saturday, 13 August 2016 07:11 PM EMAIL

It's called Yakety Sax, and you're welcome.

[embedded content]

14938) Harold Fox

Saturday, 13 August 2016 08:06 PM EMAIL

Glad to be here

Sunday, 14 August 2016 01:02 AM EMAIL

Hey Y'all.

Sorry that I'm late for the 13th. Dealing with the Monsoon out here.

Sunday, 14 August 2016 01:26 AM

Tina Yuzuki (Rio) jav actress tied AOH and torture. this scene taken from iptd 825.Here is link to watch on my FB page [www.facebook.com]

14941) Bill K.

Sunday, 14 August 2016 02:24 AM

Margot said "She was suspended for a very long time, her arms stretched out, her feet without any support. You can see the full video in Training Jane. If she weren't so busy, I would ask her how she felt that day."

Thank you Margot but it did look like from your posted picture that Amy was able to grip the rope or strap with her hands so the effects on her wrists that JD was talking about was not the same.
Of course it was still brutal torture on the wrists for sure.

Today's Picture: If only that was burning pyre flames instead of that green pea soup stuff the animated poser gimp was hanging above.

Or perhaps the movie "Temple of Doom" gimp scene where the gimp is lowered into a lava pit. Bill K.

14942) Joker

Sunday, 14 August 2016 03:17 AM

E's bodyguard...Flexislave is now studio/38576/Sporty-BDSM-Models-Whipping#
at C4S. The owner took down all the full size whipping scenes and has replaced them with tame "previews". The claim is the site is being reorganized but that remains to be seen since there's been zero activity there in months.

Rick Masters...any ZFX productions on the horizon?

Mr. Blakemore....you are the Babe Ruth of the genre. 40 years later and I still get a bulge watching Rene Baker twitch.

14943) A Canadian

Sunday, 14 August 2016 03:50 AM

aoh fans wrote:

Tina Yuzuki (Rio) jav actress tied AOH and torture. this scene taken from iptd 825.Here is link to watch on my FB page....

And for anyone seeking more information, here is my review of that film from a few years ago.

Without a doubt, Rio was one of the most beautiful women to ever appear in adult films.

14944) bitch_93

Sunday, 14 August 2016 03:59 AM EMAIL

I like it when I am treated humiliated and brutally.

14945) Gog

Sunday, 14 August 2016 08:05 AM

Well....it continues. See ya guys later.

14946) lionrobe

Sunday, 14 August 2016 09:42 AM EMAIL

14947) Covers the Relentless

Sunday, 14 August 2016 11:43 AM

New Man Dec 1969 p33

Sunday, 14 August 2016 08:34 PM EMAIL

Hello all! Dick here! I hope that all of you checked out the Bunny Bound site Friday update with Bunny at the Olympics! Those of you into the classic 'Tiger Bench' torture ought to love it! One individual made a nasty comment on it which you can respond to if you like! :)

The Monday update is UP NOW for you to enjoy!

This weekend I worked my ever lovin' ass off to create some killer new content for you fine folks! Three new color pinup stories with Bunny in three different 'cosply' outfits being worked on! They are ready and waiting to be posted soon!

'Hope you all had a great weekend! See you all again soon!

14949) Ralphus

Sunday, 14 August 2016 11:46 PM EMAIL

Finally checking back in...been working a lot of hours, haven't had a chance to read the forum for a few days.

Howie: Okay, I've seen that Benny Hill joke repeated multiple times (it was also in the movie If You Don't Stop It, You'll Go Blind! with a topless girl) and I even used this cartoon artwork by Dany as the Picture of the Day once on the forum. Nonetheless, it ALWAYS makes me laugh out loud. Rape humor is so politically incorrect I almost laugh as a sign of protest. But on top of that, it was genuinely funny! Great vintage find there.

----------------------------

T wrote:

Could it be that this short moment from The Benny Hill Show is what inspired one of the most notorious video games in history?

Omigod, you've got to admire the idea behind it, but how primitive are those graphics? That's about a half step more advanced than Pong.

----------------------------

MrAnthony, Urvax, e's bodyguard and _blu: Thanks guys, you are the best. Too bad Longdozen changed their focus and went with weak lesbian whipping, that sucks. Can the Amy footage still be downloaded from Brutal Punishment?

----------------------------

Dick Napalm wrote:

Well, that sounds like a great idea. Can't believe our resident BATS freak Bill K hasn't weighed in on this one yet.

I like lots of rope. Tight ropes on the victim in several places, the ankles, calves, waist, chest and neck, with the wrists tied behind her and behind the stake. Lots of wood stacked around her, you don't have to be conservative; give her a big pyre.

BTW, I also love the Tiger Bench Olympics drawing you just posted. I would definitely tune in if they had a competition like that.

----------------------------

Gog wrote:

Well....it continues. See ya guys later.

Um, can you be a little more cryptic there, Gog?

14950) Bill K.

Monday, 15 August 2016 12:22 AM

Re: Post 14910 by Dick Napalm.
A good bats scene to me has to be serious and very dark. See the example picture of my latest poser bats.

In many bats movie scenes the stake damsel has that clean straight out the beauty parlor look. I see a lot of bats poser and manipulation artists, some great like Sir Steven where their stake damsel is a perfect 10. Not a mark on them.

In closing, the theme is not important to me so long as the gimp looks the part of a real stake damsel.

See Ralphus I'm embarrassed I missed Dick's post.
Bill K.

14951) T

Monday, 15 August 2016 01:22 AM EMAIL

For me, the lead up to the execution is more important than the execution itself...

But, I was always a fan of the gratuitous rope through the teeth, à la The Devonsville Terror.

I also like it when the condemned witch's clothes are ripped to shreds, conveying that the gathered mob has committed acts of violence upon her.

14952) Bill K.

Monday, 15 August 2016 02:17 AM

Continuing from my last post, stake damsels don't always have to be tied to a stake. A cross, tree, cemetery gate as pictured, a chair, hanging over a fire, later slowly lowered into a fire and many other methods.

Dick speaking for myself if you say "What do you look for in a BATS scene? " The S stands for Stake, so use a stake for sure.

Ralphus' rule 666: if a witch is not tied to a stake she's not a stake damsel or bats. I agree with that in that you say you want to do a BATS then you should use a stake.
Bill K.

14953) lionrobe

Monday, 15 August 2016 05:07 AM EMAIL

14954) Torch 2

Monday, 15 August 2016 06:45 AM

Two girls are brutally tortured with torches at the cunt.

14955) Electro fan

Monday, 15 August 2016 07:19 AM

Does anyone know which movie this scene is from? It's a really good electro scene. Are there more similar from the same producer?

[bdsmstreak.com]

14956) Covers the Relentless

Monday, 15 August 2016 08:21 AM

New Man Dec 1969

14957) _blu

Monday, 15 August 2016 09:19 AM

...

14958) _blu

Monday, 15 August 2016 09:20 AM

...

Monday, 15 August 2016 09:21 AM

...

Monday, 15 August 2016 11:14 AM EMAIL

Hey guys, I really want to thank BillK and Ralphus for the great suggestions on the BATS scene I'm going to be illustrating! Bunny will go through numerous medieval tortures before ending up on the stake platform so she will NOT looks pristine! I do think that the Bunny Witch trial will take a more serious tone, at least with the art for sure! I'm planning on doing it as a 'black and white' with grey tone washes to give it an oppressive feel like it's back during the inquisition or Salem witch trial type eras..

I'm so glad that you guys are liking the Bunny Bound web content and are supporting it with your comments, visits, and downloading the Graphic Novel! I'm told that in the 'adult' industry, something with that amount of content is a steal at under $10 bucks! So there's that!

I find that I'm able to squeeze in more time to do new work for Bunny Web content, so please keep your eyes open for new 'surprise' content over and above the Monday and Friday guaranteed updates! More topical stuff too!

Thanks again guys! Oh, and by the way, LOVE the new posts here featuring the color comic pages! They look like they originated in Europe, likely France! Just great stuff!

Always more to come!

14961) provost

Monday, 15 August 2016 01:21 PM

Dick, love the participative aspect of Bunny's adventures. Hope you find it in your heart to rack her and give her a taste of the bastinado en route to the stake. Makes walking that last mile a bit more challenging for the lass.....

Cheers!

14962) Kelderek

Monday, 15 August 2016 01:37 PM EMAIL

New render for your GIMPish pleasure

Taking the usual path through the forest, I stumbled upon three damsels in distress!

What to do...
- Have my way with them all right there?
- Take one home, let the other two go?
- Take one home, leave the other two and return tomorrow, hoping they will still be there?

(Letting all three go is not an option!)

I'm sure the BATS fans will start gathering some wood

14963) lionrobe

Monday, 15 August 2016 05:29 PM EMAIL

Monday, 15 August 2016 06:28 PM

_torture__workout

14965) Bill K.

Monday, 15 August 2016 07:04 PM

Re: Post 14962 by Kelderek.
"I'm sure the BATS fans will start gathering some wood.

Why else would you tie damsels to a stake? In the middle of a forest no less where there is plenty of firewood.

"Whena yousa thinking we are do with them?" Jar Jar Binks would say.
Bill K.

14966) Roadrunner

Monday, 15 August 2016 08:57 PM

Hi all,

My very first posting here...Great Site, no question!

Just because of being confused about "Today´s Pic"...

A BATS scene! Like mine, my ever first in my Interrogation series (suggested & induced by Bill K./Billbats...THX)

Maybe just mere coincidence or black magic yet...

14967) Ralphus

Monday, 15 August 2016 11:38 PM EMAIL

Kelderek wrote:

New render for your GIMPish pleasure.

Nice one, as usual.

Taking the usual path through the forest, I stumbled upon three damsels in distress!

Damn, I need to go live where you do. I hardly ever find tied-up women in the woods near my place...

What to do...
- Have my way with them all right there?
- Take one home, let the other two go?
- Take one home, leave the other two and return tomorrow, hoping they will still be there?

Well, first I would check around for hidden cameras. Who just leaves tied-up naked women alone in the forest? It could be that John Quiñones from "What Would You Do?" is lurking nearby just to see how you react. Or hell, maybe you're getting punk'd by Ashton Kutcher. This sounds like a classic set-up.

(Letting all three go is not an option!)

Well, duh, I know you're not an idiot. Okay, here's what I would do. After CONFIRMING there's no cameras around, take your pick among the 3 damsels (personally, I would go for the spread-eagled one), and keep her tied there while you gather wood for the other two. I mean, they're already tied to stakes, half your work is already done. Let her watch the other two go up in smoke, then untie her and take her back to your lair. She'll be so traumatized she'll do whatever you want (well, she will anyway).

Simple solution, any GIMPer would do the same thing.

14968) MrAnthony

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 12:14 AM

14969) Ralphus

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 12:22 AM EMAIL

Well, that didn't take long. Let's welcome MrAnthony back to the winner's circle!

Today's Mystery Movie is indeed the 1971 Hammer Studios classic Twins of Evil, starring Peter Cushing as the evil witch hunter and featuring lots of attractive women in bondage, and including busty Playboy models Mary and Madeleine Collinson as the aforementioned twins. How good is this movie? Well, it features not one, not two, but three different burning at the stake scenes, one of which occurs during the first 5 minutes, proving that the filmmakers didn't want to make us wait for the good stuff.

Years ago, I was invited to a friend's house and saw this movie for the first time (on glorious VHS). She asked me if I liked the film afterward, to which I replied, "Yes, I always enjoy a good witchburning movie!" And I wasn't joking.

14970) MrAnthony

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 12:25 AM

It took a bit of sleuthing, but I believe the actress burning in the opening sequence in Twins of Evil is Judy Matheson.

The blonde BATS in mid-movie is Kirsten Lindholm.

14971) Ralphus

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 12:44 AM EMAIL

MrAnthony wrote:

It took a bit of sleuthing, but I believe the actress burning in the opening sequence in Twins of Evil is Judy Matheson.

That is correct. Here she is again:

The blonde BATS in mid-movie is Kirsten Lindholm.

What, you mean this scene?

Really just looking for an excuse to show off more of the gifs I made from the movie.

14972) Bill K.

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 01:33 AM

Thank you Roadrunner for the terrific bats that I suggested you create at the new site: [www.visionsofdarkness.com] VOD which replaced AOD.
Gimpers should check it out for sure.
Bill K.

14973) Covers the Relentless

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 07:17 AM

New Man Dec 1970

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 09:31 AM EMAIL

Ralphus has posted another story of mine, MEGAN'S ASIAN INTERROGATION. An American agent is captured and tortured by a Chinese interrogator working for the North Koreans. (M+/F, bondage, foot torture, racking, branding, bastinado, whipping, water torture, electro). It can be found at [ralphus.net]

This one is also quite long, 21,000 words and originally appeared in RPP Stories as AN ASIAN INTEROGATION. I have rewritten it in parts and added a scene or two. You will note that in the beginning a different font color is used for part of the tale. This is because it is from a different POV. It is an observer but the question is - who is the observer? Hope I didn't get too artsy here.

14975) asbarka

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 11:37 AM

Hey T check email pls. Sry for offtop guys

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 07:22 PM EMAIL

Hey Y'all.

Sorry, no image this time.

Don't know if y'all have heard about it, but the greater Baton Rouge area has experienced extreme levels of flooding. Well, as of this morning I had to leave my house or get totally flooded in. I don't expect it to get into my house, as I am like, three feet off of the ground, but the street has at least 6-8 inches covering it, so I needed to leave just in case. (Staying with my parents)

I guess that makes me a girl-in-peril at the moment.

Anyway, just wanted y'all to know that if you don't hear from me for a few days, it's not my normal reticence. I'm prolly just dead.

Laters!

14977) BIll K.

Tuesday, 16 August 2016 08:33 PM

Kathyrne sorry to hear about your flood problems. Even if your house is spared the issue of sewage, electricity, land phone service, drinking water, natural gas and health issues are going to go on for many months thereafter the water goes away.

Keep in touch even if you can't create and post your terrific gimp artwork.

Stay safe and dry. Bill K.

14978) e's bodyguard

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 02:34 AM

Ralphus: Since you asked, I have no idea if Brutal Punishment has the early Kshara vids of Miss Amy.
But I stopped looking into sites that have 40 other included sites back in 09.

As for meeting three ladies in the forest, here's erodite's take on meeting two.

14979) Covers the Relentless

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 07:21 AM

New Man Dec 1971 V9 No5

14980) _blu

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 07:31 AM

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 10:02 AM EMAIL

Happy Hump day Gimp fans! Dick here to let you know that there is a NEW 'surprise' update on the bunny-bound.com site today! 'Like Harry Potter and magic? No? Well, neither does Bunny after a willful little magic kid takes his frustrations out on her! 'Come by and check it out! 'Hope you all dig it!

In answer to provost: 'Dick, love the participative aspect of Bunny's adventures. Hope you find it in your heart to rack her and give her a taste of the bastinado en route to the stake. Makes walking that last mile a bit more challenging for the lass.....

YES!! She will be horribly racked to the point where they try to stretch her BONES!

Bastinado? YES!! Plus some other rigorous foot tortures! She'll need a medieval wheelchair after they are done!

By the way, since we're on the subject of foot torture, you might want to check out the Bunny Bound graphic novel I have on the site for download...there is an entire chapter on foot torture within the 80 big pages!! (Shameless plug)...

I will also be posting some 'work in progress' items on our Tumblr page as well...rough drawings from the inquisition story, and another short entitled 'Bunny Meets the Hangman' in which poor Bunny is hung at length by various parts of her body!

Okay, that about does it for this entry! 'Hope you all enjoy the new update! 'Talk to you all again soon!

14982) bastinado

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 10:06 AM

Esso: You have produced another masterpiece with "Megan's Asian Interrogation." I only can hope that there will be a sequel with Susan in the hands of the sadistic Mr. Chang. While I was reading the story, I couldn't help but think it would make a great movie. I wonder who would you cast as Megan? Jessica Chastain? Angelina Jolie?

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 05:10 PM EMAIL

bastinado: RE Megan’s Asiatic Interrogation. first of all thanks for the props. As always greatly appreciated. The fantasy of a movie never entered my mind but upon your mention the first name that came to mind was not an actress but Michelle Jenneke. She is the Australian Olympic hurdler who became famous for her pre-race routine three or four years ago. (Worth watching. See web site above.) Don’t know if she can act but she can look adorable or, suitably for Megan, tough and athletic. If you can bankroll the movie, I will pay for the acting lessons.

As far as a sequel to Megan starring Susan, I am stuck on two magazine redos and an original story. Also along the lines of your request someone (Darkness Monger?) asked if I would do the same with another story (Room 3) that appeared on RPP site. On top of that I have started another story but more about that later.

14984) A Canadian

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 05:59 PM

blu: Those comic strips you posted are great.

I may have missed it (apologies in advance if that's the case) but where do they come from? I'd like to know more about them.

14985) _blu

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 06:40 PM

14986) _blu

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 06:51 PM

@a canadian...

14987) _blu

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 06:52 PM

@a canadian...

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 06:54 PM

14989) Artur (AE)

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 07:08 PM

Interrogation of a French Partisan Girl

1943 - Somewhere in France on the Atlantic coast.

A french partisan girl is stretched on the beach with chains between two tank barrier. It is interrogated under brutal torture by SS soldiers. Her screams can still be heard in the 500 m distant village.

14990) A Canadian

Wednesday, 17 August 2016 11:24 PM

blu: Merci.

14991) Covers the Relentless

Thursday, 18 August 2016 08:20 AM

New Man Feb 1966 Inside Scan

14992) bastinado

Thursday, 18 August 2016 09:53 AM

Esso: You are right, Michelle Jenneke certainly does fit the bill for Megan. Unfortunately neither of us have the resources to bankroll a film. I look forward to reading your upcoming works. Your stories, no matter what the genre, are the best this board has to offer.

14993) jerseydevil

Thursday, 18 August 2016 10:51 AM

esso great story about megan hope we find out what happens to susan

Thursday, 18 August 2016 11:29 AM EMAIL

bastinado: You embarrass me with your effusive praise. Not necessarily a bad thing. Thanks.

jerseydevil: I can tell you what happens to Susan - she is horribly tortured in front of Megan. For a detailed description I'm afraid you will have to wait. See my response to bastinado at 14983.

Ralphus: The thought immediately occurred to me that today's picture perfectly fits the last part of "Two Agents in Central America." (http://ralphus.net/special/stories/moreauthors/twoagents.htm) But I like the illustration just the way you did it at the top of the story. There just is something about a naked female staked out spread eagled on the ground...

14995) Osouk

Thursday, 18 August 2016 12:21 PM

Esso - another superb story. I had read it on RPP, so it was interesting trying to work out what the extra bits you put in were - although futile as my memory is so rubbish these days. Your description of her being broken is incredibly evocotive.

I hadn't really noticed Michelle Jenneke before - she certainly does fit the bill. I think she would look great dancing under the electricity. Really looking forward to your next stories.

14996) lionrobe

Thursday, 18 August 2016 02:09 PM EMAIL

Artur (AE), where is-it possible to collect all your stunning art ?

14997) toxicmask

Thursday, 18 August 2016 02:56 PM

Esso, I really enjoyed your lastest story, the heavy wooden beam was a great choice. I hope they use it longer on Susan too

14998) XL Johnson

Thursday, 18 August 2016 03:02 PM EMAIL

Found this pic on tumblr a few weeks ago. No luck finding any more info after searching multiple sites including most of the GIMP database. Almost looks like a Blakemore production.
Any ideas on where it comes from? Appreciate any help.

14999) Esso

Thursday, 18 August 2016 03:58 PM EMAIL

XL Johnson 14998: Just a guess but I think it may be from one of the Emanuelle movies. I might have even seen something on this site that reminded me of that.

Osouk: Thanks. Especially coming from a writer of your ability. I really can't remember much of what I changed, a lot of it having been of minor importance. I tend to worry too much whether it should be the noose was "slipped" over her head or "thrown" over head. I do know I added Megan having the wet cloth forced down her throat while she was on the rack. I could tell you more if I went back and read it but that just isn't going to happen. Thanks again.

Toxicmask: also thanks but I let me clean up a little of what's on m plate before I get back to Susan, see 14983, although if I keep getting requests I might have to rethink this.

Thursday, 18 August 2016 05:01 PM

@esso & xl johnson

it's the snuff scene from:
'emanuelle in america' (1977)...
[motherless.com]

15001) A Canadian

Thursday, 18 August 2016 05:46 PM

I'm looking for some recommendations.

The other day, I updated my depfile account, to allow me to get my hands on a JAV film that I plan to review in the coming weeks. This means that I have the opportunity to download other JAV files for the next month or so.

However, I can't think of many recent JAV releases that are worth pursuing. I have received one recommendation via email from joek0 but am certainly open to others suggestions.

If anyone has any recommendations, please let me know.

Naturally, I wouldn't want anyone to break the rules -- so there's no need to provide any violating links. The title and especially the film's code are more than sufficient.

Thanks.

15002) xl johnson

Thursday, 18 August 2016 06:17 PM EMAIL

Wow. A movie inside a movie. No wonder it was so hard to track down. Many thanks to _Blu locking it in and Esso for narrowing it down.
I now have some new leads to track down to see if it exists as a movie outside a movie.

15003) Ralphus

Thursday, 18 August 2016 07:21 PM EMAIL

XL Johnson: JD posted with this same picture as well as a few other vidcaps about 3 weeks ago. As blu mentioned, it came from Emanuelle in America, although specifically, it's a photograph from a scene that takes place after the snuff footage.

emanuelle_photos by ralphus44

You have to admire Joe D'Amato, one of the truly great mainstream GIMP directors, for going to all that trouble to shoot such realistic-looking torture footage for his film, and then to take the photographs from the shoot for this later scene. From what I understand he got into trouble because he didn't make it clear that the snuff footage was actually faked for the movie. Yeah, technically it's a movie within a movie, but the snippets are all he ever intended to release.

15004) Ralphus

Thursday, 18 August 2016 07:33 PM EMAIL

What the heck...why keep it to myself? Here's another gif I made from Emanuelle in America. I see commercials all the time for women pushing the hot oil treatment for their hair, but apparently there are other uses for it, too.

15005) TGG

Friday, 19 August 2016 02:45 AM

Quite a while ago I learned about hotmovies.com on this board. Since then I have been looking for other VOD streaming websites. I already know of two others, AEBN.com and bondagevideolink.com. Anyone in here know of any more VOD sites, other than the three I mentioned? I am looking for titles from B & D Pleasures, HOM, London Video, LBO, and ZFX productions.

15006) Joker

Friday, 19 August 2016 03:00 AM

TGG...just look UP...there's a ZFX banner right there that leads to VOD's , full movies, the whole enchilada.

Friday, 19 August 2016 03:57 AM

If you want to find kinky partners for fetish games, I would recommend BDSMdater.com. Have had some great success there finding willing chicks into various things.

15008) zeke

Friday, 19 August 2016 07:55 AM

Re: 15008 by Odd If you want to find kinky partners for fetish games, I would recommend BDSMdater.com. Have had some great success there finding willing chicks into various things.

Great if you are living in or perhaps traveling to Europe, but the site is not based in the US and accepts only EU countries and towns. Thanks anyway.

15009) Covers the Relentless

Friday, 19 August 2016 08:23 AM

New Man Feb 1966 p33

15010) _blu

Friday, 19 August 2016 08:42 AM

Friday, 19 August 2016 10:48 AM EMAIL

Re. 15007 by Odd : If you want to find kinky partners for fetish games, I would recommend BDSMdater.com. Have had some great success there finding willing chicks into various things.

SPAM! The link takes you to a website with a BDSM look and when you click Join for free it takes you to a vanilla dating site where you also have to buy credits to get in contact with members that are probably completely fake like on most of these sites.

Friday, 19 August 2016 06:07 PM EMAIL

We're getting closer and closer to the release of JUSTINE. We're only days away from the official announcement. There's a lot of anticipation, that's for sure, Waylon proclaims Closer to release!!! Bea?????? while at the Crux Foundation, IgnikaMarcus comments Glad to know Justine is being released soon. The crux scene has me anxious to buy and watch it. I know that in the next few hours the final sound mix will be done, the English close captions are done, German and Spanish subtitles will be ready soon, and so on. While we wait, the powers above had decreed that we have an END OF SUMMER SALE! 35% OFF if you buy two or more of our movies. This new sale will be over when we announce the date of release of JUSTINE!

Bill K. Margot said "She was suspended for a very long time, her arms stretched out, her feet without any support. You can see the full video in Training Jane. If she weren't so busy, I would ask her how she felt that day." Thank you Margot but it did look like from your posted picture that Amy was able to grip the rope or strap with her hands so the effects on her wrists that JD was talking about was not the same. Of course it was still brutal torture on the wrists for sure.

I believe it's natural for anyone who is tied by the wrists to attempt to release some of the tension by grabbing the tightening ropes, either AOH or arms spread cross like. However, the stress, pain, discomfort concentrates elsewhere and there's no way of finding relief. The shoulders feel like they want to break apart, the chest cavity feels like it's crushing the lungs in, breathing is an ordeal, and much more. And if, at the same time, the whip falls on the naked body, over and over, that is just torture.

Eulalia, An especially interesting news post, Margot, thanks. I always find the thoughts, feelings, fantasies and experiences of the girls who play these demanding parts fascinating. The reflections on different ways of being suspended links with several discussions that have come up on the Forums, and what you report of what the girls say matches my own limited experience pretty closely - hanging with arms spread and no (foot or crotch) support is worst of all. And the way they balance their own rich fantasy-lives with very focused, professional acting (of and for other people's - men's - fantasies) is very interesting.

A girl might start with a dash of curiosity, or she might start as a way of fulfilling a fantasy, she might even start to gain favors not easily accessible. She becomes the center of attention, she might enjoy it, get excited, it might be a thrill at times. In time she might lose that part which made it possible for her to go through all those painful ordeals, all that whipping, canning, spanking, crucifying, racking... At one point the experience might lose the charming part. The experience itself might become harder and harder to bear. Or maybe not. After years of going through torture, one might want not to continue. Or maybe not. Camille gave her all for a long time, a few years, the day came when she decided she had enough, not in a bad way. So, when she felt that she had enough she made Martyr or The Death of St Eulalia, where Camille wants to suffer the tortures of St Eulalia as realistically as possible. The fulfilling of a fantasy for that character, perhaps. Perhaps not. For Carmen, the actress, it was her final ordeal, after those last days of being crucified on two different crosses, she called it quits, directing her career elsewhere. She's still involved in film and theatre, as an actress, producer and film editor, in France. She did say that maybe she would do another film sometime in the future, but that possibility is less and less probable.

In the case of Amy, she started with Jac way back in 2006, that's when the training video was made, at the beginning of 2006. Since then she made lots of movies where she suffered and suffered, that last of which is JUSTINE. She might be reaching the time when she will no longer want to be the long suffering victim. A girl might want to say, enough of this shit, and quit. It is hard, really. No only for the girl, the boy too. The boy might feel terrible after inflicting pain over and over again, particularly when the actress is so good that he can't really know if the pain his victim is expressing is that real or not.

In the next days, weeks, a lot will be happening. We'll have the release of JUSTINE, Jac and Amy will prepare the release of Pygmalion, a casting call has been made so Jac will be interviewing and testing a number of people for future projects and finally the decision will be made as to which project will start production next. Will it be Maleficarum II? Or maybe Aventura? Or maybe Dead But Dreaming 2? Or something else all together? There are all these projects lined up, some farther in the pre production than others, but there are all those little details that make a difference. For Olalla was finding the house, for Maleficarum was the sudden cash contribution, for JUSTINE was the campaign to raise the funds... Well, if someone appears our of nowhere with some cash for a cool scene... well, that can make things go one way or another.

All those whip marks there are the real thing, really. Amy got a good whipping those three days for this scene, which had some good backing, by the way. The writer that did that wonderful review of both Dead But Dreaming and Olalla, is now concentrating his pen on discussing Jac's work. It is a good read. HERE: Part One A Working Relationship.

Take advantage of our END OF SUMMER SALE! 35% OFF if you buy two or more of our movies.

15013) johnsmart

Saturday, 20 August 2016 08:08 AM

It looks like we need to get ready for a war on and I know that it comes up every so often but now it looks like things might be getting serious.

[fightthenewdrug.org]

15014) Covers the Relentless

Saturday, 20 August 2016 11:28 AM

New Man Feb 1966 V4 No1

15015) Ralphus

Saturday, 20 August 2016 12:20 PM EMAIL

johnsmart: Yeah, I read that story on Facebook last night and checked out the website that produced the video. Not really a war on , more like a propaganda message by the opposing side to see if people react. That organization is probably all giving themselves a collective high five to have signed up probably the most famous rape victim in the world so they can use her to preach about the evils of .

"Pornography made my living hell worse"...Elizabeth Smart. Yeah, they can put that in all their advertising now.

Don't get me wrong on Elizabeth Smart. I followed her story from the very beginning, and she's a beautiful and courageous young woman who's really turned her life around and turned a negative thing into a positive one. But she's also incredibly naive if she thinks has anything to do with her being abducted. "It just led to him raping me more," yeah, right. Porn is there to satisfy ual desire, it's not the cause of it. Know what the number one cause of rape is? RAPISTS! Don't go after , go after people who rape.

It's this kind of backwards thinking that will only inspire the ignorant masses, but it's not going to work on most people. This is the age of the Internet. Porn is everywhere and it's commonplace. A lot of people view , both men and women. And very few of us will go out and rape people as the result.

Yes, she was a victim of a terrible crime. And yes, she can claim that led to an increase in assaults on her. But she's still an idiot for making the bad guy.

[embedded content]

Saturday, 20 August 2016 01:22 PM EMAIL

Hey GIMP friends!

Fist of all, FUCK the 'War on Porn!!' Now that that's out of the way....

I hope that you guys enjoyed the latest update to the Bunny Bound site yesterday and the special announcement!

By the way, if you checked in early Friday, the update image was changed as it didn't show a shot of Bunny being bound OR tortured...now it does, so feel free to check back..

For those of you who are unfamiliar with Patreon, the thing I'm wanting to do is this : For as little as $1 given to the campaign, you will be part of the decision making, involved in seeing what happens to Bunny on a regular basis...this is basically a chance to 'write' your own perils/tortures/outcome of what happens to this victim!I hope that at least a few of you will come aboard and help me make life a living hell for Bunny from head to toe!

In other news, I'm working on a new BRUTAL inquisition/medieval story that will be a bit darker than the Bunny stories you've come to love and enjoy! I've posted a cropped scene of the type of style I'm going for with this story and it will be quite an unhappy ordeal for the big titted one! It will include virtually every torture used in that period, plus some made especially for Bunny in an attempt to break her...It will end with a public torture display, and burning at the stake.

There will be some great 'cosplay' stories coming up on the Bunny Bound site too, for those of you into THAT!

Please check out the Bunny Patreon and think about how cool it will be to have me draw Bunny for you!

Have a great weekend!

15017) Bill K.

Saturday, 20 August 2016 03:29 PM

"War On Porn": To me is just pictures of naked women. Which wouldn't ually excite a true rapist any more than a normal, moral, god-believing man would.

Now this site with its graphic gimp pictures and stories is a totally different animal. True rapists sadly I believe would gravitate to this site because of the violent rape pictures and stories and movies.

Violence against women or children is the real issue and that's what happened to Elizabeth Smart.

She should be championing causes against violence of women and children and not . Bill K.

15018) T

Saturday, 20 August 2016 03:40 PM EMAIL

Personally speaking, Elizabeth Smart is having an understandable emotional knee-jerk reaction brought on by her nightmarish and traumatic experience. She credits her strong Mormon faith for helping her to survive, and The Mormon Church has always led a crusade against ... So, it doesn't take much imagination to see what's going on here.

[www.lds.org]

By contrast, I've looked at since I was way too young for it, and I grew up to help and advocate for rape victims. Several of my closest friends were raped, and I despise the bastards who did it.

And then, we have The Duggar Family (Baptists) who were ultra-puritanical about this stuff; and they raised this: [en.wikipedia.org]

But I digress. This and similar crusades have tried and failed before, and they will try and fail yet again: [youtu.be]

But what do I know? Maybe nobody has free will and The Devil is responsible for everything bad people do?

15019) kailer

Saturday, 20 August 2016 04:40 PM

Does anyone have this scene series Login name ?, this scene occurred last Thursday, for more information is a Mexican series of the telehit channel owned by Televisa, they are grateful.

15020) Badger

Saturday, 20 August 2016 06:17 PM

I certainly cannot fault Elizabeth Smart for her beliefs (which is what they are -- beliefs) that caused the awful things that happened to her. Who am I to judge her? She seems to believe that this guy would have been a nice guy except for . I would certainly not try to convince her otherwise. That she cannot see that may instead be a release for some -- who might act out what would otherwise be a safe fantasy. In a way, it's like blaming weed whenever someone who does a bad thing is found to have THC in their bloodstream. So it goes.

15021) A Canadian

Saturday, 20 August 2016 07:44 PM

For what it's worth, Elizabeth Smart's comments are getting some mileage. The story has been picked up in my local tab, The Toronto Sun.

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Breakdown of international trade

German banking crisis of 1931 and British crisis

Turning point and recovery

Role of women and household economics

World War II and recovery

Effects

Australia

Canada

Chile

China

European African colonies

France

Germany

Greece

Iceland

India

Ireland

Italy

Japan

Latin America

Netherlands

New Zealand

Portugal

Puerto Rico

South Africa

Soviet Union

Spain

Sweden

Thailand

United Kingdom

United States

Literature

Naming

Other "great depressions"

Comparison with the Great Recession

See also

References

Further reading

Contemporary

External links

The Great Wall 2016

Can the Great Tribulation start this year? Can the Great Tribulation begin in 2019? Can the Great Tribulation begin in 2020? Can the Great Tribulation begin in 2021?

Adar II 29 - Rosh Chodesh Aviv (Nisan)
Friday-Saturday April 5-6 2019

Aviv (Nisan) 10 (10 days later)
Sunday-Monday April 14-15 2019